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The MCC has always defined US trained DOs as IMGs. The change is that Ontario will now adopt the MCC definition of an IMG, whereas before, Ontario did not. This is why I was able to match in the 1st CMG iteration in Ontario. This came as a major blow because Ontario was the only realistic province where USDOs had a decent shot at a Canadian residency. The DO class of 2015 will be exempt from this change along with the NAC osce requirements, with the class (graduating) in 2016 being the first cohort that will be required to take the NAC OSCE, and to apply in the IMG iteration.

 

The perpetual issue with the MCC is that they only accept LMCC and CACMS accredited (i.e., MD schools) as being CMG, so COCA accredited DO schools do not fall into that category (along with all off shore medical schools), hence DO school graduates get lumped into the same category as IMGs. With the merger of 2015-2020 of DO residencies and the AOA into the ACGME, perhaps there will be some political impetus to merge the LCME and COCA accreditation bodies - IF this was to occur, it would throw a monkey wrench into MCC's definition for what constitutes an "IMG".

 

The American Osteopathic Association (AOA) is well aware of this policy change (I made sure they got the memo), as well as the relevant deans of the USDO schools. A few deans have stated that they will advocate on our behalf, but so far, nothing concrete has come up. Canadians still make a very small percentage of matriculants to USDO schools, and there is only so much US based organizations such as the AOA can do to change the direction and policy of Canadian organizations.

 

This does not affect the US ERAS match in any way. USDOs are still AMGs in the US, and the whole US match process should be more streamlined in the coming years with the merge of the AOA and ACGME - such that all residencies (formerly DO and MD) will all be MD ACGME residencies. This is a huge win for DOs in the US.

 

Outside of allopathic MD schools in the US, Canada, I would still say that a US DO school is the better option compared to international options (if it came to that).

 

Even as a US MD graduate, your chance of matching back to Canada is only around 60-65%, and despite the years that DOs had the same match as CMGs, our small numbers hasn't really made a dent, and we have only managed to match into a handful of specialties in Canada. To be a DO, your primary goal should always have been to match in the US. The proposed loss of CMG status in Ontario does suck, but does not change the trajectory for us in any significant way (when you take into consideration that only at most 1-2 DOs match back in Canada a year historically).

 

I anticipate that the numbers of Canadians matriculating in US DO schools will continue to grow, with more of them choosing to stay in the US afterwards (which should always have been the plan for Canadians going to US MD/DO schools).

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The onus is on you to do your research, before applying to professional programs that cost 300,000$. You should have already known such a big change.

 

Sorry if you felt targeted, I take that back.

 

Why do you assume that I'm studying at a DO school or will be doing so? I am actually interested in the admissions in general. I was trying to see the updated definition of IMGs.

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http://amorassoc.informz.net/InformzDataService/OnlineVersion/Ind/bWFpbGluZ0luc3RhbmNlSWQ9MzQ5ODIzMyZzdWJzY3JpYmVySWQ9ODExODcxMzUw

 

 

AOA House of Delegates Votes to Support Single GME Accreditation System

 

Delegates representing the nation’s more than 104,000 osteopathic physicians and osteopathic medical students voted today to support a decision by the AOA Board of Trustees to pursue a new, single accreditation system for graduate medical education.

 

This historic vote during the annual meeting of the AOA House of Delegates comes after an announcement in February that the AOA, the Accreditation Council for Graduate Medical Education (ACGME), and the American Association of Colleges of Osteopathic Medicine (AACOM) had reached an agreement to work together to prepare future generations of physicians.

 

When fully implemented in July 2020, the new system will allow graduates of osteopathic and allopathic medical schools to complete their residency and/or fellowship education in ACGME-accredited programs and demonstrate achievement of common milestones and competencies.

 

The AOA strongly believes the public will benefit from a single standardized system to evaluate the effectiveness of GME programs for producing competent physicians. Through osteopathic-focused residency programs, the new GME accreditation system will recognize the unique principles and practices of the osteopathic medical profession and its contributions to health care in the U.S.

 

For more information on the single GME accreditation system, visit http://www.osteopathic.org/singleGME.

 

No force can stop an idea whose time has come - A unified GME

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Will it ever reach a point where DO schools will try and obtain LCME accreditation?

