Applying To US DO Med Schools - FAQs, Guidance & Canadian Friendly Schools

[Slashsev]

I'd say don't give up

I had a crap gpa like u but fixed it fast

2.0,2.2, 3.7,3.85 ....plus masters n more more more classes

 

Use the DO. Repeat to fix bad classes

 

You are in a strong fight

 

 

I also suggest looking for a job n working ...MBA etc...

 

A big fat paycheaque will destroy dreams of medschool

Peps are clueless and are stuck in this med fantasy that's not there

Explore all options

 

Ave age of medschool are 26..

[Slashsev]

I say this after doing sci then business

 

People are clueless how powerful the bussiness side is

 

Esp if all u care about is $

 

 

Figure out your direction

 

Once u get that id give it all for the vocation

[Mashmetoo]

http://www.aacom.org/data/applicantsmatriculants/Documents/2011Matriculantsummary.pdf

 

latest data from AACOM - 40 Canadian DOs matriculated in 2011 (the first year after my sticky here went live!) vs 15 Canadians in 2010, the year I matriculated when there was no sticky about USDOs

 

We are the 1%!!

[Slashsev]

When did msu can start??

[Mashmetoo]

When did msu can start??

 

If you mean their Canadian initiative, started in 2011 I think. Their first CAN initiative class was the 2015 class.

[bpatient]

When do you think the Canadian initiative will stop/be filled up, especially with them offering acceptances for the "next" year.

[Mashmetoo]

When do you think the Canadian initiative will stop/be filled up, especially with them offering acceptances for the "next" year.

 

It'll be around for 3 more years I estimate. It was initially meant for 5 years only, we are into the 3rd application cycle now.

 

But who knows, maybe they'll extend it, will just have to wait and see.

[Quester]

Speaking of MSUCOM, how disadvantaged will I be if the app is complete by end of July? I know earlier the better, but I won't get MCAT score until then...

[Mashmetoo]

Speaking of MSUCOM, how disadvantaged will I be if the app is complete by end of July? I know earlier the better, but I won't get MCAT score until then...

 

I don't know as I've never applied to MSU. But from what I hear, the 25 available seats gets filled up rapidly... The apps started on May 3rd already so.. You'll probably be in the middle of the pack.

[Quester]

I don't know as I've never applied to MSU. But from what I hear, the 25 available seats gets filled up rapidly... The apps started on May 3rd already so.. You'll probably be in the middle of the pack.

 

Ah damn it. Thanks. I guess I shouldn't throw in the white towel yet though...

[Mashmetoo]

Ah damn it. Thanks. I guess I shouldn't throw in the white towel yet though...

 

Keep in mind there's waitlists for that 25 spots, and there's some movement. Also, MSU is a pretty expensive school, there are other cheaper options. Beginning of August isn't that bad.

[Quester]

Keep in mind there's waitlists for that 25 spots, and there's some movement. Also, MSU is a pretty expensive school, there are other cheaper options. Beginning of August isn't that bad.

 

That's good to know. Yeah, the cost is crazy but I rather get in this cycle than reapply again the year after. Pretty much applying wherever there's a possibility...

 

Do you know any schools that send out secondaries before receiving the MCAT score?

[Mashmetoo]

That's good to know. Yeah, the cost is crazy but I rather get in this cycle than reapply again the year after. Pretty much applying wherever there's a possibility...

 

Do you know any schools that send out secondaries before receiving the MCAT score?

 

It's been too long, I don't remember.

[Quester]

It's been too long, I don't remember.

 

I get it.

[ShootingStar]

Speaking of MSUCOM, how disadvantaged will I be if the app is complete by end of July? I know earlier the better, but I won't get MCAT score until then...

 

I was complete in late aug/early sept and my acceptance came in October. I was in the middle of the pack if that's of any indication!

[Quester]

I was complete in late aug/early sept and my acceptance came in October. I was in the middle of the pack if that's of any indication!

 

Thanks! That's a bit of relief...just slightly.

[Patrick1234]

http://www.aacom.org/data/applicantsmatriculants/Documents/2011Matriculantsummary.pdf

 

latest data from AACOM - 40 Canadian DOs matriculated in 2011 (the first year after my sticky here went live!) vs 15 Canadians in 2010, the year I matriculated when there was no sticky about USDOs

 

We are the 1%!!

