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  1. I decided to make this thread for applicants that are thinking of, or have already started, working towards a second degree in the hopes of applying to McGill. I found McGill's website to be quite jumbled regarding this topic, so hopefully that information can be summarized here in a clear and concise way. If you notice any errors, please comment below and I will edit this post accordingly. I would also encourage second degree applicants to ask their questions here, if only for the sake of keeping information in one easily accessible place. Basic Science Prerequisites & the MCAT: The MCAT is not required to apply to McGill, but if you have already completed the basic science prerequisites, it may be in your best interest to write the exam. Every applicant MUST complete the prerequisites by January 15th of the year they plan to start medical school, and a maximum of two prerequisites can still be outstanding by the application deadline (November 1st). However, if your pre-requisite science GPA (sGPA) is significantly below the average of 3.80, then a strong MCAT score can be used in its place. Currently, a competitive MCAT is a 33, and this score should be as close to 'balanced' as possible (11/11/11). *Pre-requisite courses 'expire' after eight years, so make sure to repeat those courses if they will exceed the eight year mark by November 1st. List of Prerequisites: 6 Credits Biology (Introductory) w/ Labs 6 Credits Chemistry (General or Physical) w/ Labs 3 Credits Organic Chemistry w/ Lab 6 Credits Physics (Introductory) w/ Labs GPA: Before we get into GPA, it's important to emphasize that you are NOT a second degree applicant unless you COMPLETED your first degree. For example, if you left your first degree early and pursued another degree, then the following information will not apply to you. Your GPA will instead be calculated based on every course you have completed, in both degrees. Those who have completed a degree, and are now working towards another, will have their GPA calculated differently then applicants in their 'primary' degree. For starters, even if you received transfer credit from your first degree, those courses will NOT be included in the GPA calculation. Only the courses you have completed while enrolled in the second degree will be considered. The year you apply, you must have completed at least 45 credits (15 courses) before the application deadline (November 1st), and at least 60 credits AND your degree by July 1st. This means that your second degree needs to take at least two years to complete, but if you were paying attention to the deadlines, you'll realize that if it only takes you two years, you likely won't be able to apply until after you've graduated. There are ways to get around this (i.e. overloading semesters, spring/summer courses, etc), but keep in mind that you need to maintain a competitive GPA, so don't get overzealous. On that note, a competitive GPA is a 3.80, but if you're an OOP applicant there's a limited number of seats. **Those 60 credits need to be completed in consecutive years or you risk your application being rejected Conclusion: This concludes the second degree specific information. I hope it will provide some insight for future applicants and help you move one step closer to achieving your medical school goals. Good luck! Class Profiles - Admissions - Accepted/Rejected/Waitlisted Thread - Admission FAQs - Dark
  2. Hello Everyone/Salut tout le monde! I am a Quebec university student who is graduating from undergrad this semester. I’m planning on applying to a DESS (Diplôme d’études supérieures spécialisées) program at Université de Montréal before applying to Medicine and Pharmacy next application cycle. Let's cut to the chase: I’m wondering if being part of a DESS program will significantly hurt my chances of being accepted to the Quebec Medical schools, compared to a full-on Masters degree. Pros to the DESS (in my opinion): DESS programs are only 1 year of full time study, and many of them offer doing an additional year of directed study or a stage somewhere. Upon completing the additional year, I would graduate with a full Masters degree. Research isn’t really my favourite, and I would prefer to do a more application-based program, but not if it will hurt my chances, or not improve my chances, at getting into Med/Pharm . Cons to the DESS (possibly?): When I apply during the next application cycle, they will see that I have been working on a DESS instead of a Masters degree (not sure if this one counts as a Con or not, that's why I'm asking here!). I haven’t seen this discussed anywhere else, so if anyone has anecdotes or feedback of any kind to share about this situation, I would really appreciate them!
  3. Did anyone do a second degree through TRU or Athabasca? I did think of going back to UBC, but I'm in my late 20s, and want to upgrade my GPA while making money to sustain myself. I know "easy" is relative, but in your experience are the courses manageable to get a high GPA? Which programs do you recommend?