 

"maybe". 1st step is the merge between 2015-2020. After we have a unified match (some argue probably by 2018), maybe even before then - when the AOA becomes a part of the ACGME, perhaps some will find it redundant to have LCME and COCA (who accredits DO schools) both under the ACGME.. Perhaps there would then be some kind of political will to combine those two. A few Canadians certainly have brought up this issue with the AOA, but they are pretty silent at this point, as the merger JUST passed through the AOA house.

 

Either way, you are probably looking at some kind of merge between LCME and COCA, or one absorbing the other, and not LCME accreditation of DO schools outright. Also, pretty far into the future. But hey, just a few years ago, everyone thought it would have been impossible to merge AOA and ACMGE residencies.. yet this is happening. When I went to the US 4 years ago for DO school, I never imagined that DO and MD residencies would merge (or soon will merge) in my life time... So who really knows what the future may hold.

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"maybe". 1st step is the merge between 2015-2020. After we have a unified match (some argue probably by 2018), maybe even before then - when the AOA becomes a part of the ACGME, perhaps some will find it redundant to have LCME and COCA (who accredits DO schools) both under the ACGME.. Perhaps there would then be some kind of political will to combine those two. A few Canadians certainly have brought up this issue with the AOA, but they are pretty silent at this point, as the merger JUST passed through the AOA house.

 

Either way, you are probably looking at some kind of merge between LCME and COCA, or one absorbing the other, and not LCME accreditation of DO schools outright. Also, pretty far into the future. But hey, just a few years ago, everyone thought it would have been impossible to merge AOA and ACMGE residencies.. yet this is happening. When I went to the US 4 years ago for DO school, I never imagined that DO and MD residencies would merge (or soon will merge) in my life time... So who really knows what the future may hold.

 

I completely see your point. it seems interesting at the very least. Firstly, DO schools are increasing in competitiveness. They will likely reach slightly below MD levels sometime in the future. Merging residencies will lead to a lot of hospitals and high level administrators asking "what's the point of the dual degree system?". I do see the LCME absorbing the Osteopathic system.

 

This merger won't really affect Canada since not many DOs come here anyway. Furthermore , LCME is largely an American group so Canadian schools won't have much sway in the decision.

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This merger won't really affect Canada since not many DOs come here anyway. Furthermore , LCME is largely an American group so Canadian schools won't have much sway in the decision.

 

A bunch of DO students and I did some primary research on what Canadian DO students are up to. Interesting finding was that the majority (60%+) wanted to remain in the US for residency training, while the majority (almost 70%+) also wanted to return to Canada to practice (after residency training). So it looks like there's a large population of Canadians at DO schools right now who want to remain in the US for their residency, then somehow hop across the border to practice in CAnada afterwards. This being the case, the merger will definitely be a boon for Canadian DOs. Afterall, there's going to be something like 800 (or however many AOA residencies there are) that can now be accessible to MDs, IMGs and also Canadian DOs (because pre-merger, doing an AOA residency for a Canadian was not an option because AOA residencies are not recognized in Canada).

 

Regardless of what other people have suggested that only DOs with low stats will benefit from this merger, well, it's really a moot point because some DOs will benefit, and I'm looking at the group of Canadian DOs who are interested in formerly-AOA residencies and can now actually apply/match into them. The point is that some will benefit more than others, and those with competitive stats that could have got into a MD residency can still nontheless apply to formerly AOA residencies if they wanted to - which I think is still a step up from not even having that option pre-merger.

 

Lastly, the MCC only takes US LCME accredited schools to be in the CMG match in Canada. So when the day comes when DO schools become LCME/COCA merged entity accredited, the MCC will have to adapt their definition of what is an IMG. Maybe even take DOs off the "IMG" definition. Who knows.

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http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/03/education/edlife/the-osteopathic-branch-of-medicine-is-booming.html?_r=1

 

Keep up with the times Canadians :)

 

.

