Residency Match for American Med School Students

[NiV]

How hard is it for Canadians to find a match in the US. I heard that sometimes international students who studied in American med school wait for a whole year before getting a match, is this information true?

I also hear some hospitals dont even call u for an interview if they learn that they will have to sponsor u?

BTW r there any American Med School students out there who suffered by the hands of NRMP bcz of being Canadian?

[n00b]

yikessssssssss hope that's not true

[Alastriss]

My girlfriend's sister just matched IM at case western and she is an SGU grad. She did work hard and was one of those that "should have been" at a Canadian school. Whoever told you that needs to shove it. I understand that we all like to be pessimists, but pessimism at the point of very delicate information is just dangerous.

[token]

How hard is it for Canadians to find a match in the US. I heard that sometimes international students who studied in American med school wait for a whole year before getting a match, is this information true?

I also hear some hospitals dont even call u for an interview if they learn that they will have to sponsor u?

BTW r there any American Med School students out there who suffered by the hands of NRMP bcz of being Canadian?

No. Canadians who go to the Carribean, may have to wait a full year.

 

The difference is that while if you go to an American school, you will still have to apply for an H-1B visa (which takes 6-8 months), you can start your internship without it on OPT status, and only need a visa before the start of your second year. But you can only do that if you're already on an F-1 (only if you go to an American school).

 

Canadians in the carribean OTOH need their H-1B before they can even start their internship. Since the match is in March, and residency programs start in June/July, there may not be enough time to apply and get the visa before they start, so some take off a year to apply.

 

In general, needing a visa sucks, but in general a lot of hospitals who have policies against sponsoring them will change their tune once they find out you went to a reputable American school. If people can do it from the Carribean, it'll be leagues easier from an LCME school. I'm not too worried about it. Remember you also have Canada and CARMS to fall back on as well

[Alastriss]

No. Canadians who go to the Carribean, may have to wait a full year.

 

The difference is that while if you go to an American school, you will still have to apply for an H-1B visa (which takes 6-8 months), you can start your internship without it on OPT status, and only need a visa before the start of your second year. But you can only do that if you're already on an F-1 (only if you go to an American school).

 

Canadians in the carribean OTOH need their H-1B before they can even start their internship. Since the match is in March, and residency programs start in June/July, there may not be enough time to apply and get the visa before they start, so some take off a year to apply.

 

In general, needing a visa sucks, but in general a lot of hospitals who have policies against sponsoring them will change their tune once they find out you went to a reputable American school. If people can do it from the Carribean, it'll be leagues easier from an LCME school. I'm not too worried about it. Remember you also have Canada and CARMS to fall back on as well

 

 

Now that is a lot easier said than done. Are people from the carrib getting an H1B that easy?

[token]

Now that is a lot easier said than done. Are people from the carrib getting an H1B that easy?

Haha, from what I've seen on SDN, aside from some suspiciously propaganda like anecdotes, no...they settle for the J-1 if anything.

 

As a Canadian in the Carribean, you would be passed over by American USMGs, Foreign USMGs, American DOs, Foreign IMGs and even American FMGs (Carribean) before they would even consider giving a spot to you. Going for the J-1 would only bump you into the American FMG category.

 

Personally, I would rather go somewhere with their own residency programs (Australia, Ireland, UK). Carribean is a dead end if neither Canada nor the US want you. E.g.

[NiV]

Haha, from what I've seen on SDN, aside from some suspiciously propaganda like anecdotes, no...they settle for the J-1 if anything.

 

As a Canadian in the Carribean, you would be passed over by American USMGs, Foreign USMGs, American DOs, Foreign IMGs and even American FMGs (Carribean) before they would even consider giving a spot to you. Going for the J-1 would only bump you into the American FMG category.

 

Personally, I would rather go somewhere with their own residency programs (Australia, Ireland, UK). Carribean is a dead end if neither Canada nor the US want you. E.g.

 

Thnx everyone for clarifying this to me.

Token: Can u plz tell me where u got this order of choosing residents from, as on the NRMP website it says no preference will be given to American over Caribbean students. So I m confused again

 

As for Canadians who study in America wht kind of USMLE scores do they need to go for non-competitive residency like FM?

[NiV]

HAHA now that I look at wht I called this thread. I m thinking I should have named it something different as ppl might think these are the match results for 2009

Sorry for creating any confusion ppl. I didnt realize this at tht time.

