CASPer Requirement

[vikym]

Just wondering what everyone thinks about the fact that McGill is now using CASPer? 

I'm planning on doing a full length practice CASPer test every weekend starting July so hopefully that will pay off compared those are just going to write the test without any preparation.

[SunAndMoon]

I doubt that'll help you much

[Haribo7173]

Is McGill actually thinking of using CASPer ?? It's in talks for the French schools, but I didn't know McGill was considering it too.

[SunAndMoon]

McGill is currently one of the schools listed on the Takecasper website, which suggests that they will be implementing it but how it will be evaluated (or whether it will be evaluated at all the first year) is still unknown. It could be a test year, it could be used with the CVPN (which means its weight would not be significant), or it could replace the CVPN altogether

[Haribo7173]

Damn, thanks for the info!

Curious to see how it'll all go down.

[Jess85]

18 hours ago, Haribo7173 said:

Is McGill actually thinking of using CASPer ?? It's in talks for the French schools, but I didn't know McGill was considering it too.

The French schools have already started using the french version of CASPer which is dubbed TECT.  Not surprising that McGill is adopting CASPer but the more important question will be how they'll use the results and how much weighting they're going to give to CASPer.

[Haribo7173]

6 minutes ago, Jess85 said:

The French schools have already started using the french version of CASPer which is dubbed TECT.  Not surprising that McGill is adopting CASPer but the more important question will be how they'll use the results and how much weighting they're going to give to CASPer.

UdeM used it for all health doctorates except medicine this year. Apparently it's going to be used for med next year. ULaval and USherbrooke are likely to follow.

The CASPer actually replaced the MMI at ULaval because workers went on strike. Don't think that'll be the case next year; most likely it'll just be an addition.

[Jess85]

I didn't realize UdeM delayed the rollout?  I know Laval is using it for medicine for sure.  

[Haribo7173]

11 minutes ago, Jess85 said:

I didn't realize UdeM delayed the rollout?  I know Laval is using it for medicine for sure.  

Yup.

"TECT will be used to assess all students applying to dentistry, veterinary medicine, pharmacy, optometry and medicine. Students applying to all those programs will have to take the test starting now for their fall 2017 applications, with the exception of medicine, which will only institute the change for 2018."

http://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/u-de-m-institutes-new-screening-tool-for-medicine-and-health-sciences-students

[vikym]

On ‎6‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 6:17 PM, SunAndMoon said:

I doubt that'll help you much

Good.  I wish more people on here would post comments like this to deter applicants from preparing for CASPer like you did. 

[Looktoabove]

4 hours ago, vikym said:

Good.  I wish more people on here would post comments like this to deter applicants from preparing for CASPer like you did. 

SunAndMoon is a good person, some statements can be taken out of context and may be their opinion, similar to some people who honestly don't prep for mmi's, I over prepared this year and my ranking dropped dramatically, each person is different.

[SunAndMoon]

Let me explain why I think it is unhelpful. I do not believe practicing extensively and trying to fit into a mold will help people succeed on Casper. Anyone who has taken knows that the ethical situations presented are not extreme in ambiguity and difficulty. Often they are clear cut. Other times multiple answers can be appropriate if balanced but need to be justified properly (the good old consequentialism vs deontology). Most applicants have the moral compass to deal with these situations appropriately, and will respond appropriately as well. There is therefore a sea of applicants saying the same things about the same issues, yet they must be ranked. What will make you stand out is not a course or the evaluation of some person with no credible credentials (or some people who prey on applicants on online forums either, or who post fake reviews on their website and facebook pages) who will give the same advice to all applicants, basically turning their responses into cookie cutter paragraphs. 

If you must prepare, and you should, you need to get familiar with the process, you need to work on responding to prompts in a clear and structured manner, and, most importantly, you need to reflect on your own experiences. Obviously, none of these things will cost you any money, let alone hundreds or thousands of dollars from dishonest online scammers. 