 

Hey Mashmetoo.

 

Do you have any idea on if we can find stats on where those 40 Canadians ended up for their residency? That would be really helpful to know. (I'm assuming those 40 Canadians don't have a green card or dual citizenship).

[Mashmetoo]

Hey Mashmetoo.

 

Do you have any idea on if we can find stats on where those 40 Canadians ended up for their residency? That would be really helpful to know. (I'm assuming those 40 Canadians don't have a green card or dual citizenship).

 

These 40 Canadians are finishing up their first year right now Residency is 3 years away for them.

[teresachang]

These 40 Canadians are finishing up their first year right now Residency is 3 years away for them.

 

Still would be helpful to know how previous Canadians who did graduate were able to match. Can't seem to find any stats.

[Slashsev01]

Touro com had 1 person (from my interview)

 

match obgyn at mac

 

(i had a friend from tourocom...he said there was 3 canadians

 

the other 2 stayed in the US...one had no intention of moving away from NYC..lol)

 

 

theres a whole thread on this in sdn...DO for canadians

[Patrick1234]

I was recently accepted into Ireland and DO schools this year. I rejected the offer from Ireland and decided to go the DO route because of the 40 vs. 70% match rate and because I thought if worse come to worse than I could do AOA and still work at any hospital I want in the US. But upon further reading, I realized that the 70% match only applies to US CITZENS. I just wonder if I totally screwed myself. Because the more I read, I read that

 

1) A lot of AOAs don't take Canadians because of visa issues and MD residencies as well might have similiar restrictions?, which totally screwed up backup plans for Canadians

 

2) While, we are allowed to match in first round in Ontario/BC in first round, most program directors don't know much about DO so just because we are allowed to do so, doesn't mean anything, they could very well reject DO applicants and allow IMGs from say Ireland which a lot of physicians are familiar with to match in 2nd round (I read on the forum that one person did get interviews but n=1)

 

3) I've contacted a few DOs about shadowing experiences in Ontario and trying to find the closest one to me and most of them are in rural places or doing GP, so now I'm worried that even if I can come back to Canada, it would be hard for me to say work at a hospital in Toronto (i read of one guy at u of t but again n =1) or even if I match in to MD residencies in the states, will it be also hard for me to say work at a hospital in a big city? (New york, Seattle etc...), due to the nature of my fiancee's work, it would be hard for her to find work if she had to say move to Michigan.

 

4) one of the schools I got into for Ireland, they said that last year alone for just that 1 school, all 11 Canadians matched into residencies in Canada so I think for Irish Grads, even though IMG is IMG and have to wait for 2nd round, it seems like program directors still know ireland better than DO and thus the rate for Irish grads is probably a lot better than >40% since that 40% includes all countries. (and from personal experience, I know 10-15 friends who have gone the Ireland route and never had any trouble coming back to Canada for residences while this is not a hard number from cARMS and only personal experience, 10-15 is still larger than the number of DOs who came back to Canada for residency total that I can find)

 

I'm freaking out a little bit about this and is just wondering if I made the right decision. I"m not trying to offend anyone so before people just write oh if i'm so worried then just go do the Ireland route and see if I kick myself in 4 years. I was just wondering if people can comment and provide more info for my questions/points. I rejected my offers from Ireland after all, I wouldn't have done so if I wasn't serious about the DO path, but my goal is to be able to return to Canada and I just wanna make sure it was the right decision.

[Mashmetoo]

But upon further reading, I realized that the 70% match only applies to US CITZENS. I just wonder if I totally screwed myself. Because the more I read, I read that

 

1) A lot of AOAs don't take Canadians because of visa issues and MD residencies as well might have similiar restrictions?, which totally screwed up backup plans for Canadians

 

2) While, we are allowed to match in first round in Ontario/BC in first round, most program directors don't know much about DO so just because we are allowed to do so, doesn't mean anything, they could very well reject DO applicants and allow IMGs from say Ireland which a lot of physicians are familiar with to match in 2nd round (I read on the forum that one person did get interviews but n=1)

 

3) I've contacted a few DOs about shadowing experiences in Ontario and trying to find the closest one to me and most of them are in rural places or doing GP, so now I'm worried that even if I can come back to Canada, it would be hard for me to say work at a hospital in Toronto (i read of one guy at u of t but again n =1) or even if I match in to MD residencies in the states, will it be also hard for me to say work at a hospital in a big city? (New york, Seattle etc...), due to the nature of my fiancee's work, it would be hard for her to find work if she had to say move to Michigan.

