Any guidance would be greatly appreciated (4th application cycle)

[Fanofmed]

Hey guys, recently was rejected from my only interviewed school after my 3rd time applying. Was waitlisted at this particular school for the past 2 cycles with 87% avg (3.9 GPA according to OMSAS) and 497 and 504 MCAT respectively)  but ended up being flat out rejected this year (even with an improvement of my third MCAT to 511 this cycle). Obviously my MMI was the issue this time around as this school does not require extracurriculars in the application but now i'm just not sure how to go forward to increase my chances of an acceptance from here. I am still very determined to pursue medicine and will do what I have to do but just want to go about it as effectively as possible. My questions are:

I will apply to this particular school for the 4th time this fall. would forking out some cash for an MMI prep course be worth it? Or would I better be served putting myself into more random experiences besides work and volunteering to enhance my communication skills? To those accepted, what do you think most contributed to your own success? (I have prepped a lot in the past)

Also, in the past I never applied to other Canadian or international schools due to my MCAT. I understand this has greatly impeded my ability to get into medical school but really have been trying my best with that god forsaken exam. But even now, with a 511 (126 CARS) im not sure if ill stand a chance anywhere, especially if I cant get an acceptance from my home school where statistically my chances are greatest. What do you guys think, do I have a chance? If not, will writing a fourth time and achieving a 515+ go a long way towards out-of province and international schools (US, Ireland, Australia) even if its my 4th attempt? 

Lastly, a part of me feels delusional for even continuing to pursue medicine but that's probably the result of 3 application cycles worth of emotions. But I cant help but to ask if life is trying to send me some sort of message and that I'm in this situation for reasons other then simply stumbling over my words and during my last MMI (obviously there's more factors but analyzing my own MMI accurately seems impossible). For those that took as long as I have been taking to achieve an acceptance, what positives did you take from your extended premed journey?

 

Any responses to any of the above questions will surely help me out. Thanks

[who_knows]

Hi Fanofmed. In my opinion, you have very decent stats. Your MCAT score is competitive for Canada, but I feel like US schools put more emphases on MCAT. Can you tell more about your recent MMI? How was it?

 

[shikimate]

Personally I am not a fan of MMI, it is kind of a "game" and favors people who can spew out stuff, sometimes BS, on their feet. Unfortunately it's in vogue right now with MD admissions and it is what it is.

You certainly stand a chance at USDO and other foreign schools, maybe even some low tier USMD schools. But those options are not without their own perils, such as cost for USMD, and CaRMS for USDO/IMG. If you can swallow the cost and risk of these options then why not give them a try, maybe start with USMD+USDO (Assuming you got the money and the pre-reqs). You have time before July when US application starts, so you could do some search on this if you're open to this route.

Your average is decent (it would be better if you covert it to GPA here), any other health related fields you'd be open to?

[Fanofmed]

19 minutes ago, who_knows said:

Hi Fanofmed. in my opinion, you have decent stats. MCAT is competitive for Canada, but I feel like US schools put more emphases on MCAT. Can you tell more about your recent MMI? How was it?

Hi Who_knows. Id say my first station went poorly even though i had prepped for the type of question. Felt good before but then out of nowhere got with nerves and couldnt articulate my thoughts effectively but i felt that i recovered after the first few minutes of the station. One other station i took an one sided stance on a topic that was well intentioned and meant to show passion but was probably taken as narrowminded approach. Seems pointless to speculate though, at the end of the day i gave overly simple responses without enough depth and effective use of my personal experiences to stand out. It went by so fast.

[who_knows]

45 minutes ago, Fanofmed said:

Hi Who_knows. Id say my first station went poorly even though i had prepped for the type of question. Felt good before but then out of nowhere got with nerves and couldnt articulate my thoughts effectively but i felt that i recovered after the first few minutes of the station. One other station i took an one sided stance on a topic that was well intentioned and meant to show passion but was probably taken as narrowminded approach. Seems pointless to speculate though, at the end of the day i gave overly simple responses without enough depth and effective use of my personal experiences to stand out. It went by so fast.

Looks like the MMI was the problem. It worth looking into improving your MMI skills. Did you do Saturday or Sunday MMI? Could you say something that was a red flag? Can it be that your referees said something that redflagged you?

[Fanofmed]

1 hour ago, shikimate said:

Personally I am not a fan of MMI, it is kind of a "game" and favors people who can spew out stuff, sometimes BS, on their feet. Unfortunately it's in vogue right now with MD admissions and it is what it is.

You certainly stand a chance at USDO and other foreign schools, maybe even some low tier USMD schools. But those options are not without their own perils, such as cost for USMD, and CaRMS for USDO/IMG. If you can swallow the cost and risk of these options then why not give them a try, maybe start with USMD+USDO (Assuming you got the money and the pre-reqs). You have time before July when US application starts, so you could do some search on this if you're open to this route.

Your average is decent (it would be better if you covert it to GPA here), any other health related fields you'd be open to?