I'm surprised to see that my intentions are being questioned. The aggressiveness of some of the people who have posted in this thread, and who have a track record of quasi-exclusively posting about Casper is interesting to say the least... That being said, I apologize for my initial post, it was short and unhelpful. Hopefully what I just wrote will provide some explanation as to why I do not think prep companies will help you for Casper. 

[MacMed2018]

10 hours ago, SunAndMoon said:

Let me explain why I think it is unhelpful. I do not believe practicing extensively and trying to fit into a mold will help people succeed on Casper. Anyone who has taken knows that the ethical situations presented are not extreme in ambiguity and difficulty. Often they are clear cut. Other times multiple answers can be appropriate if balanced but need to be justified properly (the good old consequentialism vs deontology). Most applicants have the moral compass to deal with these situations appropriately, and will respond appropriately as well. There is therefore a sea of applicants saying the same things about the same issues, yet they must be ranked. What will make you stand out is not a course or the evaluation of some person with no credible credentials (or some people who prey on applicants on online forums either, or who post fake reviews on their website and facebook pages) who will give the same advice to all applicants, basically turning their responses into cookie cutter paragraphs. 

If you must prepare, and you should, you need to get familiar with the process, you need to work on responding to prompts in a clear and structured manner, and, most importantly, you need to reflect on your own experiences. Obviously, none of these things will cost you any money, let alone hundreds or thousands of dollars from dishonest online scammers. 

I'm surprised to see that my intentions are being questioned. The aggressiveness of some of the people who have posted in this thread, and who have a track record of quasi-exclusively posting about Casper is interesting to say the least... That being said, I apologize for my initial post, it was short and unhelpful. Hopefully what I just wrote will provide some explanation as to why I do not think prep companies will help you for Casper. 

When I wrote CASPer (a few years ago now), I personally felt that while on the surface many of the questions seemed as though they had "obvious" answers, they were not.  Many of my current classmates agree and felt the same way about the test back then.  I've since gone on to grade the test for a few years now it's definitely true that the answers are not as simple as they may seem. 

I know your comments are well intended but I can't imagine any applicant going in to write CASPer without being familiar with the process.  In my experience, one of the problems is that examinees do not know how to properly self reflect (or at least write about it properly).  You can clearly tell when you grade CASPer which answers are excellent, not so good and just down right terrible. 

When the MMI first came out, many people had the same attitude about preparing and now we see it carried over into CASPer.  AAMC is currently studying the coaching and practice effects on SJTs because it's there.  I do not think anyone should be spending thousands of dollars on a course to prepare for CASPer especially since there's a lot of bad CASPer resources for sale.

However, much in the same way that the OP is weary of prep companies (there are some valid concerns.... although I see you did post about using TPR etc..), I would also be weary receiving advice from anyone who is still trying to get admitted to med school.   Out of the ~200 in my class, I'm sure there are many that got in without doing a single practice CASPer test (and kudos to them if that's the case), but of the ~60 or so people I've gotten to know on a closer level, they're not afraid to admit (like me) that they all benefited from sharpening their skills/time management by doing practice tests in advance.  At the end of the day, every premed wants to end up in the same place, but getting there is completely differently story.   Good luck!

[vikym]

21 hours ago, Looktoabove said:

SunAndMoon is a good person, some statements can be taken out of context and may be their opinion, similar to some people who honestly don't prep for mmi's, I over prepared this year and my ranking dropped dramatically, each person is different.

I'm just curious to know how you were able to find out that your CASPer ranking dropped dramatically because I thought that applicants never see their rank?

[vikym]

1 hour ago, MacMed2018 said:

When I wrote CASPer (a few years ago now), I personally felt that while on the surface many of the questions seemed as though they had "obvious" answers, they were not.  Many of my current classmates agree and felt the same way about the test back then.  I've since gone on to grade the test for a few years now it's definitely true that the answers are not as simple as they may seem. 

