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Medical School Second Undergrad Degree Policies (Updated Aug 8, 2012)


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Please post here if anything needs to be updated.

 

List of schools:

 

University of Alberta

 

http://www.med.ualberta.ca/Education/UME/admissions/dofm.cfm

 

For applicants who have completed 4 or more years of post-secondary transferable course work, the admissions cumulative (academic) average is calculated with the deletion of the lowest year GPA, provided it is not the most recent completed year, nor the one and only year where 30 transferable units of course weight (5 full course equivalents) have been completed.

University of British Columbia (Updated Jan 9, 2012)

 

http://www.med.ubc.ca/education/md_ugrad/MD_Undergraduate_Admissions/Welcome_Message.htm

 

Two academic evaluations are calculated:

 

Overall academic average based on all university-level courses attempted (including summer courses and graduate courses with grades, if applicable);

Adjusted academic average In addition to the overall academic average, an adjusted academic average is calculated for certain applicants. In the adjusted academic average the academic year with the lowest academic average will be dropped (if applicable). At most, 30 credits can be dropped. If more than 30 credits are presented in the worst academic year, the 30 credits with the lowest grades will be removed. In order to have the academic year with the lowest academic average dropped, applicants must have 90 credits with grades remaining by the application deadline.

 

Pre-Interview: The first cut-off for invitation to interview is based on a score derived from applicants’ Overall Academic Average or Adjusted Academic Average (if applicable) and a Non-Academic Qualities Score. At this stage the academic and non-academic scores are weighed equally.

 

 

University of Calgary (Updated Feb 21, 2012)

 

http://www.ucalgary.ca/mdprogram/prospective/admissions

 

By hanet:

 

Their format is now similar to U of A's calculation, where you can drop one year if you have completed at least four. This holds true for second/third/more undergrad degrees... so if you have 4 years, you can drop one; if you have 8 years, you can still only drop one, etc.

 

As for grad degrees, the entire cumulative GPA for that degree is treated as the average GPA for "one year" -- so if you have a 4-year undergrad and a masters, you drop the worst year (probably from your undergrad), and your GPA overall is your 3 best years from UG + your overall GPA from your masters. Note that you have to be finished your masters to have that "year" included in your GPA calculation, although you don't have to be finished your program to apply.

 

I would direct you to the 2011-2012 Applicant Manual (see page 6 for minimum requirements and page 11 for some examples), and the admissions blog.

 

To quote page 6 of the applicant manual:

"If the applicant is in the final year of their undergraduate degree or beyond, we will eliminate either the worst full-time year or the worst semester. Applicants with a completed graduate degree will have their overall GPA from their graduate program used as equivalent to one year of undergraduate GPA for the purposes of this calculation."

 

Dalhousie University

 

http://admissions.medicine.dal.ca/academic_requirements.htm

 

Considers your most recent 2 years of full time study (5 credits during September - April). First degree: The minimum requirement for entry is a baccalaureate degree in any discipline. If you take additional full time years of study, this may be used towards your most recent 2 years GPA. There are no conditions on completing the second degree.

 

University of Manitoba (Updated Jan 12, 2012)

 

http://umanitoba.ca/faculties/medicine/admissions/index.html

 

An Adjusted Grade Point Average (AGPA) is calculated and is based on undergraduate university courses including those taken in a spring or summer session and durring part-time studies. Based on the total number of credits completed, we will drop a certain number of credit hours with the lowest grades for the AGPA calculation.

 

Total credit hours 90-95 ==> 15 credit hours dropped

Total credit hours 96-101 ==> 18 credit hours dropped

Total credit hours 102-107 ==> 21 credit hours dropped

Total credit hours 108-113 ==> 24 credit hours dropped

Total credit hours 114-119 ==> 27 credit hours dropped

Total credit hours 120+ ==> 30 credit hours dropped

 

The AGPA will not include graduate program courses but does include courses from a previous degree. The AGPA is 15% of the composite score for all Manitoba, Out-of-Province, Bilingual and MD/PhD Program applicants.

 

McGill University

 

http://www.mcgill.ca/medadmissions/programs/requirements/degree-requirements

 

These requirements apply to applicants in the University categories (Quebec, Out-of-Province Canadians and International). If this is your first undergraduate degree: a 120 credit ("four-year") or equivalent Bachelor's degree from an accredited institution in any discipline. If you hold, or are currently pursuing, an additional Bachelor's degree--after having completed one that meets the requirements described above under "First Bachelor's degree"--and the additional degree demonstrates a stronger academic performance, it will be the degree used as the basis of admission, provided that a minimum 45 consecutive graded credits are completed and earned by the application deadline. There are no conditions on completing the second degree. Prerequisite courses must have been completed within the last 8 years.

