epson Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 lobby the government to increase the number of spots (after all more physicians are needed) ... ... just a thought, as I try to focus studying for my last midterm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP2118 Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 Something tells me that will be ineffective... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP2118 Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 I propose increasing the number of seats for next years U of C class to 500, with 50% seats for OOP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastboundanddown Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 I propose increasing the number of seats for next years U of C class to 500, with 50% seats for OOP. I second the motion. How many votes do we need to have this put into legislation??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zxcv Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 Before I got in I used to think that the main problem was a lack of physician. My personal bias as a pre-med also clouded my judgement (we all want more seats; I remember searching the stats of places I interviewed and calculating my chance of getting... desperate to cling on to any drop of hope). However, once you get in you will realize and learn that the overall problem isn't a lack of physician. Rather its an unequal distribution of physicians especially in rural areas and different specalities (unfortunatley we are still taining physicians in areas which there are no current jobs). Additionally, the solution isn't as simple as adding more physicians. If you want to lobby, lobby for increase in long-term care facilities, greater incentives for physicians to practice in rural communities, changes in structure so money isn't wasted at various burecratic channels... but again, why would someone do that since the gains is less and the work required is far more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnb88 Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 Before I got in I used to think that the main problem was a lack of physician. My personal bias as a pre-med also clouded my judgement (we all want more seats; I remember searching the stats of places I interviewed and calculating my chance of getting... desperate to cling on to any drop of hope). However, once you get in you will realize and learn that the overall problem isn't a lack of physician. Rather its an unequal distribution of physicians especially in rural areas and different specalities (unfortunatley we are still trying physicians in areas which there are no current jobs). Additionally, the solution isn't as simple as adding more physicians. If you want to lobby, lobby for increase in long-term care facilities, greater incentives for physicians to practice in rural communities, changes in structure so money isn't wasted at various burecratic channels... but again, why would someone do that since the gains is less and the work required is far more. There's a huge problem with that (I used to live in rural AB). Unless there's a HUGE influx of docs into those rural areas, as a rural doc, you WILL NOT have a life other than being a doc, and likely will leave within a few years (there's a reason why there's so many non-Canadians that are doctors in the rural areas- they're the only ones willing to stay there...). One doctor I knew in the community I used to live in, would leave his house at 7am, and come home at 9pm. Everyday. He BARELY saw his kids for a good 2 years. Needless to say, he moved back to a larger community. Also, I find in AB, it's not just in the rural areas where you have the difficulty of finding a doctor- even in urban areas (like Edmonton) it's nearly impossible to find a family doctor. I know a lot of practices that aren't taking ANY new patients (not even siblings). A lot of people don't even have a family doctor. So it's not just rural AB that needs doctors. It's actually quite shocking how terrible/broken the system actually is. I never realized it until I came to TO, and every time I've had to go or get tests done, I'm shocked at how quickly they can be done. Appointments or tests that in AB would take weeks or months (even in Edmonton!), I've gotten within the week (if not the next day). The whole system needs a fix- not just the number/location of docs. But.... It's the AB government. They're more interested in tax cuts for Big Oil than money for health care or education:rolleyes: (too political? lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatonekid Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 Before I got in I used to think that the main problem was a lack of physician. My personal bias as a pre-med also clouded my judgement (we all want more seats; I remember searching the stats of places I interviewed and calculating my chance of getting... desperate to cling on to any drop of hope). However, once you get in you will realize and learn that the overall problem isn't a lack of physician. Rather its an unequal distribution of physicians especially in rural areas and different specalities (unfortunatley we are still trying physicians in areas which there are no current jobs). Additionally, the solution isn't as simple as adding more physicians. If you want to lobby, lobby for increase in long-term care facilities, greater incentives for physicians to practice in rural communities, changes in structure so money isn't wasted at various burecratic channels... but again, why would someone do that since the gains is less and the work required is far more. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylamonkey Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 I say automatic interview (or +points) for anyone willing to sign a 5-yr return-of-service at the time of application. Out of curiosity, would anyone actually sign that? What if it was 10 yrs? I would, since to be honest it wouldn't change where I would wind up or change my life at all. I live in Whitehorse and the care in Yukon is desperate. It's ridiculous that there are people willing and WANTING that lifestyle and the admissions process is not adjusted to fit that. For the record, I am also in favour of affirmative action for aboriginal applicants. I attended a talk by Phil Fontaine the other day, and I have no idea where this number is from, but he said that there are 250 aboriginal doctors in Canada! I think he may be excluding Metis in that figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zxcv Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 I say automatic interview (or +points) for anyone willing to sign a 5-yr return-of-service at the time of application. Out of curiosity, would anyone actually sign that? What if it was 10 yrs? I would, since to be honest it wouldn't change where I would wind up or change my life at all. The main problem is how do you enforce that. Someone can sign something and then "change their mind"? Once someone is an MD, not much can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoote Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 Actually, its kind of being done but in a different way... The U of M has a bursary of some sort where during your med degree or residency, you can get grants of like 10 or 20k but for each one you owe them a year or so of time in a rural area. How they enforce it? Not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zxcv Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 Actually, its kind of being done but in a different way... The U of M has a bursary of some sort where during your med degree or residency, you can get grants of like 10 or 20k but for each one you owe them a year or so of time in a rural area. How they enforce it? Not sure. The example that you are mentioning applies to