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Ostracized

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  1. A MSc got me into UofT with a 3.5 cumulative undergrad GPA. But that was 10-11 years ago. My masters was 2 year research.
  2. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    I work with an older dentist who will not work forever. I have no plan of buying the practice. I couldn’t make it work financially. Although he has no plan to retire right now, eventually he will have to.
  3. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    I actually really love the job of being a dentist. I’m not going to say that it’s the best job out there but I very rarely dread going to work. My main stress with this career is financial. And I’m not that even bad off right now. It’s the future that scares me. I was born and raised in Toronto and I’ve started my own family here and (perhaps against my better judgement) recently bought a home here. I have a pretty good job situation right now (as far as Toronto is concerned). My income isn’t sky high but it is sufficient. But this job will eventually end. Perhaps in 10 years or perhaps in a month. I am very certain at that point that I will not be able to find a similar level of income within a reasonable commute from my house. Then we’ll have to sell the house and move (likely far away). Also, having just finished a tax return I decided to look at my income history. I’m 6.5 years out of school. My income peaked in my second year and has dropped by about 2-3% per year since then. This is not itself a disaster but it’s moving in the wrong direction and indicative of the current reality.
  4. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    Somewhere in the range of $0 to $200,000. Sorry that’s a big range but that’s all I can say.
  5. Ostracized

    Need Help/Advice

    You’re in third year or second? Either way I definitely would not quit. Even if you’re behind the curve, you’ll catch up. If you do something for thousands and thousand of hours you’ll become competent. Maybe consider a good GPR after graduation. One with lots of clinical experience.
  6. Ostracized

    Advice about school abroad

    What does your mom have to say about this? Does she own a clinic with a job lined up for you? Can she give you a prediction of your income? I was at a meeting the other day with a crowd of mostly older dentists. Guys nearing retirement now. There was a lot of reminiscing along the lines of ‘my total four years of tuition cost $5500 and I made $100,000 in my first year’ (about $300,000 in today’s money). People will judge our profession on the results of that generation, most of whom did very very well These guys had an income to debt ratio that was ~50+ times higher than new grads today
  7. Ostracized

    First year masters

    Best to call their admissions and ask. I did my masters (at UWO) prior to dental school and I recall that I couldn’t even apply while I was still enrolled in my masters. My admission to UofT was contingent on defending my thesis.
  8. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    Well, it was with the NDEB so maybe not unexpected.
  9. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    I applied for a job this week and was told that there were 175 other applicants.
  10. I never joined the military but I believe you start in the $130-140k range and after some promotions can get in the high $1XX,000 range. The pay is competitive in itself, but the really good deal is if you sign on in first year dental school. Then you get all your tuition paid, a very decent salary while in school (I think in the range of $70,000) and some other bonuses. Signing up in first year is like getting a $400,000 sign up bonus.
  11. I do occasional work in remote northern Ontario on a salaried basis. The money is good for me as an associate working in Toronto full time, but for others it wouldn't be seen as that high. Mostly I enjoy the work and find it rewarding. Now, regarding a new grad associate making $300K+ in northern Canada? I'm a bit skeptical though I won't go so far as to say it is impossible. I know that, even under ideal circumstance (very high patient load) I probably would max out at $250,000. And no, I don't earn that much. That's just what I would consider my ideal income under normal circumstances. Now, I could perhaps earn more than that, but there would have to be some combination of: -High procedure fees -Longer than 40 hours per week -An above average (>40%) cut of production. In order to earn $400,000 I'd need to bill $4000 per day, 5 days a week, 50 weeks a year. I'd be surprised if I billed more than $4000 even once or twice a year!
  12. The US has been raising their rates as well so I wouldn’t expect CDN to skyrocket.
  13. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    Well that’s a slight exaggeration but it’s true that many Canadian school are severely lacking in clinical experience. And that’s a separate but related issue. After you graduate you NEED a year or two (or more!) of clinical learning before you are really a capable dentist. That means you need a) a good mentor to help you when you get stuck and b) lots of patients to practice on. I’m 6 years out of school and I’m still learning all the time and still finding knowledge gaps more than I’d want to admit. So another concern for new grads in our increasingly cut-throat system is lack of clinical growth, on top of financial concerns.
  14. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    It’s hard for me to give advice on this matter with great confidence because I am only one dentist, working in a terrible geographic location. Although I keep as well informed as I can, most of what I can convey at an individual level is anecdotal (either of myself or colleagues). I’m hesitant to recommend dentistry even at the prices that are being charged for tuition by all but perhaps the least expensive Canadian schools. Why? Because if you have the aptitude to gain admission to a Canadian dental school, you have the aptitude to consider other careers with comparable lifetime earnings (adjusted for student debt) and far lower financial risk. Anyway I’m a pessimist. I’m sure there are younger dentists still making bank in this country, even in saturated areas. I myself am doing fairly well, and I probably earn more than most or all of my friends (with the exception perhaps of some lawyers). But I work 5+ days a week and my time off is spent working in northern Canada a couple weeks at a time. Boy, I’d love to get ‘paid vacation’ some day!
  15. Ostracized

    The slow decay of dentistry

    Australia was smart when it came to this dental school equivalency. They opened up dozens of spots in each school (perhaps 100-200 spots per year across the country) for Canadian students. Most of whom will return to Canada after. How many Australian students are studying dentistry in Canada? I’d be really surprised if there were even 5 students each year. We got played.
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