 

By Robin Hood:

 

... beginning [2012], the 45 credits of the second undergrad must be completed by November 1.

McMaster University

 

http://fhs.mcmaster.ca/mdprog/academic_requirements.html

 

GPA is calculated on all grades received in the undergraduate credit courses in which they have ever registered. Basically, you can never escape your first degree grades.

Memorial University of Newfoundland

 

http://www.med.mun.ca/Admissions/Home.aspx

 

GPA calculated from all years of university/college ever taken; full-time status not required but considered

 

Northern Ontario School of Medicine

 

http://www.nosm.ca/education/ume/general.aspx?id=1232

 

For an applicant, applying as a Non-Mature Student applicant, who has completed two four-year undergraduate degrees, the GPA will be calculated on each of the degrees, and the best GPA will be used for scoring. For an applicant, applying as a Mature Student applicant, who has completed two undergraduate degrees, the GPA will be calculated on each of the degrees, and the best GPA will be used for scoring. This applies if the combination of degrees includes a three-year degree in addition to the completion of a four-year degree. You must be in the final year of your second degree or already have completed it to have the second degree GPA used.

 

University of Ottawa

 

http://www.intermed.med.uottawa.ca/Students/MD/Admissions/eng/excellence_marks.html

 

A candidate who has completed more than the three required years of full time study (5 credits during September - April), only the three most recent years of undergraduate studies will be used to determine the WGPA. This may span the 2 degrees, there are no conditions on completing the second degree.

 

Queen's University

 

http://meds.queensu.ca/undergraduate/prospective_students/method_of_selection

 

The first cutoff is based on the cumulative converted grade point average (see the OMSAS Conversion Scale) of all years of undergraduate study, including summer and supplemental courses. For applicants who do not meet this cutoff, we will consider the most recent two full time years (minimum 4 full credits during September - April) of completed undergraduate study to determine if this GPA is at or above this determined cutoff. These two years may span both degrees, there are no conditions upon completing your second degree.

 

http://meds.queensu.ca/education/undergraduate/prospective_students/frequently_asked_questions

Do I have to have 5 credits in a year to be considered full time?

Any year in which you have completed a minimum of 3 courses in each academic semester will be considered full time. You do not have to carry a full course load to be considered full time.

 

University of Saskatchewan (Updated August 8, 2012)

http://www.medicine.usask.ca/education/medical/undergrad/admissions/admissions-information/index.html

 

IP Degree Requirement

Applicants may improve their average for admission by taking (an) additional full year(s) of university study. However, all full years must lead to a degree or, where students already have (an) undergraduate degree(s), to a degree in another discipline. It is not acceptable for students who have already spent two years at university to subsequently take largely 100-level introductory courses to improve their average, nor is it acceptable for students to repeat a course they have already taken and use the new grade for competitive purposes. Students working toward a second/subsequent degree* or students taking more than three or four years to complete a 3- or 4-year degree, respectively, must obtain preapproval of additional full years of university from the Admissions Office to confirm suitability for use in the competitive two full year average.

 

*See U of S College of Arts and Science Course adn Program Catalogue containing the College Program Requirements and Policies, Second Degree Programs (www.usask.ca/programs/arts_and_science/1-college-program-requirements-and-policies.html).

 

OOP Degree Requirement (Tentative until Oct 20, 2012)

Application by out-of-province applicants can be made only during or after the final year of a four year degree. If a four year degree is completed prior to application, course-work for the degree must have been started within the 48 months prior to completion of the degree. If applicants are in the final year of a four year degree, a minimum of 90 credit units must have been completed in the 36 months prior to the end of August immediately before application. All courses completed towards the four year degree at the date of application will be used for calculation of the grade-point average (GPA). The minimum GPA required for application will be 83.0%. The four year degree must be completed by the time study of medicine starts. All remaining courses completed for the degree after the date of application must minimally average 83.0%.

 

University of Toronto

http://www.md.utoronto.ca/admissions/information/faq.htm

 

Uses the weighted GPA formula if a full course load (5 full credits during September - April) has been taken in every year. Briefly, a student with three completed years may drop the three lowest full-year course marks, or six lowest semester course marks, or any combination thereof. A student applying with four completed years may drop the four lowest full-year course marks, or eight lowest semester course marks, or any combination thereof. There are no conditions on completing your second degree.

