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Western interview invites/regrets 2019


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1 hour ago, deservingstudent said:

Rejected

IP 

Best 2 year GPA- 3.96

cGPA- 3.94

MCAT - 132/130/132/130 - 524

 

Cant believe it how this process works. Had good ECs and ABS. Got called from IVY schools, USA. I think there is a loophole in the system. The policies are not transparent. If anyone very well deserving  is looking into taking a legal route, do reply to me. Im in. I would like to know where i went wrong. I am sure there are a lot of deserving students who think the same way. 

The reality is that there is a limited number of spots and not everyone who 'deserves' a spot can receive one. The system can really feel like a lottery.

That being said, it might be worth doing some serious self-reflection if you're upset enough to be threatening legal action despite receiving calls from other schools.

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If people are wanting to take legal action regarding a single medical school rejection, then I think admissions is doing their job correctly in keeping you out. 

While I acknowledge people's frustration over changing goalposts, I think Western's change this year is commendable. The reality is, high MCAT and GPA scores are not good predictors of who will b

I very much doubt 1 single individual read all 8 of your essays. It was likely divided among 8 people, with the average of your responses being taken as your final score. This is how it works in CASPe

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On 1/31/2019 at 7:50 PM, Hypercalcemia said:

The reality is that there is a limited number of spots and not everyone who 'deserves' a spot can receive one. The system can really feel like a lottery.

That being said, it might be worth doing some serious self-reflection if you're upset enough to be threatening legal action despite receiving calls from other schools.

You are right on the limited spots, and the impact.

I have been around here for awhile and this isn't the first time I have seen these sort of radical change by a school and the impact on the applicant pool. Anger is a predictable response and while it isn't logical I can understand why. People that work so hard under a set of assumptions are then hit over the head when after achieving much have the goal posts moved. People could have sacrificed ECs for years to get a high GPA and MCAT score for Western and now find out that doing that was wasting their time. Further they have gotten that high GPA every year and then find out they are beaten out by some one with way more ECs at the expense of their GPA, and in fact could have terrible GPA years but hit the 2 years under new rules. The objective nature of the old system for many is an oasis in the other relatively subjective, "what do you what??", approach of some other schools. The calming effect if you also happened to be SWOMEN is also diminished. Whole new world in effect - and you can see a lot of people with high MCAT/GPA scores here blocked when they thought they were a sure thing for an interview. 

Same thing happened when Mac changed radically its polices, Ottawa dropped the Masters route, Queens did adjustments and went dark with some of its rules ... Come to think of the only school that hasn't changed is Toronto and NOSM. 

At least of all the things you can change about your applicants ECs are relatively simple. There well be a lot of analysis and search for some idea of their criteria, and people will pick up the pieces and move on from there. But for now its going to hurt. 

 

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4 hours ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

Rejected

IP

SWOMEN

best 2 year GPA- 3.83

MCAT 127/128/131/130/516

ECs: heres where I dont understand... 7 years in the royal canadian air cadets, 3 medals and 2 other awards with them, along with scholarships to earn my glider and private pilots licence plus 3 week survival course at CFB borden and 2 week basic training at CFB trenton. 4 years hospital volunteer, 2 years clinic volunteer, many other random event volunteering. 500 hours with the YMCA volunteer, worked at YMCA as camp counselor, worked at car wash for a year, worked in a factory over the summer, do lots of music and sports, very active outdoors, currently restoring a 23 year old land rover frame-off, played hockey for 14 years, coach high school track and field (and was an athlete in HS). 

only thing I dont have is research... apparently that is the missing ticket, even though I was told otherwise... Got no interview from anywhere in ontario, Dal, mcgill, alberta, BC or the states, not one. good luck to anyone with an interview

that's unfortunate. you're swomen too

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4 minutes ago, futureMD95 said:

Does anyone know if they have an interview waitlist?? Would that be indicated in the email sent today?

They haven't really had that before, so I am not sure why they would add it now. 

Hopefully we will see if they changed the number of people who are being interviewed - probably not but it would be interesting to know for sure. 

