Jump to content
Premed 101 Forums

Support Thread for those with Lower GPA's


Recommended Posts

I think you are all right - med schools reserve the right to change gpa weighting formulas at their own will. I may not agree with it, but it is their right. I am just choked because they completely ignored a letter outlining circumstances which sunk my GPA, which are more than valid. This may have been a case where I should have consulted about supporting documents. However, I didn't even get a reply or a request for any... Just an ignore-ance! But then med schools are like that. (Again, I don't agree with that and this may be an infringement on university rules, which I'll find out about this week). In my second degree in science, my GPA is well into the 80's and I would have a shot at the interview... but anyway. I support all applicants with lower GPAs as I know how difficult it is to come back from one, too!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 52
  • Created
  • Last Reply
I think you are all right - med schools reserve the right to change gpa weighting formulas at their own will. I may not agree with it, but it is their right. I am just choked because they completely ignored a letter outlining circumstances which sunk my GPA, which are more than valid. This may have been a case where I should have consulted about supporting documents. However, I didn't even get a reply or a request for any... Just an ignore-ance! But then med schools are like that. (Again, I don't agree with that and this may be an infringement on university rules, which I'll find out about this week). In my second degree in science, my GPA is well into the 80's and I would have a shot at the interview... but anyway. I support all applicants with lower GPAs as I know how difficult it is to come back from one, too!

 

Sounds reasonable, I agree that they should have at least given you a response.

 

Just to play devil's advocate, didnt they already account for any hardship in the NAQ score and hence the perfect result? However, since there is a maximum score for each section it might not have had a major impact on your chances of getting an interview. But this is also present for the AQ, people who get 95% (there are quite a few out there) still get 50/50 even though the difference from 90-95 is SUBSTANTIAL. In both cases it is not reasonable to say that some of the marks should have been allocated in the other section.

 

Sorry if this is getting to personal I thought that it might help for you to have an opposing perspective so when you do approach anyone you might be better prepared.

Good luck :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the good luck wishes MD! :-) I am not sure how they account for hardship but AQ and NAQ should be kept as separate things. You either have the academic qualities to become a doctor or you dont. Volunteering does not make you academically competent. A holistic look at the academics will quickly tell you that, and then the AQ should promptly reflect that. 1.3/50 reflects my hardship, not my abilities. Actually, not mixed in with my gpa from my 2nd degree which is well into the 80's, I would get -10/50. With windchill, lol!!! This is good thinking, MD, I am so glad you brought that up because now I have an answer prepared if they do bring this up!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds reasonable, I agree that they should have at least given you a response.

 

Just to play devil's advocate, didnt they already account for any hardship in the NAQ score and hence the perfect result? However, since there is a maximum score for each section it might not have had a major impact on your chances of getting an interview. But this is also present for the AQ, people who get 95% (there are quite a few out there) still get 50/50 even though the difference from 90-95 is SUBSTANTIAL. In both cases it is not reasonable to say that some of the marks should have been allocated in the other section.

 

Sorry if this is getting to personal I thought that it might help for you to have an opposing perspective so when you do approach anyone you might be better prepared.

Good luck :)

 

A couple points:

 

I think that they do add points for extenuating circumstances only to NAQ. So that may explain why your NAQ in unimaginably high -- because they gave you credit for it.

 

The fundamental difference between this year and last is that last year a 100% NAQ got you closer to an interview because you have 25/27.4 points needed for interview. This year, you need a bit more AQ to get the interview... about 11 points = 5.5 on last year's system.

 

RE: 90 to 95%, I would argue that the difference between 90 and 95 has no bearing on how good of a doctor you will be. There is probably a negative correlation once grades soar into the mid-90s.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That 87% average GPA for interview offers was certainly a shocker. Does anybody have an idea as to how heavily they weight the prerequisite average after receiving an interview? I have an 81.6% prereq average which is falling further below the averages each year, and I was hoping my overall average of 86% would compensate for this, but now both of these figures are below average just to get an interview. Starting to feel like my AQ might hold me back.