Very much appreciate the response. I totally agree. The MMI feels some sort of speed dating session and I'll always have a hard time connecting with another person through that interview format no matter which strategy I employ, but yeah it is what it is. I will do some research on DO and see if its right for me. Ive always had a perception that an MD is just better to have over a DO in terms of exploring the full potential of opportunities in medicine but I really don't know enough about it to rule out that pathway. From your response it seems that It may be worthwhile to rewrite the MCAT to increase my USMD chances so I will take that into consideration even though it makes me nauseous. Do you know if a 515+ that was achieved on the 4th try is just as valuable as one achieved on the 1st try when it comes to US schools? and I believe my GPA converts to the range of 3.7-4.0 for AMCAS and 3.9 for OMSAS

[Butterfly_]

4 hours ago, Fanofmed said:

Hey guys, recently was rejected from my only interviewed school after my 3rd time applying. Was waitlisted at this particular school for the past 2 cycles with 87% avg (3.9 GPA according to OMSAS) and 497 and 504 MCAT respectively)  but ended up being flat out rejected this year (even with an improvement of my third MCAT to 511 this cycle). Obviously my MMI was the issue this time around as this school does not require extracurriculars in the application but now i'm just not sure how to go forward to increase my chances of an acceptance from here. I am still very determined to pursue medicine and will do what I have to do but just want to go about it as effectively as possible. My questions are:

I will apply to this particular school for the 4th time this fall. would forking out some cash for an MMI prep course be worth it? Or would I better be served putting myself into more random experiences besides work and volunteering to enhance my communication skills? To those accepted, what do you think most contributed to your own success? (I have prepped a lot in the past)

Also, in the past I never applied to other Canadian or international schools due to my MCAT. I understand this has greatly impeded my ability to get into medical school but really have been trying my best with that god forsaken exam. But even now, with a 511 (126 CARS) im not sure if ill stand a chance anywhere, especially if I cant get an acceptance from my home school where statistically my chances are greatest. What do you guys think, do I have a chance? If not, will writing a fourth time and achieving a 515+ go a long way towards out-of province and international schools (US, Ireland, Australia) even if its my 4th attempt? 

Lastly, a part of me feels delusional for even continuing to pursue medicine but that's probably the result of 3 application cycles worth of emotions. But I cant help but to ask if life is trying to send me some sort of message and that I'm in this situation for reasons other then simply stumbling over my words and during my last MMI (obviously there's more factors but analyzing my own MMI accurately seems impossible). For those that took as long as I have been taking to achieve an acceptance, what positives did you take from your extended premed journey?

 

Any responses to any of the above questions will surely help me out. Thanks

You should definitely apply broadly across Canada now that you have a MCAT of 511. I think your stats are competitive. For MMIs, I think it's important to be yourself, smile, and look confident. Just those 3 things can make a big difference. Also, it's important to practice, but make sure you don't sound over-rehearsed/scripted.

[Fanofmed]

10 hours ago, Butterfly_ said:

You should definitely apply broadly across Canada now that you have a MCAT of 511. I think your stats are competitive. For MMIs, I think it's important to be yourself, smile, and look confident. Just those 3 things can make a big difference. Also, it's important to practice, but make sure you don't sound over-rehearsed/scripted.

Thanks for the response. I'll definitely give some other schools a go! and yes for sure, as much as an MMI feels like a test, it seems to really be about trying to just connect with the other person and have a decent mini conversation, just gotta keep working at it I guess.

[gastrogunner12345]

Do not give up! You have great stats. Work on your interview skills and reapply to as many schools as possible. 

[bearded frog]

A word of warning about USMD, historically a lot of schools frowned at multiple MCATs, and would do things like average all your scores etc. That might have changed since I apply but don't go spending money on applications before checking how each school considers your score.

Second, have you reflected on why you are struggling with the MCAT? For better or for worse, multiple choice exams are a fact of medicine, and I would strongly consider working on my test taking ability prior to starting as you're going to have to do it again for the MCCQE and board exams at the very least.

[shikimate]

I don't know about doing more MCAT, seems risky and bit of shot in the dark trying to get 515. 

DO is basically same as MD if you are comfortable doing residency in US and working in US, assuming you aren't gunning for plastic surgery or neurosurgery or something like that. If you wanna match back to Canada with DO it's kinda risky as they are considered IMG here, better chance with USMD in that case.

Try look up Wayne State, St Louis, and some of the Canadian friendly USMD schools. Also u gotta re-calculate ur GPA according to AMCAS.

I know one guy he just matched to family med in USA from some no name DO school last month. He's already getting recruiting calls asking him if he wants jobs, he haven't even started residency yet!

Two big hurdles for US schools might be pre-reqs and money. You gotta be careful with pre-reqs they are quite stringent in USA and some of the stuff they ask like math and english a lot of people haven't taken them in undergrad.

You can keep applying to Canada broadly, never hurts to keep trying at the same time, but I glanced over OMSAS stats and every year looks more bleak, more and more people apply and same number of seats. I assume it's the same for other school in different provinces.