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For the ABS it really looks like they are looking for diverse and unique experiences instead of your typical pre-med cookie cutter research and volunteer story. I have absolutely 0 research and I do not really think that EC's are a strong point of my application, but my entries are extremely unique to me and they are about issues that I find incredibly important. I think this is mainly what they're looking for, authenticity. When there are thousands of applicants, you have to make yourself stand out, and you can't do that if your entries read just like hundreds of other student's. 

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Time Stamp: 11:18AM

Invite/reject: Invite

IP/OOP: IP

SWOMEN (Y/N): NO 

2YGPA: Only 1 year - 3.76 - in my final year (I have new motivation to get that 3.7)

MCAT (CHEM/CARS/BIO/PYSCH): 127/129/128/130

ABS Score (If available):  Lived and worked in Residence all my undergrad (Orientation Leader, Resident's Council President, Residence Life Staff memeber), MEDLIFE trip abroad, Independent research project (not published), Big Brother [and Big Sisters], most of my ABS focused on my Residence Life experience. 

 

I have been lurking this page for quite some time and thought it was important to those with lower GPAs

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12 hours ago, SmartfoodLover said:

Time Stamp: 11:11am

Invite/reject: Invite!!! 

IP/OOP: IP

SWOMEN (Y/N): N

2YGPA: 3.77
lol I have the lowest GPA here

MCAT (CHEM/CARS/BIO/PYSCH): 128/130/127/130 (515)

ABS Score (If available): No idea, but got rejected from everywhere else.

President of an arts collective, was previously an actor and publicity manager of said collective, and I helped found it. A lot of music extracurriculars, played keyboard in several semi-professional productions in my university town, also vocal directed and music directed a musical. Have my own photography business (hasn't made a ton of money but a few hundred), and I talked a lot about this in my ABS; how I turned my hobby into something I could use financially. Fair bit of volunteering, 600+ hours volunteering in research, received a research "work-placement" (similar to NSERC but uni specific), and 200+ hours volunteering in a physio clinic.

Anyone know the format of Western's interviews? MMI like everywhere else?

It's a traditional panel interview with three interviewers: a physician, a medical student, and a community member. Congrats on the interview invite!

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14 hours ago, deservingstudent said:

Rejected

IP 

Best 2 year GPA- 3.96

cGPA- 3.94

MCAT - 132/130/132/130 - 524

 

Cant believe it how this process works. Had good ECs and ABS. Got called from IVY schools, USA. I think there is a loophole in the system. The policies are not transparent. If anyone very well deserving  is looking into taking a legal route, do reply to me. Im in. I would like to know where i went wrong. I am sure there are a lot of deserving students who think the same way. 

Rejected, Swomen, 516, 3.99 cGPA, 4.0 2Y GPA... Also cheesed by this whole shitshow tbh. I'll definitely be in this with you. This was my 3rd application cycle and i just cant keep doing this with no transparency from the schools.

Ill private message you my phone number. We can talk. 

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11 hours ago, Average Joe said:

What do you mean that the calming effect of being SWOMEN is also diminished?

Nothing dramatic but before if you have the sort of GPA and MCAT as some SWOMEN had above you mathematically had about 70% chance of going to medical school even before Western released their invites - you knew you were going to hit whatever targets they had, you knew you would get a SWOMEN bonus, and after that roughly that percentage would get in. You knew all of this at the end of your third year months before you even applied. Imagine how relatively reassuring that was, and that gave a confidence boost that I am sure didn't hurt many people's chances either - yes there is still an interview of course and so on and it isn't 100% but the stress for many was less. 

Now you have no idea if you will actually get the invite which changes that equation. 

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7 minutes ago, rmorelan said:

Nothing dramatic but before if you have the sort of GPA and MCAT as some SWOMEN had above you mathematically had about 70% chance of going to medical school even before Western released their invites - you knew you were going to hit whatever targets they had, you knew you would get a SWOMEN bonus, and after that roughly that percentage would get in. You knew all of this at the end of your third year months before you even applied. Imagine how relatively reassuring that was, and that gave a confidence boost that I am sure didn't hurt many people's chances either - yes there is still an interview of course and so on and it isn't 100% but the stress for many was less. 

