Questions on application cycle, oop applications, and degree vs credits

[JaeTaro]

I have a lot of med school questions.. I took a ferry and drove to UBC to attend their information session last year but they were running low on time and I couldn't ask many questions, and the school I go to now doesn't have much of a premed advisor. So if anyone can help with some of my questions I'd be grateful. 

 

Course load

I currently have 90 credits but only 69 are transferable. Can I take a relaxed, 21 credit year for my last year so I can focus on volunteering/MCAT studying or are full course loads pretty much a requirement for every year.

 

UBC Application cycle

I read UBC's timeline information https://mdprogram.med.ubc.ca/admissions/application-timelines/ and I’m confused about a few things. 

Hypothetically, if I have 60 credits right now, and take the MCAT this summer, with the plan of taking the remaining 30 credits in my next year, could I apply for the 2020/2021 cycle to enter September 2021?

The reason I am confused is because September 15, 2020 is the deadline to submit an application, and the application is evaluated by December. How could they evaluate me if I haven’t taken some of the prerequisite courses? (English is a prerequisite course which I would be taking in fall 2020)

Also, I have very few volunteer hours currently. I planned on getting a lot this summer and during the next school year. If I applied for the 2020/2021 cycle, would they look at my volunteer hours from the moment my application is submitted?

 

Complete my business degree?

I could get a Bachelors in Business Administration if I did another year at my college. In terms of benefiting my application to UBC, would having additional credits (many are non-transferrable to UBC), help? Or are they just opportunities to reduce my GPA so I shouldn’t take them.

Would having the mentioned bachelors degree benefit me in terms to applying to other medical schools in Canada?

 

Other Med Schools

Because of the lack of home-province advantage, is there a reason to apply to med schools in say, Manitoba? Are some medical schools much more relaxed to get into so even without a home-province advantage there would be a reason to apply to them?  I ask because I noticed on the premed **DELETED**, people from the states apply to like 30 schools and I'm wondering if Canadians do the same by applying to every school we have. 

 

GPA

Everywhere I look at GPA conversions, they only have information on the big universities. I go to North Island College which is a community college? They give me both a letter grade and my percentage for the course on my transcript. How do I convert my grades to UBC? Does it matter that I'm not a student at a big university in terms of my application? 

[youbesee]

1. Full course loads are not required for UBC, but they may play a role in decisions and you are asked to explain why you were unable to do a full course load. Full course loads are required for GPA weighting in some other schools like U of T, which can significantly boost your GPA

2. Yes, many students who just finished 2nd year and 60 credits will do their MCAT and apply that same summer for entry after they finish 3rd year

3. For this most recent cycle, UBC says prereqs must be done by April 30 of the year you enter medical school, so doing it this fall should be fine

4. Unfortunately extracurriculars are only considered up to June 1st of the summer you apply

5. Additional credits may increase (or decrease) your GPA which would help you, but just having more credits or a degree itself does not

6. If possible, apply broadly. You never know how you might look to different schools, and you may have very different interview experiences at different schools. Most Ontario schools consider all applicants the same. I know in province applicants that were rejected from UBC but got into Ottawa for instance

7. It is tough to say how UBC will consider your grades, best to contact admissions directly

 

[frenchpress]

14 hours ago, JaeTaro said:

 

 

 

UBC Application cycle

I read UBC's timeline information https://mdprogram.med.ubc.ca/admissions/application-timelines/ and I’m confused about a few things. 

Hypothetically, if I have 60 credits right now, and take the MCAT this summer, with the plan of taking the remaining 30 credits in my next year, could I apply for the 2020/2021 cycle to enter September 2021?

The reason I am confused is because September 15, 2020 is the deadline to submit an application, and the application is evaluated by December. How could they evaluate me if I haven’t taken some of the prerequisite courses? (English is a prerequisite course which I would be taking in fall 2020)

You list that you plan to take the courses in the initial application. If you’re admitted you’ll need to send in another set of transcripts proving it was done by the deadline. 

 

Quote

Complete my business degree?

I could get a Bachelors in Business Administration if I did another year at my college. In terms of benefiting my application to UBC, would having additional credits (many are non-transferrable to UBC), help? Or are they just opportunities to reduce my GPA so I shouldn’t take them.

