What They Don't Tell You Before Getting Into Medicine.

[sdj78we9jtf2o3mgfvj298j]

This was something I needed to read, thank you for being brave enough to share.

[bruhh]

Thank you for you great post. I think reading about med students' experiences can be very helpful. I have had my doubts of pursuing med but I honestly can't think of anything else I would do. 

 

I feel like I did experience a little bit of the things that everyone talks about med school. I've constantly been sucking up to profs, TA's, and stressed about getting A+'s in every course during undergrad. I think my bigger fear is not looking dumb in front of others, or being "pimp'd" but rather not performing adequately enough to qualify as a decent physician. Do performances during rotation Q & A's correlate with actual performance as a physician? I want to know if i should be worried if i'mg getting "put in my place" too many times during med school. I can suffer through it all as long as I know I will be fine in the end. I hope this makes sense.

[feversugar]

Great post, interesting read. I think one of the toughest things in Medicine is the inherent pressure of always having to be your best, and feeling like mistakes are unacceptable. It's too difficult to be ok with not giving your 110% when you know there's someone else just waiting to give their 150% (which then makes a vicious circle and everybody is miserable)... Not sure if that made sense lol.

[shikimate]

I think many physicians in ON feel the same, given how the politicians simply treat you as nothing more than pylons 

 

waitlist list too long? Your fault for not working hard enough.

 

Then FFS exceed budget? Your fault for working too hard and billing too much. 

 

Can't stress this enough: document everything, all possible side effects/risks, even if just mentioned in passing. If a patient is hostile, document it thoroughly. If parents are hostile, document it. If their SDM is hostile, document it. If patient refuse treatment, meds, exam, question, etc. Document it, bold it, italicize it, box it. Make sure you document everything you offered, no matter how little. Don't want BW? document patient refused BW. Patient want to sleep and not talk? Document it. If there's a computer glitch that day, document it.

 

If it's not your fault there's long waitlist or something went wrong, document it, and make sure you add a politesse saying you will "do everything in your power to get the surgery booked ASAP" etc

 

I hope med students are taught more on investing and money management, so less physicians can be in the cycle or trying to work more just to make up for money that are stolen from them.

 

btw I can't emphasize this enough: get your USMLE steps out of the way before residency (and I believe now you don't even need 1 yr of residency for step 3 anymore)

[Lactic Folly]

Thank you for you great post. I think reading about med students' experiences can be very helpful. I have had my doubts of pursuing med but I honestly can't think of anything else I would do. 

 

I feel like I did experience a little bit of the things that everyone talks about med school. I've constantly been sucking up to profs, TA's, and stressed about getting A+'s in every course during undergrad. I think my bigger fear is not looking dumb in front of others, or being "pimp'd" but rather not performing adequately enough to qualify as a decent physician. Do performances during rotation Q & A's correlate with actual performance as a physician? I want to know if i should be worried if i'mg getting "put in my place" too many times during med school. I can suffer through it all as long as I know I will be fine in the end. I hope this makes sense.

Certainly, performance during rotation Q & A's does not necessarily correlate with performance as a physician. Situations where questions are posed to a group of students do not tend to favour those who are quiet, introverted, or hesitant about appearing to show up their peers. These students may do quite well though if assessed individually or in writing.

 

There is also the consideration that someone being "put in their place" may result from factors to do with the assessor as much as the student (external stressors, personalities not meshing well). That being said, it is also important to recognize when actual valid feedback for improvement is being given.  

 

Have you been good at self-assessment in the past (predicting your performance, knowing where your strengths and weaknesses are)? This will help you tell the difference.

[a1b1]

Many of the things OP said are sadly true. I do believe the culture in medecine is changing, attendings dont seem to be as harsh to us "newbies/clerk1", but every once in a while you will run into an a-hole attending who just wont like you no matter what you do, and believe me when that happens you need to be ready for it. Most students will at least run into 1 situation like this through-out their clerkship. Some people wont bounce back from it, every once in a while you hear of a case where a med student quit for X reasons, and those X reasons end up being harassement/bullying or e.t.c. As a 3rd year clerk you're essentially at the bottom of the totem pole/useless, so you need to be prepared with the image that it will bring you, also you need to keep in mind that an elective at the most is 1 month, so even if an attending is a jerk or gives you a bad grade, w/e there will be another elective next month. Clerkship is very subjective, the grade you get is entirely based by what the attending feels like or believes in. For example, if you get an attending who doesent believe in giving out A+, then your never gonna get a good grade no matter how well you perform. If you get an attending who doesent care about evaluations and just wants to give you pass, you may get the bare minimum passing grade. The other side of the coin is also true, sometimes you're gonna run into an attending who likes to make people happy, so he might give you an A+ for absolutely no reason, even if you performed average.

[Guest1]

I just got accepted to medical school this year. Would you say that this culture happens across the country? Say for example if i got to choose between UofA and UBC with the Southern Medical program or Island medical program, since they're newer programs, UBC says there are newer teachers etc, would the shame based learning be less there than UofA? Or would you expect it to be similar? 

