"Meets Expectations" on Clerkship Evaluations

[brady23]

Hey guys,

I recently completed a clerkship rotation (Emergency Medicine), and my evaluation was "Meets Expectations" throughout.  

It is a specialty I'm interested in, but I'm not sure if it's worth asking for a letter if my evaluation was "Meets Expectation" even though I may be interested in the specialty, but wouldn't it look weird applying for Emergency Medicine if I don't use a core letter? 

[Lactic Folly]

My understanding is that EM is one of the most competitive specialties. Rather than asking for a letter, if you're at the start of clerkship, I would instead ask for specific feedback on how you can move into the "exceeds expectations" category.

[Monkey D. Luffy]

Agree with above. Use this block to learn and improve, and then get your letters from later rotations/electives.

[UBCMD2020CARMS]

If there is someone you clicked with and did well with, it is still worth asking for a letter. Doesn't get any easier in 4th year, and can be very hit or miss. But if not, that is okay too, no one expects 3rd year letters persae either.

Also, most people SHOULD be getting "meets expectations". Only 5-10% of people should be getting "exceeds expectations" or whatever the highest ranking category your school offers. I think its clear some schools, or some programs/hospitals are a bit more lenient than others with throwing around these notations than others.  Where I did EM core, many people got "exceeds" much more than 5-10%. Where i did my 4th year elective, the clerkship director was very clear they only gave out "exceeds" to 5-10 people a year, and they get many many medical students that rotate through them, so they have a good sense of who truly are the top 5-10%.  

[bearded frog]

If its a rotation you're interested in or an elective, I would ask your preceptor what you can do to exceed expectations at the start. That way they know ahead of time that you're interested in it and hopefully what specifically you can do to impress them.

[UBCMD2020CARMS]

53 minutes ago, bearded frog said:

If its a rotation you're interested in or an elective, I would ask your preceptor what you can do to exceed expectations at the start. That way they know ahead of time that you're interested in it and hopefully what specifically you can do to impress them.

Very reasonable advice, i think though, that just because they say "do xyz" doesn't mean you should expect "exceeds expectations" either though.   Not all students have the specialty specific knowledge sometimes, or have the right work ethic/communication skills that will get them to that top 5-10% range. 

[Lactic Folly]

Agree with both above posts. Although it may be difficult to move up a global category (although not impossible given the subjectivity and variability of leniency/seriousness to which evaluations are prone), since the OP stated they received "meets expectations" on all domains of their evaluation, there is likely some room to improve.

If a student did as bearded frog suggested and asked for feedback to work towards a higher performance category (I agree there should be no implied expectation this would be granted), this is likely to set them apart from their peers and give them a boost in the initiative / receptiveness to feedback category, if nothing else.

[ploughboy]

7 hours ago, brady23 said:

Hey guys,

I recently completed a clerkship rotation (Emergency Medicine), and my evaluation was "Meets Expectations" throughout.  

It is a specialty I'm interested in, but I'm not sure if it's worth asking for a letter if my evaluation was "Meets Expectation" even though I may be interested in the specialty, but wouldn't it look weird applying for Emergency Medicine if I don't use a core letter? 

Ah yes, the "let's just be friends" of clerkship evaluations.

Agree with above replies.  Try and get specific feedback about your performance from a trusted preceptor on the rotation.  Take that to heart, and then do a home-school 4th year elective in the specialty (maybe at a different site?  U of T has a lot of them) to get a letter.

[yonas]

i probably would not use that letter if you have other options given how competitive EM is.

[Raptors905]

13 hours ago, UBCMD2020CARMS said:

If there is someone you clicked with and did well with, it is still worth asking for a letter. Doesn't get any easier in 4th year, and can be very hit or miss. But if not, that is okay too, no one expects 3rd year letters persae either.

Also, most people SHOULD be getting "meets expectations". Only 5-10% of people should be getting "exceeds expectations" or whatever the highest ranking category your school offers. I think its clear some schools, or some programs/hospitals are a bit more lenient than others with throwing around these notations than others.  Where I did EM core, many people got "exceeds" much more than 5-10%. Where i did my 4th year elective, the clerkship director was very clear they only gave out "exceeds" to 5-10 people a year, and they get many many medical students that rotate through them, so they have a good sense of who truly are the top 5-10%.  

I never once got a meets expectations and most of the people I know at UofT never did either. I don’t think it’s 5-10 percent closer to 25-50

[medabe]

8 hours ago, ploughboy said:

Ah yes, the "let's just be friends" of clerkship evaluations.

Haha....good one!! LOVE it!

[MarsRover]

I think "meets expectations" vs "exceed expectations" is very site dependent. I would not worry. Having talked to PD's across the country some schools are known for producing strong clinical clerks and others strong academic, others both. Similarly, programs don't tend to care too much was MSPR says - as again... some schools are known for inflating their evaluation forms. 

 Also it can be very staff or reviewer dependent. I have had 75% of staff gives me exceeds, but then the person doing the final review didn't work with me and i was given meets. I had another staff say I was essentially R1 and say I meet expectations. Another rotations in a non-related field I essentially just shadowed and got exceeds. Honestly, exceeds vs meets is essentially how the staff views evaluations or feels that day. 

 

I would approach whom ever you worked with most or most clicked with, and be straight up asking something like " I am very interested in Emerg and am going to try to match in CaRMS, it is quite competitive, do you think you could write me a strong letter" ... that will make things clear. As a staff that you worked with a lot could think you are an amazing person to work with with a good personality for ER and easy to teach, but your current knowledge isn't "exceeds expectations"... again most staff would rather work with an easy-going easy to teach person than someone who is an Ass with a lot of knowledge.