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Admission requirements confusion?


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17 minutes ago, dankmeme said:

Thank you for saying this. I think a lot of the people who are upset are missing this point. In-progress degrees show up on your transcript, which are available for the entire admission committee to see. And these students are just as deserving as others to get in.

Additionally...this is just my understanding, but I had applied a few times over the years and I remember this still being the rule on the website. Back then when I inquired about it, it was for your FIRST undergrad (i.e. this is why Dal doesn't accept 3rd year undergrads, unlike schools like uOttawa), OR for graduate school. I don't know if this rule includes a second undergrad like pharmacy. Again, it would make sense that it wouldn't include a second undergrad, as GPA calculation would not be possible using 1st or 2nd year pharmacy grades (unless this changed recently). So, the rule is not really being broken at all in that case.

On a last note, guys, please be kind to each other; we're all going to be colleagues eventually. Calling for the removal of students from their acceptance spot is essentially witch-hunting and is not the kind of culture that I think most people in medicine want to see. If you truly feel this was a major error that caused you not to get accepted (despite a year or two of pharmacy likely not adding much to the subjective process of grading admissions), or if this misunderstanding has majorly impacted your career/life, then go ahead and contact them to fix this for next year's cycle. My honest belief is that no foul play is involved and student affairs is well aware of each pharmacy applicants situation and is okay with it.

Edit: Just saw the post above me, which echoes what I wrote. The rule isn't being applied to second undergrads. 

Was the rule written in the exact same way on the website? Because I’ve also applied before and didn’t see it before this cycle. 

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4 minutes ago, med1day said:

Was the rule written in the exact same way on the website? Because I’ve also applied before and didn’t see it before this cycle. 

I think as the above poster mentioned, it linked the official academic calendar for med admissions, found below. It just states you need to have A degree that has been completed or in senior year (i.e. past tense/present tense). Given that pharmacy students have a previous BSc, this makes them eligible. It also states students within their early years of grad school can't apply until their last year. 

https://academiccalendar.dal.ca/Catalog/ViewCatalog.aspx?pageid=viewcatalog&catalogid=107&chapterid=6662&topicgroupid=29158&loaduseredits=False

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17 minutes ago, med1day said:

Was the rule written in the exact same way on the website? Because I’ve also applied before and didn’t see it before this cycle. 

Y’all let’s not lose sight, we are talking about THIS application cycle! Not previous ones! The problem is, some people were clearly told you couldn’t do this, while others I guess were told you could - that is part of the issue at hand. Fact is, no one on here has the answer we are seeking, so we just need to wait it out and see what clarification Dal can offer.

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10 minutes ago, dankmeme said:

I think as the above poster mentioned, it linked the official academic calendar for med admissions, found below. It just states you need to have A degree that has been completed or in senior year (i.e. past tense/present tense). Given that pharmacy students have a previous BSc, this makes them eligible. It also states students within their early years of grad school can't apply until their last year. 

https://academiccalendar.dal.ca/Catalog/ViewCatalog.aspx?pageid=viewcatalog&catalogid=107&chapterid=6662&topicgroupid=29158&loaduseredits=False

We’re talking about the requirement on this page. Which was added fairly recently. 

https://medicine.dal.ca/departments/core-units/admissions/admissions.html

The academic calendar may be out of date, a lot of them are. 

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1 minute ago, PH2Med said:

If it was added “fairly recently” it would not have applied to the cycle that just occurred. Requirements are reviewed on an annual basis. Again, wait to see what admissions says and relax.

It was added in late 2018. Before this cycle, but after the last.

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You should just believe what you want - it's clear there's limited answers you'll accept for this misunderstanding. Every single one of their rules are reviewed every single year by the entire committee, and every single applicant's entire academic history is known to the committee. If the info is unclear to you on the website and you believe it changed from the academic calendar, then reach out to them. If others have done this (i.e. this past cycle) and been given the green light AND have been accepted into the incoming class, then I doubt there are any errors present.

I'm not going to keep commenting on this thread because there's nothing more I can add. Good luck getting off the waitlist!