 

I called the admissions office today and asked some general questions about what exactly goes into the post-interview score. The lady told me that pre-req gpa factors into your pre-interview AQ score and not your post interview score. For post interview she told me some of the things they look at are interview score, MCAT and general academic trends.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah that's what i was thinking too before I called them,

 

no problem!

 

Thanks for calling! It's good to know that they don't look at pre-reqs post-interview...I'm one of those applicants with low oGPA and low prerequisite GPA but high NAQ. If they did look the pre-req after interview, I'll never be at the same level playing field no matter what even if I get an interview. So it's good that they dont, just out of curiousity, anybody know what's a decent mcat score for UBC? I know they don't place much emphasize but since it is looked at post-interview, just wondering what's consider a good score and how much it's worth...thanks

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Man I a bumbed that they dont look at the prerequisite average as that is my strongest section lol. But I cannot complain since they are going to be looking at the MCAT as well (even though I didn't do as well as I hoped :( ).

 

I'd rather them not to look at either lol

well, its beyond our control :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I may be getting a bit picky, but it would be nice to see the standard deviation of GPAs rather than just the average GPA for interviewees. The average GPA is around 87% this year, and average AQ was something like 38. I wonder how many points are lost in the AQ with each percent.

 

It appears from the data people posted that 1% difference in GPA = 3.4 AQ points

 

 

Look at the graph that I posted on page 36 of the huge interview results thread:

 

http://www.premed101.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57628&page=36

 

 

 

 

I think it would be more beneficial if they posted the standard deviation of the NAQ marks as no one currently knows how that works.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This may be an ignorant question, but why is everyone saying that there is a greater emphasis on GPA and that lower GPAs are particularly disadvantaged this year due to the "new system"? As far as I can tell, they only changed the method by which the AQ is determined, not the emphasis on grades overall.

 

Its because the spread in the NAQ seems to be fairly low. All the marks seemed to be clustered in the 30s with very few (if any) below 20 or over 40 (except 1 out lier). While in the AQ there is much more differentiation ultimately resulting in it becoming the deciding factor.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting. These things seem to happen unintentionally sometimes; UofC recently admitted that their system of awarding points for GPA and MCAT put an unwanted emphasis on MCAT due to the lack of variation awarded amongst differing GPAs.

 

Yep- and that's exactly what has happened at UBC. They need to go back and do some 1st-yr stats if they want to make the NAQ and AQ "worth" the same.

:)

 

I just took a look at the website though, and they used to have something written along the lines of: "Pre-interview, NAQ and AQ are weighted equally", but it doesn't say that anymore.

 

I predict that the NAQ of accepted applicants will not be very different at all from that of accepted applicants, essentially making the AQ the deciding factor, just as with UofC your MCAT used to be the deciding factor if you got an interview or not.

 

I'm surprised that someone at admissions said that pre-reqs were pre-interview, because if that were the case we shouldn't see straight aGPA lining up nicely along a line.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Although I accept the statement made earlier about MCAT variation at UofC leading to unintended weighting, I wonder how appropriate it would to say, evaluate NAQ and AQ both on percentile scales. I think there's a lot more actual variation in academic ability present in the applicant population than there is in ECs. Besides rare outliers, I would guess that it is very hard to evaluate one applicant's NAQ as better than another's, since most would have the same stuff (some volunteering, maybe a few clubs, a research experience), so the difference between say, 20th percentile and 80th percentile in NAQ could essentially become just a matter of luck.

 

Apologies to the OP, but does anyone else find it ironic that there's an incorrect apostrophe in the title of this thread? :P

 

Is it incorrect? I honestly don't know. I thought apostrophes were appropriate for pluralization of acronyms.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Is it incorrect? I honestly don't know. I thought apostrophes were appropriate for pluralization of acronyms.

