Give up on the dream?

[weekendwarriors87]

Well here it is, another premed looking for some kind of advice on what to do from here. I have always considered medicine my only option, it is what I have always wanted to do, but I am unsure as to how to improve my chances for a reapplication so I am looking for some advice.

 

Here are my specs:

GPA 1: 3.42

GPA 2: 3.35

GPA 3: 3.77

GPA 4: 3.88

I graduated with this, then did 2 extra years of "non degree" to complete english prereq for Wayne State and took some classes that interested me since from what I understood these did not impact my GPA.

 

MCAT: 127/128/131/130/516

 

ECs: lots and lots, varied, medical and non medical, long term and short term, job experience and volunteer. I have everything from the classic research and hospital to having 7 years in Cadets, 2 pilots licence, currently restoring a 23 year old land rover from the ground up, tons of sports and activities, coaching etc all through HS and Uni.

 

I have applied 2 different cycles, to all of Ontario, 3 in the states, 2 in Alberta, BC, Dal and McGill, not a single interview either year (granted last year my MCAT was only a 510). I am really not sure what to do at this point, my GPA is the low of my application but there is no way for me to fix that, and apparently a good MCAT doesn't prove that I have actually improved since then. Should I keep working/volunteering and reapply next year or is there something more productive I can do? I know a masters likely wont help, and if starting another undergrad really improved my chances I would do it, but I'm not sure that adding 4 more years would be a good plan for something that still isn't a guarantee. 

 

Thanks to anyone who responds, I know there are tons of these on this forum and people get tired on answering them but I would really appreciate some feedback.

[PopShoppe]

I feel your feels, very similar story with me

3.57, 3.33, 3.72, 3.90

127/126/130/129/512

Have lots of good ECs too. Also did an MPH, but I know that doesn't matter to pretty much any Canadian schools. Interested to hear the responses you get to this.

In my opinion,  a second degree might be your next best move if you wanna keep pursuing an acceptance in Canada, even though it is a risk as you've correctly identified. You might be able to get another one in 2-3 years if you do a degree program that carries over credits from your previous degree (or so I've been told). You'd have to be careful that the program you end up pursuing is eligible for med schools' GPA calculations, though. Unfortunately doing a second degree isn't an option for me.

You also might wanna look into doing what you can to get some research pubs.

I feel like your MCAT is good, so I wouldn't consider another rewrite. I wish I had those scores lol. 

Have you considered international? I know you mentioned Wayne state, but are other countries an option? 

[weekendwarriors87]

4 minutes ago, PopShoppe said:

I feel your feels, very similar story with me

3.57, 3.33, 3.72, 3.90

127/126/130/129/512

Have lots of good ECs too. Also did an MPH, but I know that doesn't matter to pretty much any Canadian schools. Interested to hear the responses you get to this.

In my opinion,  a second degree might be your next best move if you wanna keep pursuing an acceptance in Canada, even though it is a risk as you've correctly identified. You might be able to get another one in 2-3 years if you do a degree program that carries over credits from your previous degree (or so I've been told). You'd have to be careful that the program you end up pursuing is eligible for med schools' GPA calculations, though. Unfortunately doing a second degree isn't an option for me.

You also might wanna look into doing what you can to get some research pubs.

I feel like your MCAT is good, so I wouldn't consider another rewrite. I wish I had those scores lol. 

Have you considered international? I know you mentioned Wayne state, but are other countries an option? 

I know there are plenty of us in this boat, and I am willing to work for years towards this goal, but I feel like I have been doing everything I can but am not getting any closer. And yes the extra undergrad scares me as they can apparently change the rules at will, which may waste years of my life. I just started a research position, so maybe that will help for next year, but Im starting to feel the pressure of getting older... And yes I applied to wayne, michigan state and vanderbilt (after they pursued me, they didnt even interview me...) and applied all over Canada. I would consider going away, and honestly wouldnt mind working in the states because I live in a border city and can commute. Not too many options for us it seems, dentistry isnt my thing and neither is pharm, and even if I joined the forces (i have always wanted to serve) I do not get an advantage and am considered for medicine like everyone else...

[RicardoKaká]

1 hour ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

Well here it is, another premed looking for some kind of advice on what to do from here. I have always considered medicine my only option, it is what I have always wanted to do, but I am unsure as to how to improve my chances for a reapplication so I am looking for some advice.

 

Here are my specs:

GPA 1: 3.42

GPA 2: 3.35

GPA 3: 3.77

GPA 4: 3.88

I graduated with this, then did 2 extra years of "non degree" to complete english prereq for Wayne State and took some classes that interested me since from what I understood these did not impact my GPA.

 

MCAT: 127/128/131/130/516

 

ECs: lots and lots, varied, medical and non medical, long term and short term, job experience and volunteer. I have everything from the classic research and hospital to having 7 years in Cadets, 2 pilots licence, currently restoring a 23 year old land rover from the ground up, tons of sports and activities, coaching etc all through HS and Uni.