Would having the mentioned bachelors degree benefit me in terms to applying to other medical schools in Canada?

 

If you don’t get into medicine on your first application, then what will you do? Will you work instead? Will you be able to get a job that’s a reasonable back up plan for if you’re not able to get into medical school after several application cycles? 

You don’t necessarily need to complete your degree to apply, but it’s worth considering how an unfinished degree might be perceived. Especially if you need to apply several times. It’s one thing to apply to transfer in after third year. But it may be perceived differently if you’re applying with 90 credits and you haven’t been in school for several years.  If your GPA is not competitive, you may also want another year to help boost it. 

What is your GPA now? Applying OOP can be much more competitive because for many schools there are fewer spots for OOP applicants. 

[Brockolli911]

Since you went to a college no Ontario schools will accept your transferable college credits. 
 

Good enough for Western medical schools just not good enough for Ontario medical schools ....

 

the only way Ontario schools consider your college marks is if you can make them appear on a University transcript. 
 

[JaeTaro]

On 5/27/2020 at 9:21 AM, frenchpress said:

If you don’t get into medicine on your first application, then what will you do? Will you work instead? Will you be able to get a job that’s a reasonable back up plan for if you’re not able to get into medical school after several application cycles? 

You don’t necessarily need to complete your degree to apply, but it’s worth considering how an unfinished degree might be perceived. Especially if you need to apply several times. It’s one thing to apply to transfer in after third year. But it may be perceived differently if you’re applying with 90 credits and you haven’t been in school for several years.  If your GPA is not competitive, you may also want another year to help boost it. 

What is your GPA now? Applying OOP can be much more competitive because for many schools there are fewer spots for OOP applicants. 

My plan is to find volunteer and research opportunities during the year I am waiting to get into medicine so if I don't get in on my first application I would have stronger ECs for my second, but I have other options if I never get into medicine.

My GPA I'm not sure on which GPA scale to use, but I have a % average of 90.4 on my transcript. I tried to convert my letter grades to UBC GPA and I'm not sure if I'm right, but I have a 3.83? If you don't mind looking at my grades, I have:
10 A+, 11 A, 4 A-, 4 B+, 1 B 

Are these about average grades? I honestly don't know. 

[JaeTaro]

22 hours ago, Brockolli911 said:

Since you went to a college no Ontario schools will accept your transferable college credits. 
 

Good enough for Western medical schools just not good enough for Ontario medical schools ....

 

the only way Ontario schools consider your college marks is if you can make them appear on a University transcript. 
 

So Ontario schools only look at the big universities? So in BC they would be UVic or UBC?

I just looked up UoT and on their transfer credit page https://www.utm.utoronto.ca/future-students/apply/transfer-credits/college-university they say for college credits from other provinces they  "Courses completed at colleges in other Canadian provinces will be considered for transfer credits based on the practices observed by the universities in that province." Which sound like they would accept a credit from my college if UBC would accept that credit. However this is on their general website, is it different for their medical department? 

What do you mean appear on a university transcript? Do you mean I would have to transfer to a university, get my credits transferred over to their university, and then get a transcript from said university? 

 

[frenchpress]

Just now, JaeTaro said:

My plan is to find volunteer and research opportunities during the year I am waiting to get into medicine so if I don't get in on my first application I would have stronger ECs for my second, but I have other options if I never get into medicine.

My GPA I'm not sure on which GPA scale to use, but I have a % average of 90.4 on my transcript. I tried to convert my letter grades to UBC GPA and I'm not sure if I'm right, but I have a 3.83? If you don't mind looking at my grades, I have:
10 A+, 11 A, 4 A-, 4 B+, 1 B 

Are these about average grades? I honestly don't know. 

For the conversation you’ll need to use only the university transferable grades. But those grades look fine. 
 

Use this calculator: https://www.grad.ubc.ca/faculty-staff/admin-resources-templates/gpa-calculators

And this table: https://mdprogram.med.ubc.ca/files/2012/08/ADM_grade_conversion_tables.pdf

[JaeTaro]

Using that calculator, my converted GPA is 87.2. Dang, thats a big difference from the 90.4 of my actual average of my % grades. I read on UBCs website they would "Use the percent grade if available, if it is not they would convert the letter grades" so I hope they do that. 