The D.O. Is In Now

Osteopathic Schools Turn Out Nearly a Third of All Med School Grads

 

By JOSEPH BERGERJULY 29, 2014

 

The old Blumstein’s department store sits across 125th Street from the legendary Apollo Theater. It’s something of a Harlem landmark, where “don’t buy where you can’t work” protests led to the hiring of African-Americans as the first salesclerks in 1934 and where the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. was stabbed by a mentally unstable woman during a book signing in 1958. Now a row of colorful clothing and jewelry stores lines the ground floor. But the rest of the building has been gutted and fitted with lecture halls, classrooms, laboratories and a library to house the Touro College of Osteopathic Medicine.

 

Harlem is a fitting location for Touro’s new medical school. Many osteopathic schools have an added mission: to dispatch doctors to poorer neighborhoods and towns most in need of medical care.

 

“The island of Manhattan has lots of doctors, but not here in Harlem,” said Dr. Robert B. Goldberg, dean of the college, which taught its first class in 2007.

 

Inside, Touro seems indistinguishable from a conventional medical school — what doctors of osteopathic medicine, or D.O.s, call allopathic, a term that some M.D.s aren’t much fond of. A walk through the corridors finds students practicing skills on mannequins hard-wired with faulty hearts. They dissect cadavers. They bend over lab tables, working with professors on their research. And, unlike their allopathic counterparts, they spend roughly five hours a week being instructed in the century-old techniques of osteopathic medicine, manipulating the spine, muscles and bones in diagnosis and treatment.

 

In one classroom, several students lay flat on examining tables while classmates, under the guidance of Dr. Mary Banihashem, worked over their necks. She reminded them to use the patient’s eyes as a reference point in judging alignment as they assess neck motion, “We’re looking for any tenderness” in neck muscles, she said.

 

Gabrielle Rozenberg, in her second year at Touro, remembers the Ur-moment that would lead her to this somewhat unconventional path in medicine. Growing up on Long Island, she suffered from chronic ear infections. Her doctor recommended surgery. But before committing to an invasive procedure, her parents took her to a D.O. — a physician whose skills are comparable to those of an M.D. In several visits, he performed some twists and turns of her neck and head, and within days the infection cleared up. “The infection happened because of fluid in the ear,” she explained, “and the manipulations opened up the ear canal.” The infection didn’t come back.

 

Ms. Rozenberg began thinking about one day becoming a doctor of osteopathic medicine herself.

 

Many are drawn to the field for this more personal, hands-on approach and its emphasis on community medicine and preventive care. There are pragmatic reasons as well. Medical schools are failing to keep pace with the patient population, and competition for careers in medicine is growing fiercer. More students see osteopathy as a sensible alternative to conventional medical school, a way to get a medical education with M.C.A.T. scores that may not make the cut for traditional medical schools. According to the American Association of Colleges of Osteopathic Medicine, students entering osteopathic schools last year scored, on average, 27, compared to 31 for M.D. matriculants. Incoming M.D. students average a 3.69 grade-point average, versus 3.5 for D.O. matriculants.

 

Yet it should be noted: Getting into osteopathic school is still excruciatingly tough. Last fall, more than 144,000 students applied for some 6,400 spots. Touro this year received 6,000 applications for 270 first-year seats for the Manhattan school and a new campus opening this summer in Middletown, N.Y. (The average M.C.A.T. score for students entering this fall was just a point below the M.D. average.)

 

The boom in osteopathy is striking. In 1980, there were just 14 schools across the country and 4,940 students. Now there are 30 schools, including state universities in New Jersey, Ohio, Oklahoma, Texas, West Virginia and Michigan, offering instruction at 40 different locations to more than 23,000 students. Today, osteopathic schools turn out 28 percent of the nation’s medical school graduates.

Whatever the reasons for choosing a D.O. over an M.D., osteopathic medicine has, for decades now and increasingly so, been accepted as authoritative training by the medical establishment, including the residency programs that lead to licensure. This year, more than three-quarters of D.O. graduates successfully “matched” with a residency — half for M.D.-accredited programs and half for D.O.-accredited programs.

 

That distinction is about to end. In February, the accrediting agencies agreed to a single system for residencies and fellowships. Beginning next year and fully in place by 2020, D.O. residency standards will be aligned with those of the Accreditation Council of Graduate Medical Education, the nonprofit that accredits M.D. programs. The council will now accredit D.O. residencies, though osteopathic representatives will sit on review committees and its board. The announcement cited the need to provide accountability and a uniform path of preparation, and “to help mitigate the primary care physician shortage.” About 60 percent of D.O. graduates go on to primary care fields like internal medicine, pediatrics and family medicine, compared with about 30 percent of M.D.s.

