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Dual certification in EM and Anesthesiology


Real Beef

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I was looking through the Royal College EM programs and noted that dual certification was a valid option, using one's 4th year to prep for dual certification. Considering the residencies have some cross over (i.e. critical care, surgery, electives in each of EM and Anes.).

 

Is this type of arrangement employable? I cant see a tertiary care hospital being crazy about hiring a 0.5 EM doc/0.5 Anesthetist. Any thoughts on this? I am likely to work in Northern Ontario where there is likely a lot more flexibility in contracts due to physician needs but wanted to get some thoughts on this.

 

Thanks.

 

Beef

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I was looking through the Royal College EM programs and noted that dual certification was a valid option, using one's 4th year to prep for dual certification. Considering the residencies have some cross over (i.e. critical care, surgery, electives in each of EM and Anes.).

 

Is this type of arrangement employable? I cant see a tertiary care hospital being crazy about hiring a 0.5 EM doc/0.5 Anesthetist. Any thoughts on this? I am likely to work in Northern Ontario where there is likely a lot more flexibility in contracts due to physician needs but wanted to get some thoughts on this.

 

Thanks.

 

Beef

 

Really? You can get a full royal college Gas Passer cert. for just doing your EM 4th year in gas electives?

 

That's crazy.

 

If you have you frcpc for Anes, I would imagine you could work most places as a part time gas passer.

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Page 6, in the U of A section gives examples of what EM residents have done in their 4th year.

 

http://caep.ca/sites/default/files/caep/images/frcpc_em_program_profiles_2013.pdf

 

I have heard of dual certifications in the USA which usually requires an extra year or two tagged onto your residency but had never heard of it in Canada prior to running into this small amount of text.

 

Beef

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I was looking through the Royal College EM programs and noted that dual certification was a valid option, using one's 4th year to prep for dual certification. Considering the residencies have some cross over (i.e. critical care, surgery, electives in each of EM and Anes.).

 

Is this type of arrangement employable? I cant see a tertiary care hospital being crazy about hiring a 0.5 EM doc/0.5 Anesthetist. Any thoughts on this? I am likely to work in Northern Ontario where there is likely a lot more flexibility in contracts due to physician needs but wanted to get some thoughts on this.

 

Thanks.

 

Beef

 

I know of one anesthetist formerly at Dal and now moved to Edmonton who has this dual certification, though I'm not aware that he actually practices EM (he's an airway guy).

 

Anyway, it's not remotely sufficient to use part or all of a 4th year in EM to complete Royal College requirements in anesthesia, which amount to at least 30 months of anesthesia and a year of medicine/ICU. Not impossible, but not especially feasible either.

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Perhaps using part or all of 4th year is the wrong terminology. I think the right phrasing would be to say that directing your 4th year in the direction of anesthesia as well as your other elective time for this purpose. For example I looked at the U of A FRCP EM and they have the following:

 

PGY 1 - 4 weeks anesth.

PGY 2 - 2 weeks peds anesth. + 10 weeks elective time

PGY 3 - 4 weeks elective time

PGY 4 & 5- 52 weeks elective time

 

PGY 1-5 - 36 weeks Medicine/ICU

 

So eyeballing as such it looks possible if a person knew early on that they wanted a dual certification outcome and directed their elective time for teh attainment of the necessary requirements that you mentioned.

 

Beef

 

I know of one anesthetist formerly at Dal and now moved to Edmonton who has this dual certification, though I'm not aware that he actually practices EM (he's an airway guy).

 

Anyway, it's not remotely sufficient to use part or all of a 4th year in EM to complete Royal College requirements in anesthesia, which amount to at least 30 months of anesthesia and a year of medicine/ICU. Not impossible, but not especially feasible either.

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I was looking through the Royal College EM programs and noted that dual certification was a valid option, using one's 4th year to prep for dual certification. Considering the residencies have some cross over (i.e. critical care, surgery, electives in each of EM and Anes.).

 

Is this type of arrangement employable? I cant see a tertiary care hospital being crazy about hiring a 0.5 EM doc/0.5 Anesthetist. Any thoughts on this? I am likely to work in Northern Ontario where there is likely a lot more flexibility in contracts due to physician needs but wanted to get some thoughts on this.

 

Thanks.

 

Beef

 

There is a staff where I am that is FR EM and has +1 anesthesia and works full-time EM and a few anesthesia days.

 

A resident in my year was going to do the same but then decided against, although has still done a considerable amount of anesthesiology as an area of interest.

 

If your EM program allows you to do a full R4 year doing your +1 then it could be possible. Not all programs will and the amount of elective time in the EM program is getting smaller.

 

If you want dual FR certification it will likely take you longer than 5 years.

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There is a staff where I am that is FR EM and has +1 anesthesia and works full-time EM and a few anesthesia days.

 

A resident in my year was going to do the same but then decided against, although has still done a considerable amount of anesthesiology as an area of interest.

 

If your EM program allows you to do a full R4 year doing your +1 then it could be possible. Not all programs will and the amount of elective time in the EM program is getting smaller.

 

If you want dual FR certification it will likely take you longer than 5 years.

 

Man, and here I am sweating getting one royal college certification. I feel like an underachiever.

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I agree they do seem quite different. Just considering different things.

 

Personally I don't see the attraction, but then I also don't find that EM and anesthesia are especially intellectually similar. In the OR it's all about consistency, procedure, and thinking ahead to any unexpected events to mitigate risk.

 

Anyway, this is the guy I was mentioning.

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Man, and here I am sweating getting one royal college certification. I feel like an underachiever.

 

 

lol. Yeah, I have no idea why anyone would want to write 2 royal college exams. I can wholeheartedly say I don't even want to write the one I am currently prepping for!

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