I know your comments are well intended but I can't imagine any applicant going in to write CASPer without being familiar with the process.  In my experience, one of the problems is that examinees do not know how to properly self reflect (or at least write about it properly).  You can clearly tell when you grade CASPer which answers are excellent, not so good and just down right terrible. 

When the MMI first came out, many people had the same attitude about preparing and now we see it carried over into CASPer.  AAMC is currently studying the coaching and practice effects on SJTs because it's there.  I do not think anyone should be spending thousands of dollars on a course to prepare for CASPer especially since there's a lot of bad CASPer resources for sale.

However, much in the same way that the OP is weary of prep companies (there are some valid concerns.... although I see you did post about using TPR etc..), I would also be weary receiving advice from anyone who is still trying to get admitted to med school.   Out of the ~200 in my class, I'm sure there are many that got in without doing a single practice CASPer test (and kudos to them if that's the case), but of the ~60 or so people I've gotten to know on a closer level, they're not afraid to admit (like me) that they all benefited from sharpening their skills/time management by doing practice tests in advance.  At the end of the day, every premed wants to end up in the same place, but getting there is completely differently story.   Good luck!

MacMed2018, I know you mean well, but we need more premeds like Sun and Moon discouraging other premeds from using practice CASPer tests. 

 

[SunAndMoon]

1 hour ago, vikym said:

I'm just curious to know how you were able to find out that your CASPer ranking dropped dramatically because I thought that applicants never see their rank?

That is not what they said. Please re-read their post. Also, for someone who really doesn't want other people to prep so you could stand out more, you're really advocating for practicing. Your pitch is terrible.

2 hours ago, MacMed2018 said:

When I wrote CASPer (a few years ago now), I personally felt that while on the surface many of the questions seemed as though they had "obvious" answers, they were not.  Many of my current classmates agree and felt the same way about the test back then.  I've since gone on to grade the test for a few years now it's definitely true that the answers are not as simple as they may seem. 

I know your comments are well intended but I can't imagine any applicant going in to write CASPer without being familiar with the process.  In my experience, one of the problems is that examinees do not know how to properly self reflect (or at least write about it properly).  You can clearly tell when you grade CASPer which answers are excellent, not so good and just down right terrible. 

When the MMI first came out, many people had the same attitude about preparing and now we see it carried over into CASPer.  AAMC is currently studying the coaching and practice effects on SJTs because it's there.  I do not think anyone should be spending thousands of dollars on a course to prepare for CASPer especially since there's a lot of bad CASPer resources for sale.

However, much in the same way that the OP is weary of prep companies (there are some valid concerns.... although I see you did post about using TPR etc..), I would also be weary receiving advice from anyone who is still trying to get admitted to med school.   Out of the ~200 in my class, I'm sure there are many that got in without doing a single practice CASPer test (and kudos to them if that's the case), but of the ~60 or so people I've gotten to know on a closer level, they're not afraid to admit (like me) that they all benefited from sharpening their skills/time management by doing practice tests in advance.  At the end of the day, every premed wants to end up in the same place, but getting there is completely differently story.   Good luck!

I never said not to take a practice test. There are a couple of free ones or free sample stations out there. They are typically samples on prep companies' website, and that is all you should need IMO. No need to spend money to be evaluated and have your answers be coached. What you will learn from taking sample questions, tests or stations is that you should be structured, clear and concise in the manner that you speak. You have not added much to what I said. What makes an excellent answer excellent? Can you comment on that? 

As to the MMI, most people I know did not spend hundreds or thousands in preparing MMIs. Instead, we met up among friends and discussed scenarios and practiced together. The Casper scenarios are not more ethically ambiguous or challenging than MMI scenarios. I very strongly disagree with your assessment that "many of the questions [on the surface] seemed obvious", but were not. Even if they were, what will a prep course or a sample test give you to learn to identify the hidden issues? I did not learn to deal with ethical issues by practicing for the MMI. I learned that in life, at work, doing the things that got me to where I am in the first place. 