 

The Association of American Medical Colleges, which represents the 141 accredited M.D. schools, predicts that the Affordable Care Act, providing for federally subsidized health insurance, will add 32 million Americans to the patient population, not to mention the coming eligibility of baby boomers for Medicare. As a result, the country is expected to face a shortage of 45,000 primary care doctors and 46,100 surgeons and specialists by 2020.

 

Dr. Atul Grover, the association’s chief public policy officer, credits the osteopathic boom to the need for additional sources of medical training. From about 1980 to 2001, no new M.D. schools opened in the United States. But with the shortage looming, 15 new ones have come on board since 2006. Dr. Grover speculates that the new residency system could also lead to one accreditation for M.D. and D.O. schools. At the least, the new synergy lends an imprimatur to the osteopathic schools, which by and large lack marquee status.

 

“It will allow graduates from two similar but different education systems to work side by side,” said Dr. John E. Prescott, chief academic officer of the M.D. association. “It’s a true step forward.”

 

Dr. Goldberg of Touro had this to say: “The merger will let individuals understand that there’s more commonality and strength than there are differences.”

 

Osteopathic skills were first consolidated by a 19th-century frontier physician, Andrew Taylor Still, who decried the overuse of arsenic, castor oil, opium and elixirs and believed that many diseases had their roots in a disturbed musculo-skeletal system that could be treated hands on. He founded the first osteopathic school in 1892 in Kirksville, Mo. — A.T. Still University. Critics have, from time to time, assailed the techniques as pseudoscience, though the medical establishment has come to accept the approach. And osteopathic schools offer the same academic subjects as traditional medical schools and the same two years of clinical rotations.

 

But an image problem remains. A survey last year by the American Osteopathic Association found that 29 percent of adults were unaware that D.O.s are licensed to practice medicine, 33 percent didn’t know they can prescribe medicine and 63 percent didn’t know they can perform surgery.

 

Acquaintances would tell Ruchi Vikas, a daughter of psychiatrists from India, not to train in osteopathic medicine because of its “stigma.” They told her: “Don’t go to a D.O. school, you don’t want to be a second-class citizen.” But she did, inspired after shadowing two D.O. psychiatrists as a high school student. “Now,” she added, underscoring what the statistics make clear, “it is more and more acceptable.”

 

Dr. Goldberg believes osteopaths have a strong case to make. Too many doctors, he said, rely on expensive medical tests like CT scans and M.R.I.s and fail to probe or even touch the patient’s body. Osteopathic schools, on the other hand, stress physical diagnosis techniques like palpation or percussion — gently tapping the abdominal area, say, to determine if the size and shape of the liver suggest inflammation. An osteopath might more quickly notice that if a pregnant woman’s posture is askew her fetus is imposing a burden on her skeleton.

 

The D.O. philosophy makes much of patient interaction. “I hate the term holistic, but we look at the patient as a whole — from their biological, psychological, social, occupational and family background,” said Dr. Goldberg, a physiatrist (rehabilitation specialist) by training. “We teach respect for technology and laboratory testing to aid in making a diagnosis, but count on the history and physical examination to confirm it. In that way, we’re old-fashioned.”

 

The Touro educational network began in 1971 as a 35-student nonprofit college in midtown Manhattan aimed at Orthodox Jewish students. It now has dozens of campuses across five countries, with 19,000 students of many faiths and ethnicities studying a variety of subjects. At the osteopathic school in Harlem, its Jewish affiliation is evident only in the ubiquitous mezuzot — small boxes filled with sacred prayers on parchment pinned to door jambs — and its observance of a traditional Jewish calendar.

 

Touro also operates osteopathic campuses in Vallejo, Calif., and Henderson, Nev., and it took over New York Medical College, a conventional medical school, three years ago. Many osteopathic schools have been established in rural areas, in keeping with a mission to embed doctors in underserved areas. A 2010 report called “The Social Mission of Medical Education” noted the successful placement of schools in nontraditional locations, citing Pikeville, Ky., and Harlem. But it also found osteopathic schools behind allopathic schools in recruiting underrepresented minorities.