[NiV]

BTW can we get match results for Cnds in American Med School from somewhere. How many appl and how many got it? If not for this year than maybe from last year or the year before that ... within past 5 years

[bugette]

My girlfriend's sister just matched IM at case western and she is an SGU grad. She did work hard and was one of those that "should have been" at a Canadian school. Whoever told you that needs to shove it. I understand that we all like to be pessimists, but pessimism at the point of very delicate information is just dangerous.

 

Ha! There are a lot of "should have beens" around. I never understand how some people get into Stanford, Harvard, John Hopkins, but fail to gain admittance to a Canadian school.

 

But I'm sure there are kids who can afford the American tuition, and opt to go to a big name American school.

[Alastriss]

Oh sorry guys, my girlfriend's friend's older sister just matched into IM at Case western, not my girlfriend's sister.

 

Here is the deal regarding Carribean IMGs, you are placed below american seniors who are citizens, american seniors who are non citizens, and carribean grads who are citizens. You probably beat foreing IMGs who are not from the carrib because they are less known.

 

I dont know where you got that info from NiV, they obviously would give preference to an lcme school over a simply WHO accredited school.

 

Why is the J-1 bad anyways? if you want to practice in canada what's the big deal?

[token]

Here is the deal regarding Carribean IMGs, you are placed below american seniors who are citizens, american seniors who are non citizens, and carribean grads who are citizens. You probably beat foreing IMGs who are not from the carrib because they are less known.

I agree with that except that you'd probably rank below even them. If you're a Canadian Carribean grad, the assumption is that you not only couldn't get into Canadian schools, but US schools too. You'd have to compete with an immigrant who attended one of the top medical schools in their home country (and survived the weeding out process common in Asia and Africa). Also I'm assuming there's zero opportunity for research in the Carribean, while foreign graduates have quite a bit of access (providing it's a world class school).

[Alastriss]

I agree with that except that you'd probably rank below even them. If you're a Canadian Carribean grad, the assumption is that you not only couldn't get into Canadian schools, but US schools too. You'd have to compete with an immigrant who attended one of the top medical schools in their home country (and survived the weeding out process common in Asia and Africa). Also I'm assuming there's zero opportunity for research in the Carribean, while foreign graduates have quite a bit of access (providing it's a world class school).

 

I guess I never thought about it that way. I disagree with the whole carrib philosophy, but that might lead to another discussion where I may get flamed

[n00b]

did your gf's sister's friend want to match in canada? why didn't she...

[NiV]

No. Canadians who go to the Carribean, may have to wait a full year.

 

The difference is that while if you go to an American school, you will still have to apply for an H-1B visa (which takes 6-8 months), you can start your internship without it on OPT status, and only need a visa before the start of your second year. But you can only do that if you're already on an F-1 (only if you go to an American school).

 

Canadians in the carribean OTOH need their H-1B before they can even start their internship. Since the match is in March, and residency programs start in June/July, there may not be enough time to apply and get the visa before they start, so some take off a year to apply.

 

In general, needing a visa sucks, but in general a lot of hospitals who have policies against sponsoring them will change their tune once they find out you went to a reputable American school. If people can do it from the Carribean, it'll be leagues easier from an LCME school. I'm not too worried about it. Remember you also have Canada and CARMS to fall back on as well

 

Token I m not sure what do you mean by internship (rotation/residency) or am I missing out on something.

[Jochi1543]

Why is the J-1 bad anyways? if you want to practice in canada what's the big deal?

 

Doesn't J-1 require you to practice family medicine in Canada for X # of years, or something like that? Or only allow you to go for an FM residency in the US? (which is even worse)

[token]

Token I m not sure what do you mean by internship (rotation/residency) or am I missing out on something.

"Internship" is your first year of residency. In some specialties, it's incorporated into your residency and in others it's not.

[token]

Doesn't J-1 require you to practice family medicine in Canada for X # of years, or something like that? Or only allow you to go for an FM residency in the US? (which is even worse)

You either have to practice in Canada for 2 (?) years, in whatever specialty as long as you can get licensed, or in an underserved area of the US for 3 (?) years (someone correct me on the number of years). I don't think it's that bad...apparently you can make a lot of money if you go the US route since you'll be in an undesired area.

 

If anything the J-1 will allow you to do more specialties than the H-1B, because hospitals don't have to sponsor you for it. If you want something competitive like dermatology or orthopaedic surgery J-1 might be your only option.