Now you have no idea if you will actually get the invite which changes that equation. 

I think the hardest part for the SWOMEN people who were used to the old system was that, for many of us without perfect scores, the interview was our chance to shine, to really prove ourselves to someone in person and show that we have what it takes, and now many of us lost that chance for a mysterious reason. I know everyone cant automatically be given an interview, but before at least you knew who met the cutoff and would get one. extremely frustrating to now not have that opportunity.

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10 minutes ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

I think the hardest part for the SWOMEN people who were used to the old system was that, for many of us without perfect scores, the interview was our chance to shine, to really prove ourselves to someone in person and show that we have what it takes, and now many of us lost that chance for a mysterious reason. I know everyone cant automatically be given an interview, but before at least you knew who met the cutoff and would get one. extremely frustrating to now not have that opportunity.

I agree the situation can be frustrating but try to look at it from a different perspective.

Before, the cutoffs were published and used to determine the interview pool (~400 people). Now, I assume the school invites a similar number of applicants, and states that the cutoffs they use are to determine which candidates proceed to file review. An applicant's aABS is used to determine interview invites. I assume that if they continued using only GPA/MCAT cutoffs to determine interview invites, the cutoffs would now be much higher than last years to obtain a similar interview pool, (READ - many SWOMEN/non-SWOMEN would not have been considered with these new higher cutoffs). 

I understand its frustrating that Western moved away from a clear objective method to determine interview invites but I think its clear that they had reasons to do so, either wanting their applicants to possess some arbitrary qualities that they deem are a prerequisite and/or keeping up with the natural trend of applicant pool's stats. 

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9 minutes ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

I think the hardest part for the SWOMEN people who were used to the old system was that, for many of us without perfect scores, the interview was our chance to shine, to really prove ourselves to someone in person and show that we have what it takes, and now many of us lost that chance for a mysterious reason. I know everyone cant automatically be given an interview, but before at least you knew who met the cutoff and would get one. extremely frustrating to now not have that opportunity.

true that is another aspect to it. 

Whenever any system is changed from clarity to less clarity people are going to get upset. Just looking at it the elimination of people with ABS scores required them to increase the pool of people considered, which is why GPA dropped etc. 

 

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2 minutes ago, dk3what said:

I agree the situation can be frustrating but try to look at it from a different perspective.

Before, the cutoffs were published and used to determine the interview pool (~400 people). Now, I assume the school invites a similar number of applicants, and states that the cutoffs they use are to determine which candidates proceed to file review. An applicant's aABS is used to determine interview invites. I assume that if they continued using only GPA/MCAT cutoffs to determine interview invites, the cutoffs would now be much higher than last years to obtain a similar interview pool, (READ - many SWOMEN/non-SWOMEN would not have been considered with these new higher cutoffs). 

I understand its frustrating that Western moved away from a clear objective method to determine interview invites but I think its clear that they had reasons to do so, either wanting their applicants to possess some arbitrary qualities that they deem are a prerequisite and/or keeping up with the natural trend of applicant pool's stats. 

I certainly agree that a more holistic approach is better for choosing doctors, it just sucks when they moving the net around on the ice during the game.

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4 minutes ago, dk3what said:

I agree the situation can be frustrating but try to look at it from a different perspective.

Before, the cutoffs were published and used to determine the interview pool (~400 people). Now, I assume the school invites a similar number of applicants, and states that the cutoffs they use are to determine which candidates proceed to file review. An applicant's aABS is used to determine interview invites. I assume that if they continued using only GPA/MCAT cutoffs to determine interview invites, the cutoffs would now be much higher than last years to obtain a similar interview pool, (READ - many SWOMEN/non-SWOMEN would not have been considered with these new higher cutoffs). 

I understand its frustrating that Western moved away from a clear objective method to determine interview invites but I think its clear that they had reasons to do so, either wanting their applicants to possess some arbitrary qualities that they deem are a prerequisite and/or keeping up with the natural trend of applicant pool's stats. 

ha I am sure the school would resist the use of "arbitrary" in their assessment of the traits they are looking for but there has definitely being an overall trend in med school admissions to include more and more measures that cannot be objectively assessed over the past 10 years. 