  4. I’ll start by unapologetically saying that I wasn’t given a fair chance in life in regards to pursuing my academic ambitions (specifically my 1st undergraduate degree years). During my first degree I had 2 brothers that had strokes and passed away. I was routinely involved in caring for them and had to juggle school at the same time. Sadly my academic standing suffered greatly due to these family issues. Anyhow, I’m living a new life now and things have settled. I am no longer in depression related to my brothers deaths and want to continue to pursue my dream of becoming a doctor. I would like you to be 100% honest. How good or bad are my chances to get accepted to medical schools either in America or Canada if the following situations pans out? My plan: - Previous degree cgpa 2.7 - New degree: I’ve just been accepted to York for a 3 year undergrad (due to my transfer credits) - Suppose I do well in the new degree (3.8+ gpa for 3 years), score well on the mcat and have good EC. Also would my story of caring for my disabled brothers assist me in any way? What I mean is they were disabled and I am passionate about caring for disabled people. I did volunteering related to this also. Is getting a second degree and pursuing medicine in this manner a good plan or not? I don’t want to get started just to find out at the end that all my work was worth nothing. I feel like I have been forever stained by my first degrees gpa and that no medical school will take me seriously. I believe I have a legitimate case that could be made in saying that my first degrees low gpa was directly related to the amount of time I spent caring for my brothers. Is it possible to have my new degree only considered in the GPA process? Especially for American schools since they consider trends. thank you
  5. Hey y'all, I have recently found the desire to pursue medicine in my mid-20s, I am currently an Emergency Department RN and working in this setting, seeing what Physicians do an their expanded scope of practise has given me a strong desire to pursue a career in medicine. However, during my undergrad I was not focused on this, I had a full time job as well as the demands of nursing school so my cGPA was around a 3.38 (Best two years were not great either, did not break 3.6). So that being said I have been considering a second degree, however I don't want to do a degree just for the sake of it because I know my heart won't be in it. I am currently applying for Physician Assistant (I had gotten admission in the past but was unable to attend due to financial difficulties at that time) and I am wondering if I do well in the program, will I be in good standing for medical school in Ontario? Any guidance and feedback would be appreciated. For those interested, why PA? Well it follows the medical model and the education pathway is more attractive to me vs the NP route, as well, if I never get in to Medicine, I can see myself being happy as a PA. I work with both NPs and Pas so seeing the nuances of their practise and opportunities really informed my decision.
  6. I am determined to attend medical school in Canada. Would love any advice regarding the few options I have Currently studying for the MCAT and going into the fourth year of my honours Science undergrad- 1st year GPA 3.21 (technically 4.5 course load, including my initial grade and my improved grade for my 1 repeated course) 2nd year GPA 3.44 3rd year GPA 3.63 I'm assuming these are my options (based on years of obsessive research on forums lmao): 1) Do a 5th year. Attain 3.8+ in year 4 & 5. Apply to Western in my 5th year. If unsuccessful, complete a master's program. Apply again to Western and Queen's (perhaps Ottawa?) Any other schools I would have a chance at? 2) Do a second undergraduate degree and open up doors to other schools. Could do this after completing my degree in four years or after doing the additional 5th year. I am studying hard for the MCAT and would say I have unique ECs. I appreciate any honest insight (optimistic/pessimistic). Thank you in advance!
  7. Hello everyone! Have been a lurker for quite sometime and really need advice for future steps. I am currently in 3rd year with a cGPA of 3.74, with this year sitting around a 3.9. I have pass/fail courses in my program so that kind of ruins me for UofT weighting, but thats about it. I am certain I can finish 4th year with a 3.95+ as well. Therefore IF I finish my 4th year with 4.0 my cGPA will sit around a 3.83 and with a 5th year (if 4.0) then that would put me around a 3.86. Therefore my question being should I finish my degree at 4th year and then pursue a second degree? or is a cGPA of 3.86 competitive enough for Ontario medical schools? I know a 4.0 in the 2 years is a stretch but I can certain I can do well; also I have not yet written the MCAT. Thanks for all your help!
  8. Hi everyone, I have been seeing a lot of mixed answers to what cGPA a second undergrad would be considered necessary/highly recommended. So according to your opinion, what is the cGPA that work experience/grad school can't really make up for? This is assuming that the applicant would only want to go to medicine, nothing else as a career choice, but is flexible enough to like research/work.
  9. Hi everyone, Does anyone have any experience with the Queen's BSc life sciences distance learning program? Or their 4 year health sciences program? This will be my second degree so I'm not sure if this is the forum that I ask this in. But being that the distance learning programs from Queen's is newer, I haven't seen anyone talk about them yet... On any forum. I'm an Albertan, and I have the option of doing Athabasca or Queen's for their distance learning programs. Anybody with experience in either? Would love to hear what you guys think.