 

There is no limit in the number of courses you can drop for the weighing formula. If you do 10 years of full-time study, you can drop 10 full credits.

 

University of Western Ontario (currently under review, updated Jan 9, 2012)

 

http://www.schulich.uwo.ca/education/admissions/medicine/index.php

 

Second degree only for GPA calc; all years; GPA calculated from 2 full-time years of study (Sep-Apr) - 5 full courses/only 1 pass-fail course per year. Second degree must be "honours degree or equivalent" and the requirement that 3.0/5.0 credits be at the senior level or above (2000 - 4999) courses.

 

By mike88:

 

I'm currently at UWO doing my second UG degree. I have popped into Schulich's offices on a number of occasions to clarify their second degree policies and ensure that I remain eligible, so hopefully I can help. With regards to a second undergraduate degree, this is correct:

 

It must be Honours or equivalent. If you need to clarify what "Honours or equivalent" means, I suggest you read their policy statement. If you fulfill this requirement, they will take your best 2 years of the second degree to calculate your GPA, and drop all courses from your first degree. Keep in mind that although your first degree is not considered in their GPA calculation, they will more than likely have access to your entire academic record.

 

From what I've been told, 2-year degrees are acceptable. You can only apply during your final year of the program. This means if you're doing a 2-year degree, you can only apply to Schulich in your second year. Likewise, in a 3-year degree you can only apply in your third year. If you're applying after only one year of your second degree, they will only take that year into consideration and may offer a conditional acceptance.

 

One thing that I still need to clarify is whether you can apply to the program if you plan on completing your degree the following summer. For example, if you have 6 courses remaining on your current degree in September, can you apply during the current cycle if you plan on taking 5 courses during the year and the 6th course during the following summer semester. When I find out the answer to this question I will post in this thread.

 

As mentioned for the "3/5 rule", 3 out of your 5 full-year courses must be "Senior Level", (Senior Level meaning Year 2 or above). Put simply, you can only take a maximum of two first-year courses per year. Anything more than that will disqualify you. Keep in mind you must have a full 5-course load from September-April. You will be disqualified if you take fewer courses.

 

I was also told by the Schulich office in September that they are working on changing their second-degree policies. They're pretty tight-lipped about what exactly they're changing but I was told that one of the things they're reviewing is the "3/5 rule". It is quite confusing and people have complained about it unfairly disqualifying them when they're program requires that they take a number of 1st year prerequisites. I'm not sure exactly what they're doing to the rule, but I was told that my current course load (I have two 1st-year courses) should be acceptable. I was instructed to take whatever courses were necessary for completion of my degree, and to appeal if it caused a problem with my application. I wasn't aware of the other changes mentioned in this thread, but that doesn't mean they're not possible. If they apply to you I suggest you contact or visit Schulich. In my experience they may take several days or weeks to respond, but they are more than willing to answer any questions if you visit them in person.

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Please post here if anything needs to be updated.   List of schools:   University of Alberta   http://www.med.ualberta.ca/Education/UME/admissions/dofm.cfm   For applicants who have completed

There is. Don't give up i've been there and it works out

I've posted this in other threads, but again, here goes: All this info was given directly from meds admissions offices:   Queen's: Best 2 full-time years from any degree; full-time = 4 full courses

I've posted this in other threads, but again, here goes: All this info was given directly from meds admissions offices:

 

Queen's: Best 2 full-time years from any degree; full-time = 4 full courses, 8 half courses, or 24 credits sep-april

 

UWO: second degree only for GPA calc; all years; GPA calculated from 2 full-time years of study (Sep-Apr) - 5 full courses/only 1 pass-fail course per year

 

McMaster:both degrees used - cumulative GPA; all courses ever taken; no requirement for full-time status

 

NOSM: would be Mature student status; 1st & 2nd degree GPA calculated, as long as 1 full-time year in 2nd degree exists & take higher GPA of the 2 ; if degree is collaborative w/ college, only university courses used to calculate gpa

 

Dalhousie: 2 most recent full-time years; full-time = 5 full credits

 

U Calgary: Best 2 full-time years (from either degree); full-time = 4 full courses/8 half credits/ 24 credits total (Sep-Apr); if degree is collaborative w/ college - email UC w/ exact program description from college to determine whether or not college courses will also be included in gpa calc

 

Memorial: GPA calculated from all years of university/college ever taken; full-time status not required but considered

 

I emailed UofT at the same time, that I emailed all these other schools (in August) but have never heard back

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13. What if I already have an undergraduate degree but am working towards or have recently completed a second undergraduate degree?