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1 minute ago, rmorelan said:

ha I am sure the school would resist the use of "arbitrary" in their assessment of the traits they are looking for but there has definitely being an overall trend in med school admissions to include more and more measures that cannot be objectively assessed over the past 10 years. 

Haha need to address that schulich ratio somehow :D

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24 minutes ago, dk3what said:

I agree the situation can be frustrating but try to look at it from a different perspective.

Before, the cutoffs were published and used to determine the interview pool (~400 people). Now, I assume the school invites a similar number of applicants, and states that the cutoffs they use are to determine which candidates proceed to file review. An applicant's aABS is used to determine interview invites. I assume that if they continued using only GPA/MCAT cutoffs to determine interview invites, the cutoffs would now be much higher than last years to obtain a similar interview pool, (READ - many SWOMEN/non-SWOMEN would not have been considered with these new higher cutoffs). 

I understand its frustrating that Western moved away from a clear objective method to determine interview invites but I think its clear that they had reasons to do so, either wanting their applicants to possess some arbitrary qualities that they deem are a prerequisite and/or keeping up with the natural trend of applicant pool's stats. 

What frustrates me most about this process is the total 180 in evaluation criteria... It seems to me after meeting certain cutoffs, 100% of your ranking was established based off a subjective assessment of 8 activities you participated in. Why not stratify by weighing all grades, MCAT, and then essays? Also such a short turnaround time, in this transition year people like myself in their second application cycle pushed through another MCAT summer to meet that elusive 129 CARS cutoff. This was so draining on my mental and physical health, but in the end I had this amazing sense of accomplishment and excitement because Western has been my home for 4 years, and now I am not allowed to even interview because someone decided that they were going to change their entire process now? 

I am excited and happy for everyone, including my own friends, who are getting the chance to interview - I just wish I knew what I possibly did wrong, along with why they felt the need to change things so soon. 

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4 minutes ago, dehindu said:

What frustrates me most about this process is the total 180 in evaluation criteria... It seems to me after meeting certain cutoffs, 100% of your ranking was established based off a subjective assessment of 8 activities you participated in. Why not stratify by weighing all grades, MCAT, and then essays? Also such a short turnaround time, in this transition year people like myself in their second application cycle pushed through another MCAT summer to meet that elusive 129 CARS cutoff. This was so draining on my mental and physical health, but in the end I had this amazing sense of accomplishment and excitement because Western has been my home for 4 years, and now I am not allowed to even interview because someone decided that they were going to change their entire process now? 

I am excited and happy for everyone, including my own friends, who are getting the chance to interview - I just wish I knew what I possibly did wrong, along with why they felt the need to change things so soon. 

They did that I suspect - right or wrong - because they were always using MCAT and GPA pre interview as pure cut offs. The school's general philosophy has been that beyond a point GPA and MCAT aren't really all that important - hence cut offs. This is a logical but somewhat nasty extension of that approach. 

I have no idea yet how they are using this but if they were to do this I think it would be better if they similarly used ECs in a cut off approach - that they were looking for a particular base line of ECs to indicate something, and then after that ECs don't matter. Then you move to interview. Looking at the relatively small subset of posts so for on the subject here is a bit dangerous but if the ECs listed here were true, and they were presented in a good fashion, then the EC cut off would be much higher than just a basic cutoff. 

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1 hour ago, weekendwarriors87 said:

I think the hardest part for the SWOMEN people who were used to the old system was that, for many of us without perfect scores, the interview was our chance to shine, to really prove ourselves to someone in person and show that we have what it takes, and now many of us lost that chance for a mysterious reason. I know everyone cant automatically be given an interview, but before at least you knew who met the cutoff and would get one. extremely frustrating to now not have that opportunity.

I can understand the frustration and it sucks that it changed this year :( But as an alternate perspective, this is how GTA applicants feel on the regular. Never a guarantee for any school plus no restrictions on OOP applicants.

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