  10. Hi there! Are you/do you know someone who got in med school in Quebec after completing the BSc. Psych Behavioral Neuroscience at Concordia? What are your impressions? Is it a good option for someone who’s trying to increase her current GPA (3.1/4.3 from BSc. Human Dietetics and Nutrition) to get into med school (hopefully Mcgill) ? Any advice would help! Cheers
  11. I'm currently in my fifth year of university but I am thinking to do a second degree in another program. My first degree cgpa is not competitive enough (~3.0). I want to get some suggestions on the second degree route. How long would my second degree take me to complete? What medical schools would I be eligible for? I would really like to talk with people who are thinking about completing another degree or have done this in the past. Thanks.
  12. I am a registered nurse with two years critical care experience currently working in an ICU in a downtown Toronto hospital. I am already bored/ unsatisfied with this job and I want to pursue NP or med school. I am still pretty young and my family is encouraging me to shoot for med school. Where I'm at is choosing between a second undergrad degree or a masters in nursing to boost my GPA. I graduated from Queen's nursing with a 3.4, never really planned on pursuing further studies at the time. Nursing school (at Queen's) I found to be incredibly subjective and a total grade cutter and would not recommend it to anyone as a pre med degree. I did best in the sciences and the BS nursing theory courses seriously weighed me down. Every single person in my undergrad program had a high school average over 90% so competition was steep. Grades over 85% any course in my nursing program were unheard of. I guess I should have been more strategic in picking my undergrad but at the time I really wasn't thinking about medical school. Should I do two years of a second undergrad full time or a masters of nursing to increase my GPA? Keeping in mind, in the event I do not get in to medical school a masters in nursing would significantly aid me in achieving an executive nursing administration/ clinical nurse specialist position. Sorry if I'm not posting this in the right place..
  13. Hey guys! I'm yet another case with a weak cumulative UG gpa. I've just graduated this month (with my B.Sc) and made the decision very late in my UG that I wanted to pursue medicine. I applied to three schools for a second undergrad (knowing that this will probably be the lengthiest route) but did so anyway because my stats are very weak. Although my current GPA is a 3.9, my cGPA is a 2.7 (ah! I know. Working + on a varsity team + confused about career choices = not a good combo). On top of that I don't have any research or volunteer work/experience to have applied to a grad program. Right now YorkU has accepted me to do a second B.Sc in kin and UofT called me to tell me they haven't rejected me yet but although I'm qualified the two science degrees are very similar and might be time consuming (to me it is worth my time.. what's another 2.5 years in the long run?) so they offered me continuing ed instead (still waiting to hear their final decision though if they somehow have a spot open for me). I'm at the point where I'm questioning my next step and if I even have a chance at med in the future. I know that some schools can completely overlook your first degree, given that your second degree stats are competitive. Should I have taken the continuing ed offer at UofT? The problem with continuing ed is I wouldn't receive financial aid and at my recent school priority in course selection is almost never given to continuing ed students. What should I do? I only have one year under my belt with a strong GPA and I'm not qualified for a master's.
  14. Hi everyone, I'm looking for some advice about what to do to improve my chances to get into med school in Canada. My OMSAS GPA for my first three undergrad years are as follows: Year 1: 3.40 Year 2: 3.52 (I only took 7 instead of 10 courses because of a health issue) Year 3: 3.60 I've been struggling with time management and test anxiety issues, which is partially what I attribute my low grades to. I know that I am capable of getting better grades, I just have to develop better study skills. I'm finally starting to get treated for the anxiety (I was blanking on tests), but I'm still trying to get better about using my time more effectively. My ECs: -1.5 years as a volunteer writing tutor (5hrs/wk) -2 going on 3 years as a Residence Assistant (~15 hrs/wk) -Will have 1 semester of research experience next year -Recipient of a humanitarian scholarship -Next year, volunteering to support Syrian refugees (5hrs/wk) -Next year, an executive of a campus club, planning volunteer activities in the community (5hrs/wk) I'm obviously not applying for medical school this year because of the low GPA, but I was wondering what advice you guys might have for me for after I finish my undergrad in a year? I can't afford to apply to international med schools, the Caribbean or the U.S., so Canada is pretty much my only option.
