Rad Onc + Internal Med

[011235813]

Realized I would be equally happy as a Radiation Oncologist and Medical Oncologist. Yes, I know how different they are, but I genuinely enjoy both. (I did pre-clerkship electives in both and really enjoyed them, and both could fit equally with my research interests: Goal being Clinician Scientist through a CIP training program, heavily involved in research for a while, no MSc or PhD, but several published papers, most in Cancer related cell biology)

Current strategy: (Only 5 preCARMS elective spots: 3 Radiation Oncology, 2 Internal (thinking 1 CTU, 1 Medical oncology/Hematology)

Thoughts, ideas, tell me I'm an idiot?

Thanks in advance.

[ploughboy]

Med onc.  Way more mobile, and can practice GIM if need be.    And when you reply "I'm going to strictly be an academic oncologist and don't need a GIM ticket", I'm going to say "things change, sometimes suddenly and unexpectedly, and this is a good hedge against future uncertainty".

Cheers.

[thestar10]

med onc is ++more mobile for jobs. They have more hospitals to get hired at. That being said they are different. Rad Oncs actually look at imaging and are much much more technical. Med onc is equally evidenced based but much less technical.

In ON, rad oncs make significantly more than med oncs

I agree it is possible to be happy in both

re: your match strategy. you will likely need more internal to be competitive (gotta match to IM first) 2 rad onc and 3 medicine/subspecialty probably slightly higher yield.

[011235813]

On 1/30/2019 at 10:22 PM, thestar10 said:

med onc is ++more mobile for jobs. They have more hospitals to get hired at. That being said they are different. Rad Oncs actually look at imaging and are much much more technical. Med onc is equally evidenced based but much less technical.

In ON, rad oncs make significantly more than med oncs

I agree it is possible to be happy in both

re: your match strategy. you will likely need more internal to be competitive (gotta match to IM first) 2 rad onc and 3 medicine/subspecialty probably slightly higher yield.

Thanks a ton and to the previous poster as well.

Only thing is that Internal med, people match with even 0 electives. Most last cycle did 3+ electives for Rad Onc. Do you think it would still be doable to match to Rad Onc with only two electives?

Data per CARMS electives data on that site.

 

[dk3what]

1 hour ago, John Galt MD said:

Thanks a ton and to the previous poster as well.

Only thing is that Internal med, people match with even 0 electives. Most last cycle did 3+ electives for Rad Onc. Do you think it would still be doable to match to Rad Onc with only two electives?

Data per CARMS electives data on that site.

 

How many electives do you have total? When reviewing your application, programs don't discriminate preCARMs vs postCARMs electives. The main difference to you is preCARMS electives give you the opportunity to ask for reference letters but other than that, it does not matter. 

[JohnGrisham]

11 hours ago, John Galt MD said:

Thanks a ton and to the previous poster as well.

Only thing is that Internal med, people match with even 0 electives. Most last cycle did 3+ electives for Rad Onc. Do you think it would still be doable to match to Rad Onc with only two electives?

Data per CARMS electives data on that site.

 

Not so sure its that often unless you're in geographically less desirable areas to match internal without some internal based electives..especially MTU/CTU

[thestar10]

13 hours ago, John Galt MD said:

Thanks a ton and to the previous poster as well.

Only thing is that Internal med, people match with even 0 electives. Most last cycle did 3+ electives for Rad Onc. Do you think it would still be doable to match to Rad Onc with only two electives?

Data per CARMS electives data on that site.

 

People do not match to their top (or even mid) internal programs without doing a single elective. 

 I would look at the past 10 years of carms data you'll see that it's historically been quite uncompetitive(radonc). 

Yes. People match to Rad Onc with less than half of their electives in it.

It is better to be a great applicant in 1 specialty than an average applicant in 2.  I know McMaster doesn't give you a lot of time to choose but  Choosing does make your life significantly easier.

 

[PurpleS]

Some IM subspecialties are also more difficult to get letters from - med onc being one of them. I agree that IM in desirable locations can be very competitive. It's similar to some FM programs in that sense.

I would also make sure you truly enjoy GIM before committing to IM. There's no guarantees about how the CaRMS subspecialty match might go in the upcoming years and you might be miserable doing GIM if you don't match to med onc.