 

I have applied 2 different cycles, to all of Ontario, 3 in the states, 2 in Alberta, BC, Dal and McGill, not a single interview either year (granted last year my MCAT was only a 510). I am really not sure what to do at this point, my GPA is the low of my application but there is no way for me to fix that, and apparently a good MCAT doesn't prove that I have actually improved since then. Should I keep working/volunteering and reapply next year or is there something more productive I can do? I know a masters likely wont help, and if starting another undergrad really improved my chances I would do it, but I'm not sure that adding 4 more years would be a good plan for something that still isn't a guarantee. 

 

Thanks to anyone who responds, I know there are tons of these on this forum and people get tired on answering them but I would really appreciate some feedback.

Seems like your best chances are Queen's/Western. If medicine in Canada is your top goal, Id maybe rewrite MCAT and aim for high CARS to get Western invite. I heard they may be possibly changing their application process to include ABS too so maybe they will lower their CARS. Anyway your stats screen Western/Queen's - although Queen's is more a blackbox.

Hope you hear some good news, feel free to PM me if you have any more questions. I did a MSc and was offered a few acceptances across Canada after applying in my 4th year and receiving 0 - albeit my wGPA for most schools was ~3.93 and my MCAT was a 510 (probably my weakest component of my apps).

[Potentiate]

Western has a new MCAT cutoff of 126/128/126 -- 380. You can land an interview given strong ECs. You're also quite competitive for queens given strong ECs and reference letters. (I got an interview with a 516). 

I personally wouldn't rewrite the MCAT, but I also wouldn't want to wait for Canadian med. The reality is that competitive applications are often dismissed. I would apply everywhere (International, USDO, USmed, CANmed) and decide on my career choices when I get accepted. 

Stay in there, your MCAT score & ECs gives you a world of hope! 

[MedLife2018]

It's not impossible to get in with those stats. I had similar MCAT and GPA and managed to get in. I would focus on your EC, and I absolutely think its great to focus on non medically oriented volunteering and interests as well to be more diverse. 

For reference, heres my GPA/MCAT:

Year 1: 3.61
Year 2: 3.75
Year 3: 3.53
Year 4: 3.96

MCAT: 513

[weekendwarriors87]

29 minutes ago, Potentiate said:

Western has a new MCAT cutoff of 126/128/126 -- 380. You can land an interview given strong ECs. You're also quite competitive for queens given strong ECs and reference letters. (I got an interview with a 516). 

I personally wouldn't rewrite the MCAT, but I also wouldn't want to wait for Canadian med. The reality is that competitive applications are often dismissed. I would apply everywhere (International, USDO, USmed, CANmed) and decide on my career choices when I get accepted. 

Stay in there, your MCAT score & ECs gives you a world of hope! 

Thanks, I think next year I am going to expand more in the US. The US gives me the most options, and as I listed its not the end of the world if I cant come back to Canada and have to work in the states (although id rather work here, I dont like the US healthcare system) I think im best to do my research this year and TA a few classes, maybe join the forces as a part time job and hope for the best

[weekendwarriors87]

18 minutes ago, MedLife2018 said:

It's not impossible to get in with those stats. I had similar MCAT and GPA and managed to get in. I would focus on your EC, and I absolutely think its great to focus on non medically oriented volunteering and interests as well to be more diverse. 

For reference, heres my GPA/MCAT:

Year 1: 3.61
Year 2: 3.75
Year 3: 3.53
Year 4: 3.96

MCAT: 513

Thanks, I think the research this year might help. And my EC is pretty diverse, thats why it doesnt make sense to me that queens and western rejected (not like im trying to claim how great I am, but they show dedication and excellence in many different roles). maybe the person that read it didnt understand the impact of some of my ECs, but I even hired a service to look over my essays and help me fine tune them, so not sure this is the case. simply could have just been unlucky.

[Happy_go]

3 hours ago, Potentiate said:

Western has a new MCAT cutoff of 126/128/126 -- 380. You can land an interview given strong ECs. You're also quite competitive for queens given strong ECs and reference letters. (I got an interview with a 516). 

I personally wouldn't rewrite the MCAT, but I also wouldn't want to wait for Canadian med. The reality is that competitive applications are often dismissed. I would apply everywhere (International, USDO, USmed, CANmed) and decide on my career choices when I get accepted. 

Stay in there, your MCAT score & ECs gives you a world of hope! 

Those ECs aren't strong enough for Queen's. He tried two years and didn't get any interviews. 

[weekendwarriors87]

1 minute ago, getrich said:

Those ECs aren't strong enough for Queen's. He tried two years and didn't get any interviews. 

true, but last years application cycle I had a 510 MCAT, so only one cycle with a 516. hopefully research will be enough to bolster it, on top of a few other things I do over the next year. any suggestions on what I can do to increase my chances?