 

Yup. Just because it's mainstream doesn't mean it's right. It should be "GPAs," "I got so many As on my transcript," and "all these 15 year old IBMs are useless". The language is evolving though. I think soon either will actually be considered grammatically correct (just like using "they" as a gender-neutral pronoun instead of using "he or she" or "him or her" all the time... but I digress).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for calling! It's good to know that they don't look at pre-reqs post-interview...I'm one of those applicants with low oGPA and low prerequisite GPA but high NAQ. If they did look the pre-req after interview, I'll never be at the same level playing field no matter what even if I get an interview. So it's good that they dont, just out of curiousity, anybody know what's a decent mcat score for UBC? I know they don't place much emphasize but since it is looked at post-interview, just wondering what's consider a good score and how much it's worth...thanks

 

i think anything around a 30Q is a good score. The average posted for accepted students in last year's cycle is a little above a 31Q I believe. But yeah I really don't think MCAT counts for much at UBC which kinda sucks for me because its a strong point in my application.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yup. Just because it's mainstream doesn't mean it's right. It should be "GPAs," "I got so many As on my transcript," and "all these 15 year old IBMs are useless". The language is evolving though. I think soon either will actually be considered grammatically correct (just like using "they" as a gender-neutral pronoun instead of using "he or she" or "him or her" all the time... but I digress).

 

I digress as well. This apostrophe catastrophe drives me nuts, too.

 

The apostrophe usually designates a contraction (My IMB's having a nervous breakdown) or possession (My IBM's nervous breakdown is making my life difficult!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yep- and that's exactly what has happened at UBC. They need to go back and do some 1st-yr stats if they want to make the NAQ and AQ "worth" the same.

:)

 

I just took a look at the website though, and they used to have something written along the lines of: "Pre-interview, NAQ and AQ are weighted equally", but it doesn't say that anymore.

 

I predict that the NAQ of accepted applicants will not be very different at all from that of accepted applicants, essentially making the AQ the deciding factor, just as with UofC your MCAT used to be the deciding factor if you got an interview or not.

 

I'm surprised that someone at admissions said that pre-reqs were pre-interview, because if that were the case we shouldn't see straight aGPA lining up nicely along a line.

 

Very eloquent and exactly true. I can`t believe they don`t realize this with people`s scores ending up being so low. This is pure insanity. It seems like they took the easy route this year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i think anything around a 30Q is a good score. The average posted for accepted students in last year's cycle is a little above a 31Q I believe. But yeah I really don't think MCAT counts for much at UBC which kinda sucks for me because its a strong point in my application.

 

31Q is a good score (upper 18% or so). I have said this before, but I definitely think MCAT counts for a little more than people think (ie. average Bio score is between 11-12 which is nothing to sneeze at). I know there are numerous posts on here about people getting accepted with MCATS in mid to high 20's but for every person with that score there is someone scoring in mid to high 30's. Also I have heard before that MCAT counts for "tiebreakers" which no one really fully understands, but all things considered I think a good MCAT score will only help an applicant.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

31Q is a good score (upper 18% or so). I have said this before, but I definitely think MCAT counts for a little more than people think (ie. average Bio score is between 11-12 which is nothing to sneeze at). I know there are numerous posts on here about people getting accepted with MCATS in mid to high 20's but for every person with that score there is someone scoring in mid to high 30's. Also I have heard before that MCAT counts for "tiebreakers" which no one really fully understands, but all things considered I think a good MCAT score will only help an applicant.

 

I have a 31M (i know my writing is bad...) but hopefully it's a decent enough score,....what do you guys think?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

31Q is a good score (upper 18% or so). I have said this before, but I definitely think MCAT counts for a little more than people think (ie. average Bio score is between 11-12 which is nothing to sneeze at). I know there are numerous posts on here about people getting accepted with MCATS in mid to high 20's but for every person with that score there is someone scoring in mid to high 30's. Also I have heard before that MCAT counts for "tiebreakers" which no one really fully understands, but all things considered I think a good MCAT score will only help an applicant.

 

Yeah I got a 34Q so i'm hoping your suspicions are right. But you have to remember that people with higher gpa's will tend to get higher MCAT scores so that may explain why the MCAT scores for accepted applicants are high. Correlation is not causation!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I called the admissions office today and asked some general questions about what exactly goes into the post-interview score. The lady told me that pre-req gpa factors into your pre-interview AQ score and not your post interview score. For post interview she told me some of the things they look at are interview score, MCAT and general academic trends.

 

 

 

They only use pre-req as part of GPA... we've seen the aq formula

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...