individuals who are in medicine. The OPs idea was about premeds being guranteed an interview. Also, once you are given those bursaries you can always leave. However, you are required to give back the money plus any interest on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoote Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 The example that you are mentioning applies to individuals who are in medicine. The OPs idea was about premeds being guranteed an interview. Also, once you are given those bursaries you can always leave. However, you are required to give back the money plus any interest on it. Roger. Good catch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylamonkey Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Yep. To clarify, I'm talking specifically about a rural ROS for pre-interview. I agree that enforcement would be difficult. Maybe there would have to be an application like UBCs "rural and remote suitability score"- a pass/fail type thing so they can see if you are actually committed to living and working in the north/rural areas. The $$ payments to recent grads to go to underserved areas has backfired in some cases too. I know of one recent grad who took $ up here in Yukon, for 3 yrs it was supposed to be, but he left after 2 months with the cash. There's no recourse. The situation is really desperate up here. It just seems, anecdotally, that people with an interest in these areas have more difficulty than others just getting an interview- once we get them we usually interview well, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typical Premed Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 I think MUN has an ROS spot with the Yukon that started last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epson Posted November 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 @zxcv way to rain on my humorous parade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalkeener Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 I say automatic interview (or +points) for anyone willing to sign a 5-yr return-of-service at the time of application. Out of curiosity, would anyone actually sign that? What if it was 10 yrs? I would, since to be honest it wouldn't change where I would wind up or change my life at all. I live in Whitehorse and the care in Yukon is desperate. It's ridiculous that there are people willing and WANTING that lifestyle and the admissions process is not adjusted to fit that. For the record, I am also in favour of affirmative action for aboriginal applicants. I attended a talk by Phil Fontaine the other day, and I have no idea where this number is from, but he said that there are 250 aboriginal doctors in Canada! I think he may be excluding Metis in that figure. Sadly, Aboriginal includes Metis. There is a ratio of 1:30000 Ab doctors to Ab patients vs. 1:50 for non-Aboriginal docs to non-Aboriginal patients. Scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Sadly, Aboriginal includes Metis. There is a ratio of 1:30000 Ab doctors to Ab patients vs. 1:50 for non-Aboriginal docs to non-Aboriginal patients. Scary. yeah the numbers are seriously skewed - I think you are missing one zero in your 1:50 number - it is about 1:500 I believe(?) but that doesn't reduce the scariness factor much. There are 70,000 odd physician members of the CMA right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalkeener Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 yeah the numbers are seriously skewed - I think you are missing one zero in your 1:50 number - it is about 1:500 I believe(?) but that doesn't reduce the scariness factor much. There are 70,000 odd physician members of the CMA right now. Yes it was a typ-o. Sorry. 1:500 is correct and that is seriously scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fouronesix Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 owever, once you get in you will realize and learn that the overall problem isn't a lack of physician. Rather its an unequal distribution of physicians especially in rural areas and different specalities (unfortunatley we are still taining physicians in areas which there are no current jobs). Is there hard data to support this? I mean, we all hear of specialties with relatively little jobs available (e.g. radiation oncology) but I've never seen an actual paper describing this discrepancy. Regarding the urban-rural distribution, I think the Alberta schools are actually doing relatively well. At my own school we have to take time off from research or whatever during the summer just to get any degree of rural exposure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylamonkey Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Is there hard data to support this? I mean, we all hear of specialties with relatively little jobs available (e.g. radiation oncology) but I've never seen an actual paper describing this discrepancy. I'm not going to find a paper for it, but here you go: "99.8% of Canada's 10 million square kilometres are rural by area. 31.4% of Canada’s population or roughly 9 million people live in predominantly rural regions. Towns under 10,000 account for 22.2% of the population, and yet they are served by only 10.1% of physicians. Canada's larger rural and regional centres 10,000 to 100,000 population constitute 15.9% of the population and have only 11.9% of the physician pool. With sub specialists and high technology of large cities distant, country doctors work in small groups in settings which require a broad spectrum of clinical skills. " From Society of Rural Physicians of Canada, http://www.srpc.ca/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fouronesix Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 Thanks Kyla. I am aware (and have read) that there's a discrepancy between urban and rural health care - and I do intend to gain some exposure to rural health care sometime during my medical education. I was hoping more for data on the disconnect between residency spots and the available of jobs in the field though: that's something I hear lots about anecdotally but don't actually see described stats-wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obi Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 Once the boomers retire.... I see this physician shortage getting hella-worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrendanJ Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 I say automatic interview (or +points) for anyone willing to sign a 5-yr return-of-service at the time of application. Out of curiosity, would anyone actually sign that? What if it was 10 yrs? I would, since to be honest it wouldn't change where I would wind up or change my life at all. I live in Whitehorse and the care in Yukon is desperate. It's ridiculous that there are people willing and WANTING that lifestyle and the admissions process is not adjusted to fit that. For the record, I am also in favour of affirmative action for aboriginal applicants. I attended a talk by Phil Fontaine the other day, and I have no idea where this number is from, but he said that there are 250 aboriginal doctors in Canada! I think he may be excluding Metis in that figure. Admission to medical school is and should be based upon individual merit. In my view, being a physician isn't a "job" that someone should get or be more likely to get because of race, or a willingness to go to an undesirable place. Rest assured more people will be forced into family medicine residency positions, as class sizes have greatly increased, and royal college specialty positions have not. In the next two to four years many 5 year specialties are going to become statistically much more competitive, and more family medicine spots will be filled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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