[Happy_go]

3 hours ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

Thanks, I think the research this year might help. And my EC is pretty diverse, thats why it doesnt make sense to me that queens and western rejected (not like im trying to claim how great I am, but they show dedication and excellence in many different roles). maybe the person that read it didnt understand the impact of some of my ECs, but I even hired a service to look over my essays and help me fine tune them, so not sure this is the case. simply could have just been unlucky.

look at the rejections and see that many have ecs that are better 

[weekendwarriors87]

2 minutes ago, getrich said:

look at the rejections and see that many have ecs that are better 

what exactly would be considered a "better" EC? Research publications?

[Happy_go]

Just now, weekendwarriors87 said:

what exactly would be considered a "better" EC? Research publications?

you have a good mcat, good ec, mediocre to poor GPA. focus on GPA

[weekendwarriors87]

Just now, getrich said:

you have a good mcat, good ec, mediocre to poor GPA. focus on GPA

I cant change my GPA though... I am completed my undergrad. That is where I am unsure of what to do

[Happy_go]

2 minutes ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

I cant change my GPA though... I am completed my undergrad. That is where I am unsure of what to do

What happens if you give up on the dream? what will you do next?

[weekendwarriors87]

Just now, getrich said:

What happens if you give up on the dream? what will you do next?

well thats the thing, I never planned for a backup because I am determined to do medicine. But im not sure how to improve my application short of doing an entire other undergrad. Ortho interests me, but then I have to write the DAT and apply to dentistry, which is even more focused on GPA than medicine.

[Happy_go]

6 minutes ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

well thats the thing, I never planned for a backup because I am determined to do medicine. But im not sure how to improve my application short of doing an entire other undergrad. Ortho interests me, but then I have to write the DAT and apply to dentistry, which is even more focused on GPA than medicine.

When you say "ortho interests you" what do you mean

[weekendwarriors87]

1 minute ago, getrich said:

When you say "ortho interests you" what do you mean

orthodontics, but it requires you to attend dental school, which places a heavy weight on GPA. 

[Potentiate]

2 hours ago, getrich said:

you have a good mcat, good ec, mediocre to poor GPA. focus on GPA

Can’t say I agree with this. Many people with lower GPAs get interviews at Queens and Western. Your wGPA is 3.83, which isn’t bad. A 516 is also considerably stronger than a 510. 

That being said, many people more deserving than you or I have been rejected outright, so one can never assume they’ll interview no matter how good their application is. You’re set for a USDO, Id much rather do that than dentistry if medicine was my calling. 

[Butterfly_]

Your GPA and MCAT are good enough for entry. It also looks like you have varied ECs as well. Do you have any full-time work experience? Might be a good thing to add in.

Also, I'd recommend to have a different set of eyes read your ABS and adjust how it is written.

I had a friend who got no interviews one year. Then the next year, with the same GPA, MCAT, and ecs, but application written completely differently --got 3 interviews and was ultimately accepted.

Wishing you all the best.

 

[weekendwarriors87]

9 hours ago, Butterfly_ said:

Your GPA and MCAT are good enough for entry. It also looks like you have varied ECs as well. Do you have any full-time work experience? Might be a good thing to add in.

Also, I'd recommend to have a different set of eyes read your ABS and adjust how it is written.

I had a friend who got no interviews one year. Then the next year, with the same GPA, MCAT, and ecs, but application written completely differently --got 3 interviews and was ultimately accepted.

Wishing you all the best.

 

Thanks, and yes I had a med student read over all of my ABS and essays and work with me over months to fine tune them. And yes I have full time work, the only thing I dont have is research. Maybe research and some more work experience over this next year + another year of application will get me a spot.

[weekendwarriors87]

11 hours ago, Potentiate said:

Can’t say I agree with this. Many people with lower GPAs get interviews at Queens and Western. Your wGPA is 3.83, which isn’t bad. A 516 is also considerably stronger than a 510. 

That being said, many people more deserving than you or I have been rejected outright, so one can never assume they’ll interview no matter how good their application is. You’re set for a USDO, Id much rather do that than dentistry if medicine was my calling. 

Ill have to look more into the DO schools, I have that weird feeling that if I do DO ill always wish I had done more to get the MD though, even though Ill still be doing what I love

[yaboi]

No offense, but sometimes you gotta chose different options. Think about why you are so deadset on medicine? Good luck to you, your ECs and grades look pretty good to me. Its sometimes just the luck factor.

[OwnerOfTheTARDIS]

Where are you in province? Would you consider moving somewhere for better advantage? Additionally, some schools (UBC for sure) look at every course you’ve ever taken (minus your lowest year) so the non- degree courses would still count. 

I think your GPA is really going to hold you back from getting any out-of-province interviews and if you’re from Ontario, the lack of homeschool advantage most places will really hurt you.

For example, schools in Sask and Manitoba were far less competitive back when I was applying and residents of the northern territories are considered in-province for BC, Alberta, and Sask. sorry if any info is outdated, but if you’re willing to move, it might be worth checking out different schools and residency policies.