 

For Harlem, Touro crafted a mission statement that emphasizes the need to increase minorities in the practice of medicine, and doctors in its community. It’s too early to gauge how well it’s faring, as the first graduates are still making their way through residencies. But while Touro has more than double the number of underrepresented minorities than a typical osteopathic school, only 9 percent are Hispanic and 7 percent black.

 

Last fall, Jemima Akinsanya and fellow minority students were discussing how little they had known about their options for a career in medicine. “We thought it would be great if there were some student-run organization that could reach out and tell other minority students about our experiences,” said Ms. Akinsanya, who was born in Nigeria. With the goal of increasing minority enrollment at Touro, they formed Compass, which stands for Creating Osteopathic Minority Physicians Who Achieve Scholastic Success. Already, the group has held a meet-and-greet at the Apollo and attended college fairs. Ms. Akinsanya accompanied an admission representative to City College, where she says she was inundated with questions. “Osteopathic medicine is still up and coming,” she said. “A lot of people don’t know about D.O.s. Their physician might be one, but they don’t know it.”

 

An osteopathic school like his, Dr. Goldberg said, looks for students with subtly distinctive virtues. They consider students’ record in humanities subjects as well as “what they’ve done with their lives.” Volunteering for a soup kitchen or medical clinic or excelling as a child of a low-income single mother might make up for a lower M.C.A.T. score. “That somebody was able to perform well as an undergraduate given the need of family and survival told us about those grades and M.C.A.T. scores,” Dr. Goldberg said.

 

I met students who reflect the kind of student Touro seeks.

 

Cassandre N. Marseille, a Haitian who moved to New York to study at Stony Brook University, said she Googled “how do you become a physician in the U.S.”

 

“I’d never heard of a D.O.,” she said. “I looked into it and was impressed and liked the approach. When it came time to apply I just applied to D.O. schools.”

 

Ms. Marseille would like one day to practice medicine in Haiti but for the immediate future sees herself working in Harlem. “I still have to pay back debt and won’t be able to do it on a Haitian physician’s salary,” she said. “This is $250,000 of taxpayer money I won’t be able to pay back.”

 

Touro’s current students worry about the debt they are accumulating (tuition and fees at conventional and osteopathic schools are roughly comparable; at Touro, the cost is $45,000 a year) as well as whether there will be a residency for them when they graduate (98 percent of this year’s graduates have been matched).

 

Aldo Manresa, a second-year student and son of Cuban refugees who were part of the 1980 Mariel boatlift, attended Florida International University as a philosophy major but was drawn to medicine. He wants to be a primary-care physician partly because of the shortage. But as with all the students I met, what appealed to him most was the idea of treating patients with his hands — “instead of sending you for prescription medication.”

 

 

 

 

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http://thedo.osteopathic.org/2014/07/house-supports-offering-residency-slots-us-med-school-grads-first/#comment-10393571

 

 

House supports offering residency positions to US med school grads first

 

Posted July 20, 3:27 p.m.

By Rose Raymond / Staff Editor

 

On Saturday, the AOA House of Delegates passed a resolution calling for the profession to advocate for federal legislation to allow U.S. medical school graduates to lay first claims on U.S. residency positions.

 

Members of the New York State Osteopathic Medical Society (NYSOMS), which submitted the resolution, believe that the nation’s residency positions should first be offered to graduates of U.S. medical schools before international medical graduates (IMGs) can secure them.

 

“There’s a collision between the numbers of graduates of U.S. medical schools and the limited number of residency positions currently in the U.S.,” says Robert B. Goldberg, DO, the dean of the Touro College of Osteopathic Medicine in New York. “Soon, those positions will be saturated before we count one internationally trained physician vying for one of the slots.”

 

Steven I. Sherman, DO, the president of NYSOMS, says he wrote the resolution because the numbers of medical students are increasing while U.S. residency positions have remained relatively stagnant.

 

“These students need to have a place to go when they are finished,” says Dr. Sherman, who is an ophthalmologist in New York City. “It doesn’t seem right to me that students should incur a tremendous financial debt and not have any place to go afterward.”