 

Students who already have one undergraduate degree and are working towards, or have recently completed, a second degree are not eligible to apply before the final year of their program, which must be an Honors Degree or equivalent program. Three out of 5 full or equivalent courses taken in each of the upper years of the second degree program must be senior-level courses. GPA consideration is based on the two best years of the second degree program only. Applicants who receive a conditional offer of admission must complete all second degree program requirements prior to registration in the M.D. program. (Approved by the Medicine Admissions Committee, May 2008)

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13. What if I already have an undergraduate degree but am working towards or have recently completed a second undergraduate degree?

 

Students who already have one undergraduate degree and are working towards, or have recently completed, a second degree are not eligible to apply before the final year of their program, which must be an Honors Degree or equivalent program. Three out of 5 full or equivalent courses taken in each of the upper years of the second degree program must be senior-level courses. GPA consideration is based on the two best years of the second degree program only. Applicants who receive a conditional offer of admission must complete all second degree program requirements prior to registration in the M.D. program. (Approved by the Medicine Admissions Committee, May 2008)

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As mentioned before in some of my posts, i am on the verge of completing my Bachelor of Nursing degree here in Calgary. I graduate in Nov 2011. I will be starting my second undergraduate degree in Sep 2012. I will primarily be doing it via Athabasca U (entirely distance ed) or at Mount St.Vincent (95% via distance ed).

 

Now my question is, would med schools look at negatively with a BA in Anthro (AU) or BA in psych (MSVU). Do they really care what major as long as I've gotta very competitive gpa etc.

 

Schools I am interested in are Dal, Queens, Calgary & possibly UWO.

 

Any thoughts?

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Two courses every year of UG completed...3 years = 6 courses, 4 years = eight courses, 5 years = 10 courses to my understanding...

 

I don't know if the rule applies after 6. But it may, considering that some people have double degrees..

 

There is no limit to the number you can drop. I've called and talked to the admissions office, and asked on the blog.

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Queen's University

 

http://meds.queensu.ca/undergraduate...d_of_selection

 

The first cutoff is based on the cumulative converted grade point average (see the OMSAS Conversion Scale) of all years of undergraduate study, including summer and supplemental courses. For applicants who do not meet this cutoff, we will consider the most recent two full time years (minimum 4 full credits during September - April) of completed undergraduate study to determine if this GPA is at or above this determined cutoff. These two years may span both degrees, there are no conditions upon completing your second degree.

 

http://meds.queensu.ca/education/undergraduate/prospective_students/method_of_selection

GPA Cutoff

For applicants who do not meet this cutoff, we will consider the most recent two full time years of completed undergraduate study to determine if this GPA is at or above this determined cutoff.

 

http://meds.queensu.ca/education/undergraduate/prospective_students/frequently_asked_questions

Do I have to have 5 credits in a year to be considered full time?

Any year in which you have completed a minimum of 3 courses in each academic semester will be considered full time. You do not have to carry a full course load to be considered full time.

 

Instead of minimum 4 courses, it states a minimum of 3 courses in each academic semester. I believe it is a 60% course load, so it is 3 courses x 2 semesters x most recent 2 years = most recent 12 courses (6 full credits) to be considered.

Please advise if otherwise.

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tooty, here are the updated UBC regulations:

 

Pre-Interview: (Currently Under Review) The first cut-off for invitation to interview is based on academic criteria which may include: Overall GPA (minus academic year with lowest academic average if applicable), prerequisite average, MCAT scores and a Non-Academic Qualities Score. At this stage the academic and non-academic scores are weighed equally.

 

http://www.med.ubc.ca/education/md_ugrad/MD_Undergraduate_Admissions/Evaluation_Criteria.htm

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For McGill University medical school,

when they say that if I demonstrate a stronger academic performace on my second degree, the second degree will be the basis for considering admissions.

 

So let's say you graduate with ~3.7ish cGPA from your 1st degree, and you finish with awesome GPA in your second degree (above 45 credits). Does this mean that McGill will only consider the awesome GPA from your second degree and not count the marks you received from your 1st degree?