  15. Hey all, I’ve been a longtime lurker of these forums for a year now and finally have the courage to seek help. My undergrad has been tumultuous. Ever since first year, my grades have been below sub par, due to self-confidence issues and anxiety. With each C grade I received, the deeper I sunk in depression. Just after this November, I finally faced the reality of my situation and came clean to my parents and peers for support. I have since learned from my mistakes in my past two and half years, regained my self confidence, learned to love myself, adopted good study habits, am able to manage stress, and my grades are improving slowly. I also regained the passion to pursue my dream again, to work in health care. I have interest in pursuing nursing, applying for a masters in physiotherapy, however above all, my main love still is medicine. Based on my research, I know how competitive it is and I realize my grades are poor, and this dream isn't realistic. However I know options such as second undergrads exist, and I was hoping some knowledgeable folks on these forums may be able to offer some guidance. Brace yourselves for my stats: Degree: Current 3rd Year BSc in Biology Province: Alberta cGPA: 2.3 1st Year: 2.5 Summer Term: 2.7 2nd Year: 2.2 3rd Year First Term: 2.2 3rd Year Second Term: Notable increase, on track for a 3.5 MCAT: 504(Bio: 124, Phys: 125, PS: 128, Cars: 128) Extra Curricular: (Cs denote continuing volunteering): - C. 3 years of working in local hospital with Nutrition and Food Services delivering trays for patients - C. 40 Hours as a volunteer of a physiotherapy clinic, educating patients on therapeutic exercise, preparing rooms, sitting in on assessments, and providing modalities using ultrasound and TENS. Loved my time here and will be continuing this summer. - C. 2 years of volunteering for a campus charity organization presenting science demonstrations to kids. Served first year as a presenter, second year as an executive, and next year I will be President. - C. Volunteered as an orientation leader for all summers since first year - C. Volunteer at my local church proclaiming readings - 8 years serving at a soup kitchen What are my options (if I have any)? Unfortunately a 5th year is not a possibility for me, as I go to the UofA and the Faculty of Science does not allow you to pursue additional credits after the 120 needed for graduation. I’m guessing a 2nd undergrad degree will be the most realistic for me, and I’m open to taking on the additional schooling. Would it be possible to take a two year after degree? I’m aware of special criteria such as best two years in schools like Western, and am willing to apply anywhere in Canada. My current plan is to explore my options, continue on with my ECs, get the best grades I can achieve in the rest of my undergrad, and possibly rewrite the MCAT again this summer if there are still options for me to pursue medicine. I’ve been ashamed of my academic performance for years. I am now ready to make steps on achieving my goals. Any help is appreciated, thank you!
  16. It's been a year since I've last lurked. I finally have the courage and circumstances compelling me to post. I'm currently 27, a Canadian citizen, and considering to do a second UG and to pursue a professional medical degree, ideally medical school. I did an undergrad originally in a very competitive program but switched out to complete a degree in economics. My marks were affected by some personal and medical issues that, in combination with immaturity and poor study habits, forced me to switch out with me seeing through with graduating. Thus, my first UG GPA is abysmal and around a B; enough for me to consider doing an MBA at lower-tier universities like Laurier. However, I cannot see myself staying any longer in accounting. I managed to accumulate 2-3 years working in the accounting field, but I strongly feel that it is not the right path for me to take after so many years of studying and experiencing the workplace. I understand that I am at a point where I am doing a second UG out of necessity, but also fulfilling my dream of possibly becoming a doctor now that I have matured as an individual and ready for a second shot at my academics. Although it means very little, it has been a dream of mine since I was a small boy to become a doctor. I also spent a summer with a team of medical professionals providing emergency care to destitute villages, and thoroughly enjoyed working with such an intense and passionate group of people. Am I being delusional? Does where I complete my undergrad matter (i.e. York vs UT?) Should I even consider doing the LSAT/GMAT at this point? I feel under the circumstances, my parents are still able and willing to help with their ties at their hospitals by connecting me with the right people for ECs. They had also considered sending me to the University of Victoria to do my undergrad, as some of my family relatives may be able to network me with EC opportunities and provide the proper guidance. The least I can do is thank you in advance for your advice. It is much appreciated.