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12 minutes ago, dankmeme said:

You should just believe what you want - it's clear there's limited answers you'll accept for this misunderstanding. Every single one of their rules are reviewed every single year by the entire committee, and every single applicant's entire academic history is known to the committee. If the info is unclear to you on the website and you believe it changed from the academic calendar, then reach out to them. If others have done this (i.e. this past cycle) and been given the green light AND have been accepted into the incoming class, then I doubt there are any errors present.

I'm not going to keep commenting on this thread because there's nothing more I can add. Good luck getting off the waitlist!

I'm sorry, but all I did is send you the new admissions requirement on the website which is different from the one you were talking about in your post. So therefore, you cannot say this is the same rule that was written a few years ago or a couple years ago or even last cycle, because it's not. If this is genuinely a misunderstanding, then that's completely okay with me. There's not limited answers that I will accept, I am just showing you what we are debating is different than what you were referring to that's all. 

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Well it definitely sounds like there might be an issue with the admission process, but at least it seems like it worked because it sorted out the applicants here that are heartless and target students without giving them the benefit of the doubt. Maybe you can learn from this and rework it into your personal statements for Medicine (or pharmacy) next year!

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9 minutes ago, toxicpremeds said:

Well it definitely sounds like there might be an issue with the admission process, but at least it seems like it worked because it sorted out the applicants here that are heartless and target students without giving them the benefit of the doubt. Maybe you can learn from this and rework it into your personal statements for Medicine (or pharmacy) next year!

Again, do not use extreme cases to justify your argument. One student arguing for accepted applicants to get blacklisted does not mean the other 95% do, nor does it justify your rude remarks. Most of us in this thread wish them the best and are hoping for Dal to openly lift this requirement! We are challenging the system, not the people :) To anyone who actually took the blacklisting comment seriously, this would never happen! Please be happy with your acceptances and celebrate as you 100% have the right to do so. 

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53 minutes ago, PH2Med said:

If it was added “fairly recently” it would not have applied to the cycle that just occurred. Requirements are reviewed on an annual basis. Again, wait to see what admissions says and relax.

Sir, "Fairly recently" = 2018, aka applicable to this cycle, seeing as you need a definition for this phrase that has upset you. I suggest you take your own advice :D

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17 minutes ago, toxicpremeds said:

Well it definitely sounds like there might be an issue with the admission process, but at least it seems like it worked because it sorted out the applicants here that are heartless and target students without giving them the benefit of the doubt. Maybe you can learn from this and rework it into your personal statements for Medicine (or pharmacy) next year!

Says the person who felt the need to create an account titled “toxic pre meds” just to make a rude remark.... LOL. As the person above me said, we are challenging Dals system, NOT these students! Dal is at fault, completely here. If you read the majority of this thread, everyone pretty much agrees this isn’t about “targeting” anyone! 

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Don't want to paint a broad stroke but commenters here might have convinced themselves that the sentiments here are for the greater good, but I'm not. I read frustration and jealousy. Its disappointing to see, but these feelings ought to be channeled into positive outlets like reworking your application, reconsidering whether this is for you, and finding other opportunities. No one is owed a spot, so don't act like petulant children when things don't roll your way.

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^agreed. You guys aren't convincing anyone by constantly repeating that you are so invested in this because you have a problem with Dal's policies and not those accepted. It's really creepy and sad that the first thing you did when you found out people post their acceptance on social media is to freak out, make this thread, email the school, and try and gather support for others to email the school too. Also, no one has mentioned that do you to see this post on social media you were likely "friends" on social media. Just goes to show you that you never know what people think/will do when they are jealous of your success when you post online. And if you weren't even friends on social media, that makes it creepier that you found this post and made all this drama. Shame on you, and for the record trying to bring up that you tried to get the support of doctors who have "mentored" you to write to Dal is so low, and an embarrassment. Medical schools are not stupid, and more than likely there is more to it then a sentence you read on a site. Mind your own business and stop this witch hunt. Only people I feel for are those that were accepted and hopefully they don't find this thread. I started reading this thread because I thought it was interesting, but it really shows how toxic, bitter, and jealous premeds really are.

PS- imagine the rep you people are going to get if somehow you do make it in, especially if you are classmates...trust me, even if you think you are anons on this site, it's not hard to connect the dots with such a small med class / city ...