[silvermen85]

You either have to practice in Canada for 2 (?) years, in whatever specialty as long as you can get licensed, or in an underserved area of the US for 3 (?) years (someone correct me on the number of years). I don't think it's that bad...apparently you can make a lot of money if you go the US route since you'll be in an undesired area.

 

If anything the J-1 will allow you to do more specialties than the H-1B, because hospitals don't have to sponsor you for it. If you want something competitive like dermatology or orthopaedic surgery J-1 might be your only option.

 

J1 is the visa for specialized professionals, I don't think you are restricted by the 2 year resident country stay to transfer to H1B unless it is specified on your visa stamp (basically if you are sponsored by your home government etc.) In any case, even with J1 visa, you can still apply for a J1 waver that would allow you to transfer to a H1B status.

[Jochi1543]

You either have to practice in Canada for 2 (?) years, in whatever specialty as long as you can get licensed, or in an underserved area of the US for 3 (?) years (someone correct me on the number of years). I don't think it's that bad...apparently you can make a lot of money if you go the US route since you'll be in an undesired area.

 

If anything the J-1 will allow you to do more specialties than the H-1B, because hospitals don't have to sponsor you for it. If you want something competitive like dermatology or orthopaedic surgery J-1 might be your only option.

 

Oh, ok. For some reason, I think I read on here a long time ago that J-1 basically tied you into FM for good.

[Alastriss]

Ok

 

IF I am not mistaken, the H1B and J-1 visa are the same time in ln length. You can hold J-1 for 6 years and you can hold an H1B for 6 years (3 years, renewed once). So as far as residency training you have 1 year OPT + 6 years = 7.

 

Two issues with the J-1 visa are 1) that you need to return to your home country, which isn't bad since you can do a fellowship or literally start to practice if you are on par for the number of years of your speciality (3 years working at a VA hospital OR underserved area is an alternative), and 2) that you need to get a statement of need. This is where this link may be helpful:

 

http://www.valuemd.com/st-georges-university-school-medicine/150715-canadians-visa-issue-5.html

[token]

Here's a couple more links:

 

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=4706868#post4706868

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=89

 

^Canadians who went to American schools talking about applying to American residencies.

 

They completely dismissed the J-1 (Carrib grads may be willing to put up with the ROS/waiver stuff, but if you go to an LCME school you shouldn't have to). Apparently if you do well and apply broadly it's very possible to get an H-1B.

 

If disaster strikes (or you decide you just have to go to UCSF or something), the J-1 will likely be available. In that case you'd be treated exactly the same as any other American citizen AMG.

 

Personally I'm going in with that attitude...I want an H-1b, but since they will probably be harder to come by by the time we graduate, it's nice to know the J-1 option is there as well. I e-mailed the colleges in Quebec and Ontario last month and got this year's lists of specialties they are willing to sponsor....it's pretty much all of them (or at least all the ones I'm interested in). I'm sure the lists will change but I doubt they'd go from that to only sponsoring primary care.

[Alastriss]

I thought the RoS waiver is only for those who are IMGs?

[silvermen85]

Here's a couple more links:

 

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=4706868#post4706868

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=89

 

^Canadians who went to American schools talking about applying to American residencies.

 

They completely dismissed the J-1 (Carrib grads may be willing to put up with the ROS/waiver stuff, but if you go to an LCME school you shouldn't have to). Apparently if you do well and apply broadly it's very possible to get an H-1B.

 

If disaster strikes (or you decide you just have to go to UCSF or something), the J-1 will likely be available. In that case you'd be treated exactly the same as any other American citizen AMG.

 

Personally I'm going in with that attitude...I want an H-1b, but since they will probably be harder to come by by the time we graduate, it's nice to know the J-1 option is there as well. I e-mailed the colleges in Quebec and Ontario last month and got this year's lists of specialties they are willing to sponsor....it's pretty much all of them (or at least all the ones I'm interested in). I'm sure the lists will change but I doubt they'd go from that to only sponsoring primary care.

 

 

Can you even apply for H1-B while as a medical student? Minus the fact you get married to an American citizen etc.

[token]

I thought the RoS waiver is only for those who are IMGs?

Hm I dunno unless the rules have changed.

 

silvermen85, the hospital will apply for the H-1B while you're doing your internship. Any non-citizen can get one as long as the hospital is willing.