 

The mean reported medical education debt among osteopathic medical school graduates was more than $211,000 last year, according to the American Association of Colleges of Osteopathic Medicine.

 

The number of first-year enrollees to U.S. medical schools increased 30% between 2002 and 2012, The New England Journal of Medicine reported. At roughly the same time, graduate medical education positions grew by just 0.9% each year from 2001 to 2010. U.S. residency positions have remained static because Medicare funds the bulk of them, and Congress capped the number of residency positions nearly two decades ago by passing the Balanced Budget Act of 1997.

 

IMGs comprised a sizable share of the National Resident Matching Program’s 2014 matches. Of nearly 27,000 positions offered, more than 3,600 non-U.S.-citizen IMGs matched, while more than 2,700 IMGs who are U.S. citizens landed positions, according to The ECFMG Reporter.

 

Both Dr. Sherman and Dr. Goldberg, a fellow member of NYSOMS, stress that they have nothing against IMGs.

 

“Some international medical graduates are outstanding,” says Dr. Sherman, a New York delegate. “They are very well-trained. Many of them have done residencies in their own countries, and they come here and they are very fine doctors. But these residency positions are paid for by federal tax dollars, so U.S. citizens should have the first opportunity to fill them.”

 

Without residency training, new physicians—with the exception of those in Missouri—are unable to practice and will likely struggle to find work and pay off their debt. Reserving GME spots for graduates of U.S. medical schools is one action the profession can take to better ensure residency positions for its graduates, Dr. Goldberg says.

 

“When we look at these changes in medical education, we realize the importance and value of these GME positions for every one of our graduates,” Dr. Goldberg says. “Our schools grew in size and number in response to a cry from the federal government and others for the profession to expand. Now that we have done that, we believe that the second part of the bargain is for the responsible persons to provide the graduates we produce with the training they need to become successful practicing physicians.”

 

rraymond@osteopathic.org

 

Sooo... COMSA and I complained hard to the AOA over Ontario's insistence on putting USDOs into their IMG iteration... I honestly wonder (although I have absolutely zero evidence to back it up) if our complaint was one of the final straws that got the AOA to take this resolution... It would basically be what Canada is doing for years.. now implemented by the US Federal government. Who knows, the future is unpredictable.

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Hi

 

Ive been reading through this thread and I am a little confused.

 

If I go to a DO school in the US and complete my residency in the US, can I come back and practice in Canada? I know there are exams and licenses required

 

Just looking for a clear answer

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Hi

 

Ive been reading through this thread and I am a little confused.

 

If I go to a DO school in the US and complete my residency in the US, can I come back and practice in Canada? I know there are exams and licenses required

 

Just looking for a clear answer

 

Yes, you can.

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Any DO applicants please join the following COMSA pages:

1. https://www.facebook.com/groups/COMSA.premed/

2. https://www.facebook.com/groups/COMSA/

Good luck with your applications and interviews.

@medwannabe - you should ask friends or family to look at your essays if you feel the need. May not be a good idea to do it on a forum, as anyone could then copy or submit the same work as yours.

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The next upcoming seminar is:

Where: University  of Waterloo
When: Saturday October 4th 2014 ; 5:00-6:30 PM
Room: Hagley Hall (HH1108)
Who: Anyone who is interested in Osteopathic Medicine in the US. Do not need to be a Waterloo student to attend, all welcome!

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Could someone possible touch on those Canadians that go to DO schools, then further choose to complete DO residency in the united states, and after that would like to pursue working in the US/becoming US citizens?

 

 

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Could someone possible touch on those Canadians that go to DO schools, then further choose to complete DO residency in the united states, and after that would like to pursue working in the US/becoming US citizens?

Very few would do a DO(AOA) residency, as they are not recognized in Canada. With the merger things will change.

 

If you want to stay in the US indefinitely, then your best bet is to try and get an h1b visa, which are hard to get. or a j1 and get some sort of extension through service etc. Talk to an immigration lawyer knowedgeable in visa's.

