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Hey Johnboy, incoming MS1 here.

I'm also looking into MOTP. I need to get more concrete details from the recruiting folks, but based on my conversations with a few past, and current MOTP/MMTP students, it varies depending on the needs of the military at that time. There's a few residencies highlighted on the recruiting website that are more in demand, and could be covered; emergency medicine, orthopedics, anasthesiology, psychiatry, PHPM.. I believe they also fund +1s in Emerg'.

I think the general process is, you finish FM and work as a GD-MO (General Duties Medical Officer - Aka Family Doc) for a few years (3-5?) after which you could potentially apply for that second residency. Financially, it would mean getting paid an MO salary while undergoing a 5(+) yr residency, with a 5 year return of service (ROS) afterwards.

Feel free to PM or be in touch if you want to chat further.

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Currently a military anesthesia resident after completing MOTP/MMTP and four years of service as a family physician.

To answer your question, MOTP/MMTP cannot complete a +1 before practice. As above, FM must be completed as MOTP/MMTP. After three years of service as a GDMO, there is opportunity for re-training (if selected) but available positions will vary depending on CAF requirements and funding. The CAF military specialist group is a relatively small number so it is difficult to forecast what positions will be open year-to-year as it would depend on retirements/releases and operational requirements.

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  • 11 months later...

Just wanted to share some words of caution, I apologize in advance if I sound paternalistic but I wanted to give the other side of the coin. I was in the CAF when I got accepted in medicine and I couldn't be more happy to have left. To me, it doesn't make sense to restrict your choices before experiencing different specialties during your rotations. If you are already planning on doing another residency after FM, I would argue MOTP might not be the best idea. Ultimately, you trade your freedom for short term money that you would otherwise make up for when you start working as staff. Even if you succeed in retraining in a specialty after MOTP, you still lose years of experience in that specialty and have to forego fellowship opportunities. I would still advise people who are into family medicine against pursuing MOTP for financial reasons, since military medicine is not exactly family medicine. You are a military officer first and foremost and have to deal with the lifestyle that comes with it (being away on temporary dutes, military exercises, deployments, etc.) Instead of going straight into MOTP, I would suggest you start by joining the reserve force to see if a career in the CAF would suit you, part-time or full-time. You will have virtually no obligation as a reservist (compared to a member of the regular force) and part of your education is still subsidized.

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5 hours ago, Dodo said:

Just wanted to share some words of caution, I apologize in advance if I sound paternalistic but I wanted to give the other side of the coin. I was in the CAF when I got accepted in medicine and I couldn't be more happy to have left. To me, it doesn't make sense to restrict your choices before experiencing different specialties during your rotations. If you are already planning on doing another residency after FM, I would argue MOTP might not be the best idea. Ultimately, you trade your freedom for short term money that you would otherwise make up for when you start working as staff. Even if you succeed in retraining in a specialty after MOTP, you still lose years of experience in that specialty and have to forego fellowship opportunities. I would still advise people who are into family medicine against pursuing MOTP for financial reasons, since military medicine is not exactly family medicine. You are a military officer first and foremost and have to deal with the lifestyle that comes with it (being away on temporary dutes, military exercises, deployments, etc.) Instead of going straight into MOTP, I would suggest you start by joining the reserve force to see if a career in the CAF would suit you, part-time or full-time. You will have virtually no obligation as a reservist (compared to a member of the regular force) and part of your education is still subsidized.

That was very helpful. I tried to contact with them but could not clear things. Would you be able to comment on where MOTP students will do their FM residencies? Any school they matched to? Or, there are certain schools that have seats for MOTP FM residencies? Thank you. 

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5 hours ago, Johnboy said:

That was very helpful. I tried to contact with them but could not clear things. Would you be able to comment on where MOTP students will do their FM residencies? Any school they matched to? Or, there are certain schools that have seats for MOTP FM residencies? Thank you. 

in theory, they might prefer that you do your residency in the same geographical area to avoid paying for relocation fees, but I think it wouldn't be an issue doing residency elsewhere if you match (however, this can change). yes, there might be MOTP seats at Dalhousie, Ottawa and Queens, but that's just a guess, other people can confirm.

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37 minutes ago, Dodo said:

in theory, they might prefer that you do your residency in the same geographical area to avoid paying for relocation fees, but I think it wouldn't be an issue doing residency elsewhere if you match (however, this can change). yes, there might be MOTP seats at Dalhousie, Ottawa and Queens, but that's just a guess, other people can confirm.

Thank you so much 

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On 6/17/2020 at 1:06 AM, rednwhite said:

Currently a military anesthesia resident after completing MOTP/MMTP and four years of service as a family physician.

To answer your question, MOTP/MMTP cannot complete a +1 before practice. As above, FM must be completed as MOTP/MMTP. After three years of service as a GDMO, there is opportunity for re-training (if selected) but available positions will vary depending on CAF requirements and funding. The CAF military specialist group is a relatively small number so it is difficult to forecast what positions will be open year-to-year as it would depend on retirements/releases and operational requirements.

Where do you do your second residency? Do you get to choose the university? And is there a return of service after the second residency?

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  • 2 years later...

Bump.

MS3, applying this year. Anyone else applying / already in? Would desperately appreciate input.

Feels like risky gamble for many reasons, but nothing in medicine makes me not look at the clock throughout the day, or makes me as "excited" as the practice of a military doctor (met a few).

I dislike FM. I dislike clinic. Not to say hate.

Loved the OR, the technicality of surgery, but not to the point of suffering through the lifestyle and job prospect.

Loved Radiology for being the polar opposite of IM (hate IM, I'll say it here), but it's missing something.

(Yet to do ER and Geri, but I know already Geri isn't for me.)

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you could consider exploring all specialties before committing to MOTP, just in case. If you still want the military, there's MOTP but I've also heard rumours of a new pathway called SOTP, which would essentially allow you to pursue residency in a specialty with a similar deal than MOTP (assuming that your specialty of choice happens to be in demand in the Canadian Armed Forces the year you apply for enrolment). Again this is rumours only so if anyone has more insight please let me know!

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On 12/3/2023 at 11:09 PM, Dodo said:

you could consider exploring all specialties before committing to MOTP, just in case. If you still want the military, there's MOTP but I've also heard rumours of a new pathway called SOTP, which would essentially allow you to pursue residency in a specialty with a similar deal than MOTP (assuming that your specialty of choice happens to be in demand in the Canadian Armed Forces the year you apply for enrolment). Again this is rumours only so if anyone has more insight please let me know!

Never heard of SOTP, could not find anything about it, but it definitely would make me consider changing my game plan if it were to be real, specifically for Ortho.

 

On 12/3/2023 at 10:19 PM, Dodo said:

what do you like in the « the practice of a military doctor »?

Goals of care, patient population, MSK bread & butter, deployment/operation support/humanitarian missions, functional "independent" healthcare system, lifestyle, brotherhood.

I've seen a lot and ruled out a lot from MS1 to now. Only two still standing strong is Radiology and Ortho. Mostly Ortho. 

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Since you clearly hate Fam med/clinic and like Ortho/rads… I just have a hard time understanding the rationale for doing MOTP (since you are obligated to train in fam med and work as GP for couple years before you can MAYBE retrain as a specialist). Retraining as a specialist while getting paid as a staff is a very nice deal, but there’s no guarantee that it’ll work. Even then, the financial aspect doesn’t make much sense, because you will be compensated probably 2x more in the civilian world as a radiologist or as an orthopedic surgeon. If you really want to join the Forces, you can always enrol as a reservist orthopedist or radiologist and choose the deployments/tasks that interest you? It would allow for maximum flexibility.

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