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bruh last won the day on April 17

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  1. Thank you. So, is that master’s embedded in the 6 year residency, or would it be 6 + 1? The reason I’m asking is because I see most programs indicate one year is dedicated to “academic enrichment” so I don’t know if that means it’s meant to give you a grad degree or not. Your third point is the one that stands out the most to me actually. All of the cardiac surgeons I know completed 8-10 year residencies with masters or PhD and fellowships. I have a hard time seeing myself being satisfied in that predicament. I would literally be 40 by that time LOL. I find cardiac surgery incredibly fascinating but I also feel like I just want to get the residency done so I can do surgery instead of years of research. If I could do it in 6-7 years I would be more inclined, but I fear that it’s not the right “fit” for me if I have that mentality. I don’t know if that makes sense. I guess one thing I want to mention is I am open, and in fact considering working in the US either way. I have always been very open to relocating and embrace it actually. This is why I feel like maybe it would be possible to do CS residency in 6-7 years and get a job after? It sounds very wishful, I know. But if that’s a possibility, I might be okay with it. Also, it’s not like other surgical residencies are forgiving. Ortho residents do multiple fellowships and end up with 6-8 years - same with NSx, plastics, and GenSx. Too early to tell right now, but one thing I am sure about is I am going into surgery. I just don’t want 10+ years of residency.
  2. I have a couple of questions regarding cardiac surgery residency. It seems that research is a part of most cardiac surgery residencies, but I can’t tell if this is because it’s expected by the program or the interest of the resident themselves. Is it pretty much required to complete a masters or PhD in residency? My 2nd question is: how long is a CS residency with a masters? PhD? I’m looking into the specialty, but it is already the longest residency at 6 years and with the implied expectation of doing either a masters or PhD, that sounds like a 7-9 year residency, possibly longer with fellowships. I’d really appreciate some insight.
  3. Just wanted to update y’all that I got myself a brand new V8 sports car. Won’t disclose what exactly but It’s fast and loud Thank you all for the input. I’m so happy with the decision I made. I’m going to be conservative with rent and other expenses in med, but I just had to get this whip.
  4. I appreciate all your comments. So cool to see on MedSIS all these different specialties offering shadowing opportunities! Honestly, I think not being able to shadow in the fall won't be a huge detriment. Would we be able to shadow at other hospitals too? I only see the affiliated hospitals on MedSIS. I was wondering if one is able to shadow surgeons in non-academic, small-town settings, for example.
  5. Thank you for the clarification on anatomy. As an incoming student I don’t even know the difference between prosections or dissections, so I just assumed it was all in-person, but it seems like the more fun stuff will be online, unfortunately. With that said, there is still opportunity for on campus presence quite often (2-4 times every week) and the vast majority of students are moving to Toronto and want to attend as much in-person activities as possible. I think only a select few have opted to stay in different time-zones. Shadowing is “to be refrained from” for now but based on the email we got it’s not set in stone whether it will be disallowed for the entirety of Fall, unless a different message has been relayed to the upper years. “It depends on public health regulations, capacity at the hospitals and community clinics (in terms of learners and PPE), and the ability for the physician to take on more learners while protecting your health and safety. When capacity allows, it is possible that some physicians will accept Foundations students to join them in person or at a virtual clinic. At the moment we are asking that students refrain from any shadowing opportunities both virtually and in person”.
  6. UofT is actually offering a lot of in-person opportunities. Only CBL and clinical skills are online. Lectures and anatomy labs are in-person but not mandatory to attend. Our schedule has in-person stuff almost every day. Shadowing is still up in the air, and events/club interests are probably going to be online. This is all for the fall term. Winter is to be decided later on. It’s not ideal but I’m grateful that UofT is doing as much in-person as they could. EDIT: I should note that there is a 50-person cap on lecture attendance so I have no idea how that’s actually gonna work lol
  7. The guidelines are quite broad so every school is doing their own thing. Lectures and Anatomy labs are in-person at UofT (in-person is optional). But I'm looking at my schedule and there are in-person stuff about 3 times every week. Clinical skills and CBL are online until at least January.