[JohnGrisham]

I just got accepted to medical school this year. Would you say that this culture happens across the country? Say for example if i got to choose between UofA and UBC with the Southern Medical program or Island medical program, since they're newer programs, UBC says there are newer teachers etc, would the shame based learning be less there than UofA? Or would you expect it to be similar? 

I would not let that be a deciding factor between schools. WAY too much variability.

 

It should be very low on your list when deciding between schools. Much more important things like location, support networks, curriculum style etc.

[pulsar93]

Good post, definitely some food for thought. Can anyone recommend some further reading on this subject?

[osteogenesis]

want a pat on the back op?

[youngdad]

I just got accepted to medical school this year. Would you say that this culture happens across the country? Say for example if i got to choose between UofA and UBC with the Southern Medical program or Island medical program, since they're newer programs, UBC says there are newer teachers etc, would the shame based learning be less there than UofA? Or would you expect it to be similar? 

IMP was good.  Shame was brought upon the preceptors who shamed.  Then they stopped.

Medicine is hard work.  Sometimes what is interpreted to be shame is simply a stressed out attending who works very hard and wants to get to the point.  Teaching is hard work, and its extra work they are expected to do.  It slows them down.  What's wrong with doing some scut work for an attending?  I am not condoning mistreatment, I'm just suggesting that students are allowed to choose not to be offended by physicians and residents who are grumpy.  

I have seen many attending physicians mistreated by students and residents...

[youngdad]

want a pat on the back op?

What's this?

[guacamole]

 

Consider dentistry, though.

 

 

I graduated from dental school four years ago. I can write almost the exact same post that you wrote about medicine. I also made the decision to quit a few months ago, so I totally understand you and then some. The thing is, all young professionals are going through similar issues. I know that was a flippant comment, but grass is always greener on the other side. I feel sorry for the people entering into these professions with rose tinted glasses, but YMMV.

[skye204]

I graduated from dental school four years ago. I can write almost the exact same post that you wrote about medicine. I also made the decision to quit a few months ago, so I totally understand you and then some. The thing is, all young professionals are going through similar issues. I know that was a flippant comment, but grass is always greener on the other side. I feel sorry for the people entering into these professions with rose tinted glasses, but YMMV.

Could you please share your story?

[MarloStanfield]

I think many physicians in ON feel the same, given how the politicians simply treat you as nothing more than pylons 

 

waitlist list too long? Your fault for not working hard enough.

 

Then FFS exceed budget? Your fault for working too hard and billing too much. 

 

Can't stress this enough: document everything, all possible side effects/risks, even if just mentioned in passing. If a patient is hostile, document it thoroughly. If parents are hostile, document it. If their SDM is hostile, document it. If patient refuse treatment, meds, exam, question, etc. Document it, bold it, italicize it, box it. Make sure you document everything you offered, no matter how little. Don't want BW? document patient refused BW. Patient want to sleep and not talk? Document it. If there's a computer glitch that day, document it.

 

If it's not your fault there's long waitlist or something went wrong, document it, and make sure you add a politesse saying you will "do everything in your power to get the surgery booked ASAP" etc

 

I hope med students are taught more on investing and money management, so less physicians can be in the cycle or trying to work more just to make up for money that are stolen from them.

 

btw I can't emphasize this enough: get your USMLE steps out of the way before residency (and I believe now you don't even need 1 yr of residency for step 3 anymore)

This is very interesting, do you have any other experiences that you can share? Information like this is hard to come by, I really appreciate the truth about the field and profession.

[Mithrandir]

This is really sad. I think this is one of the reasons I'm strongly considering becoming a nurse practitioner and just not even applying to med. So many of us do two degrees, second undergrads, masters degrees, apply 2, 3, 4 etc. times, and really just work our asses off trying to be the very best and impress all the people so that we may one day get that med school acceptance that we put on such a pedestal. But that's not it, that's just the beginning of another decade of working our asses off, sacrificing so much, and constant stress and probably giant debt.

It sounds exhausting.

And at the end of the day, it's just a job.

[_ _]

This is really sad. I think this is one of the reasons I'm strongly considering becoming a nurse practitioner and just not even applying to med. So many of us do two degrees, second undergrads, masters degrees, apply 2, 3, 4 etc. times, and really just work our asses off trying to be the very best and impress all the people so that we may one day get that med school acceptance that we put on such a pedestal. But that's not it, that's just the beginning of another decade of working our asses off, sacrificing so much, and constant stress and probably giant debt.

It sounds exhausting.

And at the end of the day, it's just a job.

Wise words. Don't get me wrong, I couldn't be more ecstatic and thrilled about starting med school in the fall, but I agree 100% that sometimes people put medicine on too much of a pedestal. Not to target those who do 2 degrees, apply 5 times...those people have the kind of tenacity and dedication we need in doctors, but I feel like people put too much of their personal worth on the line. .

 

Obviously there are some significant differences between MD and PA or NP's, etc., but day to day, I'm not so sure that personal happiness and satisfaction on the job  vary as such as some people act like it will