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For McGill University medical school,

when they say that if I demonstrate a stronger academic performace on my second degree, the second degree will be the basis for considering admissions.

 

So let's say you graduate with ~3.7ish cGPA from your 1st degree, and you finish with awesome GPA in your second degree (above 45 credits). Does this mean that McGill will only consider the awesome GPA from your second degree and not count the marks you received from your 1st degree?

 

Mcgill will only consider your awesome second degree!

I had a 3.55 in my first degree. i pursued a second degree and killed it (3.9+), and I was accepted to mcgill.

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Hi Guys,

 

I just want to confirm that I understand Western's policy before I make any big moves in terms of my choices for a 2nd Undergrad (I don't want to close any doors).

 

If I plan on doing BSc in Food, Nutrition & Health at UBC ... in order to be applicable for Western I need to:

 

1) Ensure it's minimum 2 years? (This is okay correct - or does it have to be 4 years again?)

2) Apply in the final year of my program

2) Ensure 3 of 5 of my courses are senior level

 

Thanks for your expertise :)

All the best!

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I have a question regarding UWO. I applied this year but if I don't get in I want to do a second degree in nursing while continuing applying. However because of UWO only one pass/fail course I may not be able to make the requirements. But my last two years of my current undergrad gpa should (3.9 3rd year and 3.9 hopefully again this year) as well as mcat. Is there away to have them just look at my first undergrad or am I eneligible to apply if I take a second undergrad in nursing?

 

I had emailed them awhile ago regarding the same question but I haven't goften and response so I was wondering what you guys thought. I do need to do a second degree just to be able to be able to apply to some other schools and as my backup.

 

Thank you :)

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Hi Guys,

 

I just want to confirm that I understand Western's policy before I make any big moves in terms of my choices for a 2nd Undergrad (I don't want to close any doors).

 

If I plan on doing BSc in Food, Nutrition & Health at UBC ... in order to be applicable for Western I need to:

 

1) Ensure it's minimum 2 years? (This is okay correct - or does it have to be 4 years again?)

2) Apply in the final year of my program

2) Ensure 3 of 5 of my courses are senior level

 

Thanks for your expertise :)

All the best!

 

Sounds like you're on the right track. Check out my post on the second page of this thread for more details:

http://www.premed101.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55905&page=2

 

Best of luck in Nutrition! I'm currently at UWO studying the same thing :D

 

 

I have a question regarding UWO. I applied this year but if I don't get in I want to do a second degree in nursing while continuing applying. However because of UWO only one pass/fail course I may not be able to make the requirements. But my last two years of my current undergrad gpa should (3.9 3rd year and 3.9 hopefully again this year) as well as mcat. Is there away to have them just look at my first undergrad or am I eneligible to apply if I take a second undergrad in nursing?

 

As far as I know, they'll only consider the best two years of your second degree. I'm not sure whether they make exceptions, but I'm sure they can clarify that for you.

 

If you don't mind me asking, why are you pursuing a second undergraduate degree? Your GPA will be very competitive at schools that consider your best two years if you keep the 3.9 up this year. Why not work on other aspects of your application (ECs, research, etc.)?

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Sounds like you're on the right track. Check out my post on the second page of this thread for more details:

http://www.premed101.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55905&page=2

 

Best of luck in Nutrition! I'm currently at UWO studying the same thing :D

 

 

 

 

As far as I know, they'll only consider the best two years of your second degree. I'm not sure whether they make exceptions, but I'm sure they can clarify that for you.

 

If you don't mind me asking, why are you pursuing a second undergraduate degree? Your GPA will be very competitive at schools that consider your best two years if you keep the 3.9 up this year. Why not work on other aspects of your application (ECs, research, etc.)?

 

Thanks for the reply mike88 :)

 

 

Yea my last 2 year gpa is good but my cgpa is really bad so I was going to do a second degree in order to apply to Ottawa who looks at at 3 and improve my gpa for Alberta since I'm in province. And maybe allow me to apply to queens. But if doing so does affect western it would really suck. But your right I may just spend the time getting research experience or ther ecs.

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No schools except for Calgary Montreal and Lava care about your undergraduate program. And those 3 schools only give bonuses for difficult programs like law, engineering, comp sci, etc. They don't punish applicants for easier programs afaik.

 

Laval does "punish" you for an easy program. They have a lot of programs with the indice de force de discipline (IFD) that they use to calcule your University R Score (a R Score is a Z Score that looks at your class' strength).

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