 

4) one of the schools I got into for Ireland, they said that last year alone for just that 1 school, all 11 Canadians matched into residencies in Canada so I think for Irish Grads, even though IMG is IMG and have to wait for 2nd round, it seems like program directors still know ireland better than DO and thus the rate for Irish grads is probably a lot better than >40% since that 40% includes all countries. (and from personal experience, I know 10-15 friends who have gone the Ireland route and never had any trouble coming back to Canada for residences while this is not a hard number from cARMS and only personal experience, 10-15 is still larger than the number of DOs who came back to Canada for residency total that I can find)

 

I'm freaking out a little bit about this and is just wondering if I made the right decision. I"m not trying to offend anyone so before people just write oh if i'm so worried then just go do the Ireland route and see if I kick myself in 4 years. I was just wondering if people can comment and provide more info for my questions/points. I rejected my offers from Ireland after all, I wouldn't have done so if I wasn't serious about the DO path, but my goal is to be able to return to Canada and I just wanna make sure it was the right decision.

 

1) Well, the AOA residencies' not taking in foreigners because they don't offer visas has nothing to do with what MD residencies will do relating to visas. MD residencies are known to be much more flexible with visas - see the East coast - and the heavy IMG presence there needing visas.

 

You are mixing up 2 completely separately issues.

 

2) I would also strongly disagree that with your assessment that "just because DOs are offered first round, doesn't mean PDs will pick DOs, so their first round match is meaningless". It certainly is not "meaningless" if you compare the number of applicants in the 1st round and 2nd round, being in the 1st round gives you a huge advantage.

 

Your fear that the DO degree will mean an automatic rejection by the PDs is also unfounded. Most of the time they won't even ask about your DO degree.

 

3) You need to change your mindset and realize that a) After the first 2 years of med school, you really have no or limited decision in where you'll end up eventually.

 

Going in with the mentality that you'll end up back in Toronto is a pretty bad way to plan things. This has nothing to do with the title of your degree. Even CMGs from UofT med school (say), cannot be certain that they'll stay in Toronto for their residency - this is simply the unpredictable nature of medical education.

 

I can tell you one thing right now - whatever it is that you choose (Ireland, DO, even CMGs in a Canadian med school outside of Toronto), ending up back in Toronto is not guaranteed, and more often than not, is not feasible.

 

Also, there's less than 20 confirmed USDOs in all of Canada. I saw the list. There's only like.. 3-5 USDOs in all of Ontario. So having even ONE work at Sick Kid's as a pediatrician is kind of a big deal.

 

As for working in big cities in the US, no one can answer that question for you. It depends on many things - including your stats, how competitive you are, your board scores, the type of residency you are interested in. Things change all the time, and in this early part of the game, it is entirely pointless to have conjecture in which US city you'll end up in eventually. One needs to keep an open mind, and be ready to accept rapid changes as they arise - again, this is simply the nature of going to medical school.

 

4) You forgot that there's a 5 year Return of service contract with any IMG residency position. So this means after your Irish friends' residency is done, they are obligated by law to move to some northern community for 5 years. If you think that your spouse will have trouble finding work in Michigan.. imagine trying to find a job in Northern Ontario. Whereas with DO - there's no 5 year ROS. I can't stress this enough, 5 years is one heck of a long time.

 

Also, you are mixing up the US 40% match rate for IMGs with the IMG match in CANADA. I can tell you right now - the Canadian IMG match isn't pretty either.

Think of it this way - if US citizens who are IMGs had a 40% match rate into US ACGME residencies, what match % would you expect for NON US citizens? Asked another way - do you expect NON US citizens (from say Ireland) to match better on average than the US citizen IMG? - In other words, I'd expect the match rate (on average) for NON US citizen IMGs to be even less than 40%.