  17. i wanted to do a second degree in the bachelor of science in kinesiology, but after seeing what classes I have left to complete after all of the transferred credit it seems daunting. I really can't mess up my GPA in the next 2 years and have to keep it as close to perfect as I can. These are the classes i have left below. Any input would be appreciated as I'm really stressed about this decision.. Mostly I'm concerned about how I have to take them crammed into 2 years. For all of you who have done the kinesiology degree or are currently in it and have done these courses, how are they? Will it be difficult to balance these classes? Any input from other kinesiology programs not at the U of A would help me out so much! Year 1 1. PEDS 100 2. PEDS 101 3. PEDS 103 4. PERLS 104 5. PERLS 105 1. HE ED 220 2. HE ED 221 3. PEDS 200 4. PEDS 203 5. PEDS 209 Year 2 1. PEDS 240 2. PERLS 207x 3. PEDS 303 or HE ED 321 4. PEDS 306 5. PEDS 311 1. PEDS 334 2. PEDS 335 3. PEDS 401 4. 9/15 Professional Practicum
  18. Hi There, I have a rather specific question regarding obtaining a second-degree. Here is a brief overview of my academic history to help clarify my question: I graduated with distinction in May 2014 from Tyndale University College and Seminary (Toronto, ON) BA Psychology, double major English, 3.75 CGPA -- with a 3.9 to 4.0/4.0 on all but one psychology course over the 4 year program I had planned to enroll as a non-degree student to the University of Toronto to take some additional science courses and ensure that I meet all of the required prerequisite courses for applying to Medical School. However, after being accepted into the non-degree program, I received the following news from U of T: "Thank you for your interest in the MD Program. Tyndale College does not appear to be accredited by the Association of Universities & Colleges of Canada. As such, we cannot accept degrees or courses from that institution....Your best option would be to enter a Bachelor’s degree program at a university that is by the Association of Universities & Colleges of Canada. You may be able to get some transfer credits based on the work that you completed at Tyndale." I love school - so as discouraging as this news was, I am up for the challenge. I have been working on applications for Western University and the University of Toronto, -- and have been assured that my credits will transfer to an undergraduate program in neuroscience (my favourite subject!) -- but wondered if anyone might have some additional insight regarding: A) Potential ways to circumvent this issue B ) Whether other MD programs (aside from U of T) might still accept my current degree (I am currently looking into this) C) If anyone else has had a similar problem, how they have overcome this challenge Thank you for your assistance and support! - Laura
  19. Hi everyone, I've been a long time lurker and now have come across a dilemma that I couldn't find an answer to. I am graduated from a 4 year degree with low GPA and have decided that another degree is the only option that I have if I wish to pursue medicine. Some schools offer program starts in January instead of the usual September start. If I were to start this degree in January 2016 and complete it in a total of 2 years (finishing December 2017), would schools like Western consider these 4 semesters as two full years or as 1 half year, 1 full year, and 1 half year. Thanks for you help guys, you are all awesomesauce (now an official oxford dictionary word since last month).
  20. So after some super fun financial stuff it turns out I can only afford to goto a Canadian Medical School, and American / Australia is off the table (where my previous success at acceptance has got me). Which means if I am going to be successful in this en-devour I need to increase my undergrad GPA (the two schools I have the best shot at sadly don't look at my Masters GPA). As far as I can see (and correct me if I am wrong) there are two ways to do this. One, register as an unclassified student (super easy, as long as you already have a degree you dont seem to be denied acceptance) and take a bunch of courses to boost the GPA, or two, take another degree and use those courses to boost your GPA. The obvious advantage to the degree route is when you are done, if you dont get into medical school you at least have a piece of semi-worthless paper for your time and money. If I go the unclassified route, it looks like it will be a small percent cheaper, but if after the 4 years to boost my GPA I dont get in, I will just have the debt from the classes and no paper. I guess my question is, is there an advantage from getting accepted route that would make someone pick one over the other? purely for medical school. like i get how one might be a poor life choice. thanks for any help you can offer...
  21. I'd like to know if any of you had done an undergrad in biomedical sciences (i.e. Anatomy and cell biology, biochemistry, physiology, microbiology and immunology) prior to nursing school. How did you guys find it to help having such a background? Is that a sure ticket to high grades? I am considering to apply in McGill MScN direct entry program, which if I don't get into (cGPA 3.2), I will get into a BScN. I am considering accelerated programs as well, or going into a french school and start nursing from scratch with no transferred credits (from my McGill biomed program). The goal is to get the best grades, and apply as soon as possible into med-school, from the best position possible. Any advice? Did any of you find yourself in a similar situation [doing a 2nd UG degree in nursing to apply into med]? What was your nursing school experience? Thank you very much.
  22. Hi guys, so due to a number of things that have happened this past year, my savings have been almost completely wiped out. There's no way I'll be able to pay for my second degree which I want to start this fall on my own. I'll have to rely on OSAP and that will include the costs of residence, food, etc because I applied outside of Toronto only. Originally, I was planning on paying for my degree, living (meagerly) off the rest of my savings and quitting my job so I can focus on school full-time. But now if I quit my job and take OSAP, I'll be digging myself into more debt with no income coming in - and that scares me quite a bit. I know that it is what it is, and I'll have to take a risk here either way. But I am trying to think of some other plans so that chasing my dreams doesn't make me completely broke either. The other option is doing an online degree with a full-time course load and carry on working, at least that will give me more flexibility and I'll still have income coming in. The risk with that is burn-out, having less time to focus on grades - and GPA is vital in my second degree of course. OR should I just bite the dust, take the loan and completely turn my focus towards school for the next few years? For those of you who did a second degree and had similar financial issues, what did you do? What would you recommend in this situation? thanks.
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