One thing to note though. When I went to the UBC information session, one of the questions I specifically asked was "Does the grades from my non transferable credits matter in the GPA calculation?" Now, I'm not sure what her job is or how in depth she knows the system but she told me that "transferable credits are necessary to make sure you meet the 90 credit minimum, but grades from both transferable and non-transferable credits would be used when calculating your admission GPA" 

[Brockolli911]

9 minutes ago, JaeTaro said:

So Ontario schools only look at the big universities? So in BC they would be UVic or UBC?

I just looked up UoT and on their transfer credit page https://www.utm.utoronto.ca/future-students/apply/transfer-credits/college-university they say for college credits from other provinces they  "Courses completed at colleges in other Canadian provinces will be considered for transfer credits based on the practices observed by the universities in that province." Which sound like they would accept a credit from my college if UBC would accept that credit. However this is on their general website, is it different for their medical department? 

What do you mean appear on a university transcript? Do you mean I would have to transfer to a university, get my credits transferred over to their university, and then get a transcript from said university? 

 

If you go onto the OMSAS website, the service you use to apply to Ontario medical schools, it specifically states college courses (even if transfer credits are given) are typically not included in GPA calculations. When I have reached out to the various Ontario medical schools I have got various different answers. The reason I reached out is because I have three years of college for paramedic and going to Selkirk College for Rural Pre-Med in September. So I wanted to find out if I could apply to Ontario schools. 

NOSM, McMaster, and Western stated the courses would have to appear individually on a university transcript with marks attached. 

Queens told me they would not be counted even though their website says college transfer credits count towards their credit requirement. So I’m still trying to sort that out. 
 

U of T is going to get back to me but I have been waiting for a month. 
 

U of Ottawa again I’m waiting to hear back. 

 

So if you want to have your college courses count they MUST show up on a Univeristy transcript as individual courses with assigned marks. If they do not, they don’t count. That’s essentially what I have found out. So if you can speak to the university your attending and get them to put those courses on your transcript then in theory you should be good to go. If they won’t then it would seem ON schools won’t take you. 
 

It is very frustrating since the program I am going to be taking is a university caliber course but that’s the system ..

I suggest you do your own research though to confirm! :-)

[JaeTaro]

Thanks for that. That does sound very frustrating though, for you, me, and alot of people. 

The whole thing sounds crazy to me though. Colleges have their place. Some are probably just a center for people to get their GED, or certifications for some trades, but others are academic focused and offer degrees. I guess I don't really know what the hard line is between Canadian universities, tech institutes, colleges, community colleges. 

Do you have any ideas what the rationale might be why somewhere like Queens wouldn't accept any college credits? 

[Brockolli911]

I’ve been told by the schools they feel college is not the same Calibre as university. While I can accept that to an extent, there are many programs/courses that are university courses. If they are accepted by a university as a university caliber course then I believe they should be considered as equivalent but that’s just me. Lol

[frenchpress]

54 minutes ago, JaeTaro said:

Using that calculator, my converted GPA is 87.2. Dang, thats a big difference from the 90.4 of my actual average of my % grades. I read on UBCs website they would "Use the percent grade if available, if it is not they would convert the letter grades" so I hope they do that. 

One thing to note though. When I went to the UBC information session, one of the questions I specifically asked was "Does the grades from my non transferable credits matter in the GPA calculation?" Now, I'm not sure what her job is or how in depth she knows the system but she told me that "transferable credits are necessary to make sure you meet the 90 credit minimum, but grades from both transferable and non-transferable credits would be used when calculating your admission GPA" 

I think which grades they use  depends on the course. Email UBC med admissions with these questions about your specific courses and program - they will give you the best information.

This is the case for all the programs in Ontario too. If you aren't sure your program meets their requirements, ask them. Don't depend on random info from the internet - a lot of people here only really know what info applies to their own situation. 

[Brockolli911]

On 5/28/2020 at 4:19 PM, frenchpress said:

I think which grades they use  depends on the course. Email UBC med admissions with these questions about your specific courses and program - they will give you the best information.

This is the case for all the programs in Ontario too. If you aren't sure your program meets their requirements, ask them. Don't depend on random info from the internet - a lot of people here only really know what info applies to their own situation. 

You’re spot on the money! 
 

every situation when your non trad is different and each non traditional must do their own research and talk to EACH school