Debating: Do a Master or Start another Bachelors to Raise GPA

[slslsl]

Hello

 I applied to med school this year for the first time and was rejected pre interview from UBC. My GPA is really low (80) so I was not surprised. I am debating whether it would be better to take the time to begin another Bachelors or apply for my Masters to help raise my grades. I am non-traditional (28y/o), lots of research experience, typical volunteer stuff .. Any advice would be very much appreciated! 

[JohnGrisham]

How many credits do you have? I would keep taking undergrad courses and make sure you get nothing under an A+. Masters won't help you, GPA is your issue

[slslsl]

17 minutes ago, JohnGrisham said:

How many credits do you have? I would keep taking undergrad courses and make sure you get nothing under an A+. Masters won't help you, GPA is your issue

I have completed my BSc.  My first couple of years after highschool I jumped around different programs (HR, accounting, then finally to Bio) which is haunting my GPA (lol). 

I thought Masters courses counted towards GPA calculations? I could be wrong. 

[JohnGrisham]

39 minutes ago, slslsl said:

I have completed my BSc.  My first couple of years after highschool I jumped around different programs (HR, accounting, then finally to Bio) which is haunting my GPA (lol). 

I thought Masters courses counted towards GPA calculations? I could be wrong. 

Masters dont typically have many courses though, but if its a pure course based masters then sure.

 

You didnt answer how many credits in total. This makes a difference in how much incremental increase per course you can expect

[slslsl]

11 minutes ago, JohnGrisham said:

Masters dont typically have many courses though, but if its a pure course based masters then sure.

 

You didnt answer how many credits in total. This makes a difference in how much incremental increase per course you can expect

Good point! I have 179 credits in total a Msc would be an additional 30 credits at min..

 

[NeuroD]

Unless things have changed, grad school courses aren't usually included in your average. Maybe I a different for UBC?

Either way, I would suggest another undergrad.

[Chels1267]

Not all schools count MSc grades as mentioned above. Also, they don't usually make a huge difference, my GPA didn't increase at all after my MSc. Definitely would recommend another Bachelors.

[JohnGrisham]

9 hours ago, slslsl said:

Good point! I have 179 credits in total a Msc would be an additional 30 credits at min..

 

With 179 credits already under your belt, its going to be a huge uphill battle to improve your GPA. That said, I would be very strategic: I would do undergrad level courses at a school that uses the % system and try to get as many 90-100%s as possible. You have no room for less than that. Otherwise you further dilute your credits to oblivion.

 

Masters isnt worth it. Unless the course based masters is in a field you can get employment in, doing undergrad courses will be better and less risky. 

[frenchpress]

 

On 12/23/2018 at 9:15 PM, slslsl said:

Hello

 I applied to med school this year for the first time and was rejected pre interview from UBC. My GPA is really low (80) so I was not surprised. I am debating whether it would be better to take the time to begin another Bachelors or apply for my Masters to help raise my grades. I am non-traditional (28y/o), lots of research experience, typical volunteer stuff .. Any advice would be very much appreciated! 

If your goal is UBC Med and you have an 80% average (is that before or after adjustedment?) a master’s could be a reasonable route for you. But you’d be putting more of your eggs in one basket. 

Year to year usually about a quarter of the admitted UBC class has an adjusted average below 85, which those applicants make up for with stronger than average ECs. Unlike many schools, UBC will use your master’s grades toward your GPA. A thesis master’s is usually only about 18 credits with grades, which won’t give much of a boost, especially if you I already have 179 credits. Although, if you’re able to get very high grades, it can add a couple percent - it is much easier at UBC to achieve a 90+ average in a master’s than in undergrad. As others have stated, a course based master’s would be slightly more credits.

For comparison, I started my MSc with an undergraduate average just below 80%. In my master’s I was able to achieve an average above 90%, and I also took a few additional science classes - altogether about 30 credits. So when I applied for UBC Med my adjusted average after dropping my worst year was ~83%.  Not a huge boost, but it turned out to be enough.