[011235813]

OK, so let's say I decided I was all in for Radiation Oncology. Would I then ONLY do Radiation Oncology Pre-CARMS electives? I could also throw in a Palliative Care elective to help with that if necessary? (Note I currently Have two Radiation Oncology elective booked out of my 5 pre carms electives.)

Thanks in advance!

[PurpleS]

17 hours ago, John Galt MD said:

OK, so let's say I decided I was all in for Radiation Oncology. Would I then ONLY do Radiation Oncology Pre-CARMS electives? I could also throw in a Palliative Care elective to help with that if necessary? (Note I currently Have two Radiation Oncology elective booked out of my 5 pre carms electives.)

Thanks in advance!

I'm not familiar with rad onc but you can take a look at the program descriptions on CaRMS and see what other rotations their residents have to do (med onc, surgical onc, radiology, palliative care etc.) in later years to get an idea of what other electives may be complementary.

[ChemPetE]

2 RO electives is fine. 3 is great. Any research experience in oncology that you can muster would be excellent. Reach out to your local RO program director and ask them directly what they’re looking for in a potential applicant. Palliative elective is a great experience no matter what field of clinical medicine you go into. Personally matched RO with 2 electives many years back.

[011235813]

44 minutes ago, ChemPetE said:

2 RO electives is fine. 3 is great. Any research experience in oncology that you can muster would be excellent. Reach out to your local RO program director and ask them directly what they’re looking for in a potential applicant. Palliative elective is a great experience no matter what field of clinical medicine you go into. Personally matched RO with 2 electives many years back.

Thanks a lot! I have a lot of oncology related research, multiple publications from before med school, several in progress that I'm hoping to publish before CARMS. Will VERY likely be at least submitted for publication before CARMS.

The other field I'm considering is Medical Genetics, which I currently have an elective booked in. Basically, I saw a few patients in miscellaneous clerkship rotations that had interesting genetic conditions and I ended up REALLY enjoying those experiences extensively. (I also have an serious interest in both molecular genetics and cell biology {Planning on doing a CIP with a PhD in either Genetics or Cell Biology}, so it fits pretty well for me). Will my doing 1 or 2 electives in Medical Genetics look like I'm not serious about radiation oncology? After considering the points made by previous posters, I'm actually thinking less about Internal (would NOT enjoy GIM at all) and more about Radiation Oncology. I don't want to JUST apply to Radiation Oncology as there aren't that many spots, and I really would want to apply to at least one other specialty, and I honestly could see myself enjoying Medical Genetics. I want to see patients, so I'm not really considering pathology (not that I don't enjoy pathology, just no patient contact for the most part).

[ChemPetE]

Nah. We refer consults to them from time to time for people with potential or suspected cancer syndromes, so there is overlap. I don’t know much about MG otherwise other than one lady in my class went into it and seems to be enjoying it. Probably laid back, with an academic component so research experience/skills would serve you well in both.

[thestar10]

9 hours ago, John Galt MD said:

Thanks a lot! I have a lot of oncology related research, multiple publications from before med school, several in progress that I'm hoping to publish before CARMS. Will VERY likely be at least submitted for publication before CARMS.

The other field I'm considering is Medical Genetics, which I currently have an elective booked in. Basically, I saw a few patients in miscellaneous clerkship rotations that had interesting genetic conditions and I ended up REALLY enjoying those experiences extensively. (I also have an serious interest in both molecular genetics and cell biology {Planning on doing a CIP with a PhD in either Genetics or Cell Biology}, so it fits pretty well for me). Will my doing 1 or 2 electives in Medical Genetics look like I'm not serious about radiation oncology? After considering the points made by previous posters, I'm actually thinking less about Internal (would NOT enjoy GIM at all) and more about Radiation Oncology. I don't want to JUST apply to Radiation Oncology as there aren't that many spots, and I really would want to apply to at least one other specialty, and I honestly could see myself enjoying Medical Genetics. I want to see patients, so I'm not really considering pathology (not that I don't enjoy pathology, just no patient contact for the most part).

no. you will be fine. one of my co-residents backed up with med genetics and did fine. Both are not terribly competitive although. In general, I find that radiation oncologists are decently understanding of having diverse interests.

 I see you go to Mac, I would recommend doing elective during your vacation in the summer to give you six electives.

Feel free to private message me. I am an RO resident who went to Mac.