I posted about TPR in the context of the MCAT, yes. You need books to study, an overwhelming majority of applicants have used books from any prep company. The objectives and modalities of evaluations of the MCAT are clear, MCAT prep companies follow them to provide students with the content in a concise manner. Comparing MCAT prep to MMI prep or Casper prep is ludicrous. 

You and your friends can now stop with the whole "don't take advice from someone who didn't get in". I am getting increasingly frustrated with these disrespectful and belittling comments. I actually got in. Am I part of your little club now or what?

[Haribo7173]

1 hour ago, SunAndMoon said:

You and your friends can now stop with the whole "don't take advice from someone who didn't get in". I am getting increasingly frustrated with these disrespectful and belittling comments. I actually got in. Am I part of your little club now or what?

My man!

[vikym]

23 hours ago, SunAndMoon said:

That is not what they said. Please re-read their post. Also, for someone who really doesn't want other people to prep so you could stand out more, you're really advocating for practicing. Your pitch is terrible.

I never said not to take a practice test. There are a couple of free ones or free sample stations out there. They are typically samples on prep companies' website, and that is all you should need IMO. No need to spend money to be evaluated and have your answers be coached. What you will learn from taking sample questions, tests or stations is that you should be structured, clear and concise in the manner that you speak. You have not added much to what I said. What makes an excellent answer excellent? Can you comment on that? 

As to the MMI, most people I know did not spend hundreds or thousands in preparing MMIs. Instead, we met up among friends and discussed scenarios and practiced together. The Casper scenarios are not more ethically ambiguous or challenging than MMI scenarios. I very strongly disagree with your assessment that "many of the questions [on the surface] seemed obvious", but were not. Even if they were, what will a prep course or a sample test give you to learn to identify the hidden issues? I did not learn to deal with ethical issues by practicing for the MMI. I learned that in life, at work, doing the things that got me to where I am in the first place. 

I posted about TPR in the context of the MCAT, yes. You need books to study, an overwhelming majority of applicants have used books from any prep company. The objectives and modalities of evaluations of the MCAT are clear, MCAT prep companies follow them to provide students with the content in a concise manner. Comparing MCAT prep to MMI prep or Casper prep is ludicrous. 

You and your friends can now stop with the whole "don't take advice from someone who didn't get in". I am getting increasingly frustrated with these disrespectful and belittling comments. I actually got in. Am I part of your little club now or what?

I'm simply agreeing with you that I wish more applicants took your advice regarding CASPer.  Just because I'm going to practice for CASPer, doesn't mean I want other people doing it so if by me telling people they should follow your advice and not practice, you misinterpret them into that I'm advocating that others should be practicing, then you're pitch is one and the same. 

So just two days after posting that you didn't get in, you actually got in.  How magical ....

[vikym]

I wish you would stop weaving your words ....your direct comment to my initial post in this thread about doing practice casper tests was .. " I doubt that'll help you much" ...  You made it clear you believe I'm wasting my time by doing practice tests .... so don't try to change things around now by saying "I never said not to take a practice test".  

 

[SunAndMoon]

17 minutes ago, vikym said:

 

So just two days after posting that you didn't get in, you actually got in.  How magical ....

My life's a fairy tale buddy 

[vikym]

Just now, SunAndMoon said:

My life's a fairy tale buddy 

That's great.  May you live happily ever after in your fairy tale life.

[Haribo7173]

22 minutes ago, vikym said:

So just two days after posting that you didn't get in, you actually got in.  How magical ....

Because he literally just got in?

[vikym]

Seems anyone can get in when they lead a fairy tale life though

[palefire]

7 hours ago, vikym said:

Seems anyone can get in when they lead a fairy tale life though

The dark side of the fairy tale life is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural 

[Haribo7173]

Coming Soon…

Updates to the application requirements and selection process for Fall 2018 admission will be posted soon!  Be the first to know and follow us on Twitter. The application system for Fall 2018 admission opens September 1st 2017. 

https://www.mcgill.ca/medadmissions/applying