How Difficult Is It To Match To Radiology?

[Radsinthefuture]

Do lots of people go unmatched? Do many people get their second/back up when applying during carms? Do you have to be a superstar to match?

I could write up a long winded post but want to keep it simple. I love radiology from what I have experienced so far but am also terrified of going unmatched as I am on the older side. Location does not matter to me.

My main worry is the following - lots of people tell me that radiology applicants should NOT back up with anything else and go full on rads. 

Any help/wisdom/insight appreciated

[schmitty]

Radiology has historically been moderately competitive. This most recent match, it dropped a LOT in competitiveness, to the point that there were actually quite a few (for radiology) spots left for round 2 (albeit in less competitive locations, like Manitoba). Individual sites like Toronto, BC, alberta, etc continue to be competitive, but if you love radiology and apply broadly (e.g. I will be applying to all English rads programs except McGill) you have a very good chance of matching in to the field. That is assuming your application/CV shows interest in radiology, you aren't a potato in interviews and not academic/professional red flags. 

 

Who told you you shouldn't back up? If you have another specialty (usually one that is not terribly competitive, like family) that you would be happy doing as well, then of course you can back up. Radiology more than some other fields encourages electives and experiences outside of the field, so they won't care if you don't do all or even most of your electives in rads, and they don't know you are backing up. That said, I do not plan on backing up, but that is simply because I would rather go unmatched (which I think, hope, is unlikely given how broadly I am applying) than be unhappy in a different field.

[Lactic Folly]

I think it's perfectly fine to have a backup plan, as long as it doesn't look like you're using radiology as the backup

[Radsinthefuture]

Thanks guys, appreciate the advice a lot.

 

R

[LittleDaisy]

Out of curiosity, what do you mean by professional red flags???

 

Radiology has historically been moderately competitive. This most recent match, it dropped a LOT in competitiveness, to the point that there were actually quite a few (for radiology) spots left for round 2 (albeit in less competitive locations, like Manitoba). Individual sites like Toronto, BC, alberta, etc continue to be competitive, but if you love radiology and apply broadly (e.g. I will be applying to all English rads programs except McGill) you have a very good chance of matching in to the field. That is assuming your application/CV shows interest in radiology, you aren't a potato in interviews and not academic/professional red flags. 

 

Who told you you shouldn't back up? If you have another specialty (usually one that is not terribly competitive, like family) that you would be happy doing as well, then of course you can back up. Radiology more than some other fields encourages electives and experiences outside of the field, so they won't care if you don't do all or even most of your electives in rads, and they don't know you are backing up. That said, I do not plan on backing up, but that is simply because I would rather go unmatched (which I think, hope, is unlikely given how broadly I am applying) than be unhappy in a different field.

[Radsinthefuture]

Out of curiosity, what do you mean by professional red flags???

From my limited knowledge -

 

I know an individual who during surgery electives in fourth year acted "smarter" and a bit arrogant to the residents/attendings. A friend who later matched to the program was talking to the residents and they brought up how they told their superiors that the particular individual was acting very unprofessional. The topic came up because they both graduated from the same school. I think you could also have a professional red flag if you are repeatedly incompetent at the tasks you are assigned.

 

Everyone in the program confirmed they did not like his attitude, and such was blacklisted from there particular program. He would not have been allowed entry no matter what.

 

I don't think its a very common thing at all to happen

[LittleDaisy]

Ohh that would have shown in his evaluations anyway so...

Always be humble and make your residents look good!

From my limited knowledge -

I know an individual who during surgery electives in fourth year acted "smarter" and a bit arrogant to the residents/attendings. A friend who later matched to the program was talking to the residents and they brought up how they told their superiors that the particular individual was acting very unprofessional. The topic came up because they both graduated from the same school. I think you could also have a professional red flag if you are repeatedly incompetent at the tasks you are assigned.

Everyone in the program confirmed they did not like his attitude, and such was blacklisted from there particular program. He would not have been allowed entry no matter what.

I don't think its a very common thing at all to happen

[Lactic Folly]

Thanks guys, appreciate the advice a lot. As I am still a bit of a newbie, is backing up with internal medicine possible? I see myself happy in radiology and internal medicine, not likely to be as happy in pathology or family med. I have lots of exposure to these fields so I feel pretty justified in saying that.

 

Is backing up with internal medicine a feasible choice or is it just a waste? I've come to realize I would rather take a different specialty if possible then to sit out a year simply due to other commitments in my life

 

 

R

I have seen it done successfully. I can't really speak much more as to how to approach the internal medicine side of things though.

[thestar10]

Out of curiosity, what do you mean by professional red flags???

 

Professionalism/red flags are things like unprofessional behaviour (breaking confidentiality disregarding your responsobilities, lying, cheating etc) and the academic red flags are things like failing a course/year etc.

[sangria]

On the topic of backing up and choosing electives: without rehashing the thread on Robert Chu in the General page and going into the positives and negatives of carms, can we discuss what happened in his first application to radiology? The Toronto Star article suggested that it was his elective selection that was "too broad". Past threads here have indicated that PDs want to see a range of electives. So, for my own understanding, what is too broad? Is that another way of suggesting he was backing up? 

[W0lfgang]

My interpretation is that he did not dedicate enough electives to radiology. You need to prove that you're committed. It's unfortunate for those who decide on radiology late in the game, but that's the nature of the beast.

[Applemanv3]

I stuck to my guns and did what made me most confident and happy. I did broad electives (not just radiology) and I applied to both rads and a few FM programs. My take was to be myself, do what I felt was right, and match to where I felt I should based on my ranking (which is weighted towards the CARMS applicant). Doing my part was enough for me and I did not stop and stress about the competitiveness or suggested routes.

That said, I had no rads interviews anywhere west of ON (edit: did not do any outside of ON electives). I was fine with that as I felt my chances were good enough and I did not want to be outside of ON anyway. 

There's too much randomness to not follow your heart/guts in this process. If you think backing up or applying to more than one program is what you want for any reason, do it. It's nothing to overthink. Just be a true candidate for each program and interview.

[W0lfgang]

How many rads electives did you do appleman?

[Applemanv3]

Did 1 before clerkship (2 weeks, didn't count for much). Did 1 at home school, 2x2 weeks each at two other ON schools. Also did rads research elective. None outside ON. Got 1 interview outside ON. 

 

Didnt matter much - wanted a single school the most. Matched there. 

[W0lfgang]

So you did 4, arguably 5. that's a good number of electives. I did 5 as well. Robert Chu may not have done that many, or even close to it. My point is that rads gunners need to do a certain number of rads electives to be convincing on paper. With 4 or 5 rads electives, there is still lots of room to dabble into other specialties. 

[Applemanv3]

On 2017-07-28 at 11:11 PM, W0lfgang said:

So you did 4, arguably 5. that's a good number of electives. I did 5 as well. Robert Chu may not have done that many, or even close to it. My point is that rads gunners need to do a certain number of rads electives to be convincing on paper. With 4 or 5 rads electives, there is still lots of room to dabble into other specialties. 

Valid point. It is an unwritten fine balance which varies year-to-year but the general theme of showing interest is important.