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If you think the admissions team isn't capable of mistakes, and the people who get in are all angels and we're heartless for hoping a requirement is used to judge all applicants and potential applicants in a fair and equitable way, take a look at the story of the murderer who got into Dal's medical school: https://www.660citynews.com/2017/06/18/halifax-medical-student-found-guilty-of-first-degree-murder/. There's plenty more articles on the matter. 

We're not targeting individuals here, in fact the majority of us hope all of these people attend medical school, but if they attend this year, it calls into question the entire integrity of the admissions process. If a new (emphasis on new this was added to the website before this cycle, but after last) requirement applies to only some applicants, then will other applicants be able to apply say if they don't have an undergraduate degree now? Well it states they can't in plain language on the website, but if other rules are being broken, why not? This affects a large number of people including those who were told specifically by admissions that they could not apply, those on the waitlist that followed all the rules on the admissions website, and those who chose not to go into pharmacy or nursing or some other backup because they thought it would render them ineligible.

You can't say to some people in an undergraduate degree that they can't apply and to some people that they can, that gives certain students special privileges while others lose a chance at applying. And don't forget the fact that admissions added this statement themselves to the website for this cycle in particular. Let me post it again, even though it's been posted several times already. Clearly, some people still don't know what we are referring to.

"Students who are enrolled in undergraduate or graduate studies programs at the time of application and who receive an admissions offer will be required to successfully complete their program of study before beginning the undergraduate medical education curriculum.  If the degree program is not completed, the admissions offer is rescinded.  Thus, it is expected that students will apply during their last year of study."

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7 minutes ago, med1day said:

If you think the admissions team isn't capable of mistakes, and the people who get in are all angels and we're heartless for hoping a requirement is used to judge all applicants and potential applicants in a fair and equitable way, take a look at the story of the murderer who got into Dal's medical school: https://www.660citynews.com/2017/06/18/halifax-medical-student-found-guilty-of-first-degree-murder/. There's plenty more articles on the matter. 

We're not targeting individuals here, in fact the majority of us hope all of these people attend medical school, but if they attend this year, it calls into question the entire integrity of the admissions process. If a new (emphasis on new this was added to the website before this cycle, but after last) requirement applies to only some applicants, then will other applicants be able to apply say if they don't have an undergraduate degree now? Well it states they can't in plain language on the website, but if other rules are being broken, why not? This affects a large number of people including those who were told specifically by admissions that they could not apply, those on the waitlist that followed all the rules on the admissions website, and those who chose not to go into pharmacy or nursing or some other backup because they thought it would render them ineligible.

You can't say to some people in an undergraduate degree that they can't apply and to some people that they can, that gives certain students special privileges while others lose a chance at applying. And don't forget the fact that admissions added this statement themselves to the website for this cycle in particular. Let me post it again, even though it's been posted several times already. Clearly, some people still don't know what we are referring to.

"Students who are enrolled in undergraduate or graduate studies programs at the time of application and who receive an admissions offer will be required to successfully complete their program of study before beginning the undergraduate medical education curriculum.  If the degree program is not completed, the admissions offer is rescinded.  Thus, it is expected that students will apply during their last year of study."

lol are you serious? don't apply to dal/remove yourself from the waitlist then because Dal can't screen for murderers...every post gets crazier and crazier. Jeez, the mental gymnastics people do...

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2 minutes ago, YesIcan55 said:

^agreed. You guys aren't convincing anyone by constantly repeating that you are so invested in this because you have a problem with Dal's policies and not those accepted. It's really creepy and sad that the first thing you did when you found out people post their acceptance on social media is to freak out, make this thread, email the school, and try and gather support for others to email the school too. Shame on you, and for the record trying to bring up that you tried to get the support of doctors who have "mentored" you to write to Dal is so low, and an embarrassment. Medical schools are not stupid, and more than likely there is more to it then a sentence you read on a site. Mind your own business and stop this witch hunt. Only people I feel for are those that were accepted and hopefully they don't find this thread. I started reading this thread because I thought it was interesting, but it really shows how toxic, bitter, and jealous premeds really are.