 

For a decade, the USDO option was a neglected route for Canadians. The few Canadians that did go to USDO schools didn't bother writing the Canadian licensing exams and opted to stay in the US. I'm beginning to see the trend of USDOs opting to come back to Canada, and match in the CaRMs. Take a look on the match list for Canadians on the first page - we have matches in McMaster, UT, NOSM, Ottawa. It's certainly been done, and none with the 5 year ROS.

 

Lastly, I can offer you this. the COA/ COMSA is not content with only BC/ON, Alberta giving us access to CaRMS. I am certain that within the next 3 years (or by the time you have to apply for residency), that we'll be more Canadian jurisdictions to give USDOs the first round match for CaRMs.

And no, you are not screwed, you made the right choice and you'll see the benefits when the time comes.

[thegame11]

I was recently accepted into Ireland and DO schools this year. I rejected the offer from Ireland and decided to go the DO route because of the 40 vs. 70% match rate and because I thought if worse come to worse than I could do AOA and still work at any hospital I want in the US. But upon further reading, I realized that the 70% match only applies to US CITZENS. I just wonder if I totally screwed myself. Because the more I read, I read that

 

No, I don't think you made the wrong decision. Like you said, if you live in bordering cities, you can work in the US and live in Canada... detroit/windsor...

 

1) A lot of AOAs don't take Canadians because of visa issues and MD residencies as well might have similiar restrictions?, which totally screwed up backup plans for Canadians

 

No, MD residencies don't have similar restrictions. Many of them offer visas to foreigners. If you work hard, you should be able to secure a family medicine residency. Outside of primary care, things get difficult but not impossible.

 

2) While, we are allowed to match in first round in Ontario/BC in first round, most program directors don't know much about DO so just because we are allowed to do so, doesn't mean anything, they could very well reject DO applicants This may change in the future since a lot of people are now in osteopathic programs. When they apply to residencies in a few years, more and more PDs will become aware of DOs...and allow IMGs from say Ireland which a lot of physicians are familiar with to match in 2nd round (I read on the forum that one person did get interviews but n=1)

 

3) I've contacted a few DOs about shadowing experiences in Ontario and trying to find the closest one to me and most of them are in rural places or doing GP If they are family doc, maybe they choose to work in a rural setting. I imagine that family docs can open their shop anywhere they want too...But, I am not sure... , so now I'm worried that even if I can come back to Canada, it would be hard for me to say work at a hospital in Toronto (i read of one guy at u of t but again n =1) or even if I match in to MD residencies in the states, will it be also hard for me to say work at a hospital in a big city? (New york, Seattle etc...) No, you won't have any trouble find work in a urban setting if you are DO. In America, DOs are everywhere...large cities, small cities... , due to the nature of my fiancee's work, it would be hard for her to find work if she had to say move to Michigan.

 

 

 

4) one of the schools I got into for Ireland, they said that last year alone for just that 1 school, all 11 Canadians matched into residencies in Canada so I think for Irish Grads, even though IMG is IMG and have to wait for 2nd round, it seems like program directors still know ireland better than DO and thus the rate for Irish grads is probably a lot better than >40% since that 40% includes all countries. (and from personal experience, I know 10-15 friends who have gone the Ireland route and never had any trouble coming back to Canada for residences while this is not a hard number from cARMS and only personal experience, 10-15 is still larger than the number of DOs who came back to Canada for residency total that I can find)

 

I'm freaking out a little bit about this and is just wondering if I made the right decision. I"m not trying to offend anyone so before people just write oh if i'm so worried then just go do the Ireland route and see if I kick myself in 4 years. I was just wondering if people can comment and provide more info for my questions/points. I rejected my offers from Ireland after all, I wouldn't have done so if I wasn't serious about the DO path, but my goal is to be able to return to Canada and I just wanna make sure it was the right decision.

 

 

 

 

I think you should stop freaking out. You should be happy that you have been accepted to medical school. It's pretty hard to exactly predict your life. You are always taking a risk when you step outside of Canada. Just work hard, try your best and hope that everything will turn out fine

[Slashsev]

When i had my SGU interview (i know its not ireland)

 

 

I asked about DOs...

 

he said dont go to SGU and do DO...

[Quester]

When i had my SGU interview (i know its not ireland)

 

 

I asked about DOs...

 

he said dont go to SGU and do DO...

 

The 'interviewer' said this?