  8. I’m trying to figure out how much plastic surgeons actually make and it seems like it’s an enigma lol. If they are among the top, they should be billing around a million but I can’t find a source to back that up.
  9. $460K national average ($710K in AB!) According to this: And $443K according to the CIHI: https://www.cihi.ca/sites/default/files/document/physicians-in-canada-2018.pdf the only source I know of is 32% overhead based on CMA: https://www.cma.ca/sites/default/files/2019-01/otolaryngology-e.pdf#page10 hopefully someone with more info can chime in. EDIT: found this 2012 study on Ontario physicians. Overhead is 32% here for ENT as well:
  10. Hey, @jnuts. I know I’m bumping an old thread but I was wondering for how long would a Canadian trained ortho (who did fellowship in the US) be stuck in an academic job in the US? Is it until they are a full citizen, green card, certain # of years?
  11. Oh I am definitely NOT saying that all FM docs wake up hating their job! I am sure many FM docs are very happy and satisfied! The stats I posted show more than half of FM docs are happy with their work and their work/life balance. If you enjoy FM, then there is a very very strong case to be made for you to pursue it. I’ll agree that if you like both FM and surgery, then sway towards FM because of all the things you have mentioned. But if you do not enjoy the work of a family physician (I know many who are in this category) don’t go into the field - regardless of what perks it offers.
  12. If you woke up every day knowing you literally hate what you do for a living, would you still do it just because it offers good money and lifestyle? There is a lot more to life than making good money and having home/work balance. At the end of your life, you want to be happy knowing you did things in your life that you actually enjoyed and had a passion for. Going into FM won't necessarily bring you happiness or satisfaction in life or work. In fact, FM never ranks at the top in terms of happiness or self-esteem at or outside work. According to the CMA, more general surgeons are satisfied with the work/life balance AND their professional life, compared to family physicians. Also more FM docs are dissatisfied with their work/life balance AND their professional life, compared to general surgeons. Now, I'm not saying you should go into surgery to be happier, I'm just saying there is more to life than money and length of training. FM: https://www.cma.ca/sites/default/files/2019-01/family-e.pdf General Surgery https://www.cma.ca/sites/default/files/2019-01/general-surgery-e.pdf Medscape data for the US https://www.medscape.com/slideshow/2019-lifestyle-happiness-6011057#3
  13. That's a good point. Thank you for the clarification. Since taxes are standardized based on income, it's pretty easy to say how much each person will be taxed based on their salary, but overhead is a whole different topic that some professions don't even deal with. That variability makes it difficult to grasp a true understanding of a doctor's pay when compared to other professions. My point regarding after-tax income stands, however. So I think the discussion should be more geared towards overhead rather than taxes. In essence, a doctor's pay after overhead can be fairly compared to an engineer's pay who doesn't have overhead. But having that discussion is obviously a difficult one as @rmorelan mentioned. Well, respectfully, I still don't think your comparison is fair. You are comparing an NP making 125K pre-tax with a doctor making $190K after-tax. Second, you are comparing an NP in AB to a non-AB doctor. Average FM salary in AB is around $360K (gross). Also, an NP must have gone through additional years of schooling and experience. I'm not totally familiar with the path but you have to have a minimum of 2 years of experience as an RN and have a graduate degree to become an NP. When we look at academia, professors go through 4 years of Bachelors + 2 years of Masters + 5 years of PhD and sometimes Post-doc. Also, doctors are still paid as residents. In fact, the 60-80K residents are paid is comparable to how much PhD students and RNs are paid. I'm not trying to say doctors are overpaid, I just think that people really really want to downplay how much doctors make and make it seem like other professions are totally on-par. But the comparisons are never truly "fair". Even when speaking about med school fees, people say it costs about $200K to go to med school. Well, $100K of that is rent/other expenses which is what you pay for whether you went to med school or not. The other 100K is tuition, and I'm personally finding that more than half of that is paid for by school bursaries and OSAP grants. The average UofT med student gets about 10K of bursaries and 6K of OSAP grants, every year.
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