Funny how you are calling us toxic and bitter when you can only direct your empathy towards one group in this situation that affects many. Also funny how the only people calling us names are the ones apparently against an equitable process in regards to this rule. I feel for EVERYONE involved in this. I feel empathy for the people who may have been wrongfully admitted under this new rule, for those who were told they don't even qualify to apply and for those on the waitlist. I don't personally want these people to have their acceptances rescinded because I'm jealous of them, this is a statement written by THE MEDICAL SCHOOL on their website. I want ALL admissions rules and policies to be followed, because if not anything goes! 

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Whoa, whoa, whoa! I think everyone's missing the point. I'm starting a petition to get Dal to ban all murderers, or at least clarify their anti-murderer requirements on the website, cause I think we can all agree it's not super obvious.

Feel free to email the dean, or PM me so we can do it together. 

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2 minutes ago, YesIcan55 said:

lol are you serious? don't apply to dal/remove yourself from the waitlist then because Dal can't screen for murderers...every post gets crazier and crazier. Jeez, the mental gymnastics people do...

That's very extreme, I would never call someone not qualified for the medical profession based on a post. In fact, I have not said anything against you. Again, we are not targeting anyone, we just want fairness. And I'm trying to point out the humanity of the admissions committee, a lot of people on this forum have said that admissions doesn't make mistakes and this is a valid example of one. 

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 I never applied to Dal, and I was watching this thread because it was interesting. But, I had to step in because someone needs to call people out on their crap. It's really scary the lengths people go to get ahead. A big lesson for anyone reading this thread that is about to get good news as other schools release results in the next 2-3 weeks is to be careful what you post on social media because even if you did everything correctly...there are petty, jealous people out there....for those familiar with the "evil eye" concept in many cultures...this thread is 100% prime example. 

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18 minutes ago, YesIcan55 said:

 I never applied to Dal, and I was watching this thread because it was interesting. But, I had to step in because someone needs to call people out on their crap. It's really scary the lengths people go to get ahead. A big lesson for anyone reading this thread that is about to get good news as other schools release results in the next 2-3 weeks is to be careful what you post on social media because even if you did everything correctly...there are petty, jealous people out there....for those familiar with the "evil eye" concept in many cultures...this thread is 100% prime example. 

Trying to understand why some weren't allowed to pursue graduate school to remain eligible and others were is not being jealous/toxic. Trying to understand why some were not allowed to apply and others were is not being jealous/toxic. It's questioning the system's fairness. It's very easy to generalize and call an entire group "toxic" based one 1-2 people's actions. 

And to being careful on what you should post on social media? AMEN :lol:

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1 minute ago, premed_1 said:

Trying to understand why some weren't allowed to pursue graduate school to remain eligible and others were is not being jealous/toxic. Trying to understand why some were not allowed to apply and others were is not being jealous/toxic. It's questioning the system's fairness. It's very easy to generalize and call an entire group "toxic" based one 1-2 people's actions. 

And to being careful on what you should post on social media? AMEN :lol:

The rules are very clear in response to graduate students, and have always been. You cannot pursue graduate studies and apply to medicine in the same cycle - you must be at the end of your degree. All grad students who have previously applied and been accepted (myself included) know this. Our acceptance letter clearly stated the offer would most definitely be revoked if we did not provide proof of degree completion, and Carolyn reminded us of this.

Pharmacy =/= graduate school. Pharmacy is an undergraduate degree at the same level as a BSc (and Medicine is also considered an undergraduate degree, coincidentally). Again, referring to the above links others posted makes the rules pretty clear. 

Like Yeslcan alluded to, this is hopefully a wake-up call for other premeds: going on a witch hunt to further your own application/chances makes you shitty, full stop. Thinking you can intervene to somehow right this "unfair, inequitable" system for YOUR OWN benefit and at the expense of others is honestly entitled, and discrediting & disrespectful to your future colleagues and to the admissions committee. The entire admissions process is meticulous and your waitlist score is not affected by other students' performance. So take your waitlist/rejection as a learning opportunity and grow from it, instead of pointing fingers and blaming outside sources for the outcome. 

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