The other thing to consider in choosing between more undergrad courses and a master’s is that the master’s may give you more opportunities to boost the NAQ portion of your application — I had quite a bit of paid work and TA experience, conferences, volunteer work, publications, awards, etc., all related to my MSc. It also set me up for a much better paying career in the meantime while applying for Med (and as a backup) than I could I’ve gotten with my undergrad degree.

[JohnGrisham]

6 minutes ago, frenchpress said:

 

If your goal is UBC Med and you have an 80% average, a master’s could be a reasonable route for you. But you’d be putting a lot more of your eggs in one basket. 

Year to year usually about a quarter of the admitted UBC class has an adjusted average below 85, which those applicants make up for with stronger than average ECs. Unlike many schools, UBC will use your master’s grades toward your GPA. A thesis master’s is usually only about 18 credits with grades, which won’t give much of a boost, especially if you I already have 179 credits. Although, if you’re able to get very high grades, it can add a couple percent - it is much easier at UBC to achieve a 90+ average in a master’s than in undergrad. As others have stated, a course based master’s would be slightly more credits.

For comparison, I started my MSc with an undergraduate average just below 80%. In my master’s I was able to achieve an average above 90%, and I also took a few additional science classes - altogether about 30 credits. So when I applied for UBC Med my adjusted average after dropping my worst year was ~83%.  Not a huge boost, but it turned out to be enough.

The other thing to consider in choosing between more undergrad courses and a master’s is that the master’s may give you more opportunities to boost the NAQ portion of your application — I had quite a bit of paid work and TA experience, conferences, volunteer work, publications, awards, etc., all related to my MSc. It also set me up for a much better paying career in the meantime while applying for Med (and as a backup) than I could I’ve gotten with my undergrad degree.

You can do the same amount of non academics just doing undergrad classes too.  

[frenchpress]

19 minutes ago, JohnGrisham said:

You can do the same amount of non academics just doing undergrad classes too.  

I think it really depends. I found that a lot more opportunities (and funding) became available once I signed on to do a master’s and I had a supervisor that was invested in me finishing that master’s — I was able to work on more of my own research and ideas, publish more first author work, travel more, etc. I also found it a lot more enjoyable to do something I was more invested in, compared to when I was just taking a random bunch of undergrad science courses. 

Edit: I will also add that I found master’s classes, at least in my program, so much easier to do well in than in undergrad. Averages were almost always in the low 90s or high 80s. And none of the classes I chose had exams, just papers and presentations and projects, which I found a lot less stressful. Which gave me more time and energy for things outside of school. Obviously very program dependent though. 

I think if GPA is the only consideration, then I agree more undergrad courses makes the most sense. But there’s good reasons to do a master’s, and the OPs GPA isn’t so bad that a master’s couldn’t be beneficial for Med if they were interested in going that route. 

Edited December 25, 2018 by frenchpress

[JohnGrisham]

Agree to disagree, there is an endless amount of non academics that can improve ones application outside the research realm

[frenchpress]

6 minutes ago, JohnGrisham said:

Agree to disagree, there is an endless amount of non academics that can improve ones application outside the research realm

Oh, of course! I’m just saying that research is also an option. I find a lot of people on this forum are pretty anti master’s, which I sort of get if the main end goal is a better GPA for Med school — but if a person likes research and wants to go that route, I like to be the devil’s advocate and encourage them to consider it 

[slslsl]

Thanks so much everyone for your advice and tips that I did not consider before! Definitely have given me a lot to think about

[Edict]

13 hours ago, JohnGrisham said:

You can do the same amount of non academics just doing undergrad classes too.  

yeah but lets talk about the elephant in the room here, an MSc is viewed as a step up to other careers, it opens more doors in non-med, whereas redoing a bachelor's is always looked upon as odd by everyone except med. 

[JohnGrisham]

2 hours ago, Edict said:

yeah but lets talk about the elephant in the room here, an MSc is viewed as a step up to other careers, it opens more doors in non-med, whereas redoing a bachelor's is always looked upon as odd by everyone except med. 

Definitely! But if its not a course based masters, doing purely UG courses is more time efficient.

[JohnGrisham]

That, and many masters are pretty useless anyways.