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Hello everyone! Over the past year, I have greatly expanded the information in this thread and published a book documenting all the experiences I have had on my journey as a premed, to med student, to surviving in med school, to finally successfully matching back home in Canada. I have come across many interesting scenarios throughout my years in undergrad and as a medical student in the US. In this book, I discuss all of my experiences in 188 pages, including how to save time, effort, money and avoiding the most common pitfalls as premeds and medical students. I even included all of my personal statements used during my Canadian residency matching. This is also the first book ever dedicated to Canadians in US osteopathic medical schools!

 

The Guide - A Canadian Perspective on American DO Medical Schools & International Medical Education, now available at:

http://www.blurb.ca/b/5911944-the-guide-a-canadian-perspective-on-american-do-me?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=bookstore-share

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I read the first 15 pages (the free preview) of your book as at one point in time I was interested in pursuing osteopathic medicine. Essentially I read the reality of entrance to medical education in Canada section. 

 

I have a problem with the example you give of your friend who had a high 3.60 and a 31R who got accepted into the University of Manitoba. Immediately after you cite University of Toronto's average accepted GPA of 3.89 and indicate that this person was not even given an interview at University of Toronto and yet was accepted at University of Manitoba because of their In-province status. I agree that there is an advantage having in-province status vs. being an Ontario applicant. However, the distinction is not as drastic as you seem to make it appear.

 

Look at the statistics for the University of Manitoba Class of 2018 in province (MB applicant pool) vs. University of Toronto Class of 2018.

 

University of Manitoba Class of 2018 MB Pool: Average GPA: 4.22/4.5 this translates to about a high 3.8 out of 4. Average MCAT: 11.01 translates to about a 33 MCAT.

 

University of Toronto Class of 2018: Average GPA: 3.94/4.0 Average MCAT: 33

 

So even if someone does have in province status in Manitoba, it does not mean that it is drastically easier for them to be accepted to a medical school! Fact is in Manitoba even if you are an in province applicant, the stats are pretty high! 

 

I do not see the profound unfairness that you talk about in your book! An average accepted student from the University of Manitoba would've likely gotten into another medical school somewhere in North America even if they did not have their in province status. 

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I read the first 15 pages (the free preview) of your book as at one point in time I was interested in pursuing osteopathic medicine. Essentially I read the reality of entrance to medical education in Canada section. 

 

I have a problem with the example you give of your friend who had a high 3.60 and a 31R who got accepted into the University of Manitoba. Immediately after you cite University of Toronto's average accepted GPA of 3.89 and indicate that this person was not even given an interview at University of Toronto and yet was accepted at University of Manitoba because of their In-province status. I agree that there is an advantage having in-province status vs. being an Ontario applicant. However, the distinction is not as drastic as you seem to make it appear.

 

Look at the statistics for the University of Manitoba Class of 2018 in province (MB applicant pool) vs. University of Toronto Class of 2018.

 

University of Manitoba Class of 2018 MB Pool: Average GPA: 4.22/4.5 this translates to about a high 3.8 out of 4. Average MCAT: 11.01 translates to about a 33 MCAT.

 

University of Toronto Class of 2018: Average GPA: 3.94/4.0 Average MCAT: 33

 

So even if someone does have in province status in Manitoba, it does not mean that it is drastically easier for them to be accepted to a medical school! Fact is in Manitoba even if you are an in province applicant, the stats are pretty high! 

 

I do not see the profound unfairness that you talk about in your book! An average accepted student from the University of Manitoba would've likely gotten into another medical school somewhere in North America even if they did not have their in province status. 

I was working with 2008-2009 data, and the difference in stats between UofT (say) and Manitoba was pretty profound (I didn't have any 2013-2014 data to work with when writing that book). The point is, the individual in question got into Manitoba with a mid-high 3.60s, average MCAT, which was quite a bit lower than Ontario averages for the year in question.

 

Even this year, a high 3.80 and a 3.94 UofT average is still quite a difference that could mean the difference between acceptance and no acceptance in this game.

 

 

A difference does exist, although perhaps not as profound in 2014 as you stated.

Keep in mind, this is a FIRST edition of book, I will keep in mind of all the suggestions and comments as time goes by, there will be an updated 2nd edition at some point with updated info and from the feedback I'm getting.

Edited by Mashmetoo

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