medigeek Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I know it varies obviously (a lot) from a lecturer or assistant professor ranking to an associate or full professor (as in 50/60k vs. 150-200k/year). But is there a typical salary per course for lecturers? I know TAs make like 7-8k per course... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peachaso Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Looking at my department's hiring ads... about $6000 per course for part time instructors. That is during the summer but I don't imagine it would be any different from the fall/winter. Generally, I don't think professors get paid per course. But their salary is relatively low compared to medical doctors and whatnot... an assistant prof might make $50-60k? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCA Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Professors who make 100k+ salaries are publicized here: http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/univer12g.html Should give you an idea of the pay of full professors. Not a lot of biol professors at my school made 100k+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bored Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 80 000 to 250 000 Depends on the age, publications, location of their lab, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 80 000 to 250 000Depends on the age, publications, location of their lab, etc. This is partially right. Profs actually make between $80,000 to $700,000. People don't realise that profs make way more than some physicians with time and experience: Source:http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/ This site contains the salary of EVERY prof and other occupations working for the public sector in Ontario making over $100,000. You can even see how much doctors make working at hospitals, you'll be shocked to see hundreds of jobs paying more than doctors. Ex. There's a few primary school teachers/ bus drivers making more than family doctors. There's even a senior scientist making $456,675.05.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 lol, you might get a kick out of this since you like clever money... i have one prof who's a counselling psych, he has a website (private), that saves where he left off from every class, and he does about 30 classes a year, makes 220 k or so (i was really interested in clinical psych and he was telling me how to make money if i decided to go that route... cause he said a lot get good training but never make **** since they have no business sense (many ways like doctors with trad science degrees think working more is the only way to generate more income, because they don't know about networking, what private stuff they can do to augment their work, what consulting they can do and what background they should have... he also did a lot of psychometrics training and did ten hours a week on weekend to cover a psych for the militarty for 160 an hour... he said he worked around 45 hours a week, he even taped and audio looped lectures he sells to online universities... yeah business sense plays a lot into whatever anyone makes, the money i make right now is off the most tangental **** in the world (one even involves undercutting a video game resaler who's making a ton because i got the in some of his employees, i know his pure margin (75 percent based on cost to sale, minus overhead, but still, with 4 stores he carries to much physical overhead to try and stop me if i better him cost to sale (he buys from poor people who need groceries and the flea market for real (the flea market i found out by asking a girl he liked to ask him about his business, lol, where he finds more than 75 percent cost to sale) so you go in, iphone cam his most profitable products (i don't want huge inventory, i want to know what's 6.99 and whats $80, and generally what system is most profitable (super nintendo, believe it or not, sega genesis is the worst) in terms of high priced games... so i go in his store, one of them, and quietly pitch 50 percent for a game... easy, easy decision for him... so now, next aim is to target his marketing find out how he advertises, and get a web buddy to help me mirror advertise my lower physical overhead (kijiji, ebay, or a website, whichever) site, so i can pay more, sell for less, since i target high value items, am way more flexible because i don't have 4 stores, have to do administration, employees, etc., and save on all his other overhead costs... and while i may not make the redic amount he does, the estimates are substantial, espec considering im running about 4 different business at the moment, and this isn't even my main snag, i have stuff that eventually should take over as a singular focus when im back in school, since by then it'll be rediculously profitable (just have to know a few legal loopholes, but like i said, multi-disciplinary education and street smarts > pure science I know it varies obviously (a lot) from a lecturer or assistant professor ranking to an associate or full professor (as in 50/60k vs. 150-200k/year). But is there a typical salary per course for lecturers? I know TAs make like 7-8k per course... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medigeek Posted January 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Looking at my department's hiring ads... about $6000 per course for part time instructors. That is during the summer but I don't imagine it would be any different from the fall/winter. Generally, I don't think professors get paid per course. But their salary is relatively low compared to medical doctors and whatnot... an assistant prof might make $50-60k? 6000 only? Seems quite low... Assuming they teach 3 courses in the fall and 3 in the winter and then 2 in the spring/summer... that's only 48k a year. Lets say 50k/year. Though this is for lecturers I was referring to. Not much money considering how long it takes to do a ph.d ... and that being after a bachelors and masters... That plus the job security factor. Until you get tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 the money is in economics, engineering, business etc. a lot of clinically oriented biology profs (they'd be like in psych but doing stroke research, or imin doing prion research or something... not those ppl who study esoteric basic science that's more or less useless until about 2112 (not all basic sciences, but like paleontology or some ridiculous **** like that (sorry i worked by their department (in the cool sub-department where all the profs are really fun, un-professorial, the grad students were all cool and full of hotties... and yeah... well payed (one of my profs suvs was worth 75 k, around, yeah...), travel a lot for free, and get a year off every seven years and hold patents.... and who the cretin paleos were always jealous off (i'm sorry weirdo, you have a scullet, seriously, you look like you should be in the mental hospital) forever, and will always think paleontologists are creeps, it's Pavlovian) Professors who make 100k+ salaries are publicized here: http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/univer12g.html Should give you an idea of the pay of full professors. Not a lot of biol professors at my school made 100k+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 you're talking about sessional lecturers... contract lecturers in my department had 5 year contracts which payed 72-110 k to teach what medigeek said... those summer courses aren't even taught by sessionals, but phd students of the prof who usually teaches the course... so grad students Looking at my department's hiring ads... about $6000 per course for part time instructors. That is during the summer but I don't imagine it would be any different from the fall/winter. Generally, I don't think professors get paid per course. But their salary is relatively low compared to medical doctors and whatnot... an assistant prof might make $50-60k? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peachaso Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Yeah, $6000 is for sessional lecturing, which is notorious for low pay. Often sessional lecturers actually have their phd though, but either are doing a postdoc or can't find a tenure track job so need to do something to pay the bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsalwayssunny Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 What a lot of people don't realize is how extremely difficult it is to get a tenure-track position. It's virtually unheard of these days for someone fresh out of their Ph.D. to be hired, so the general route goes something like this: bachelors (4 yrs), master's (2-3 yrs), Ph.D. (4-6 yrs), one or two post-doc positions (2-4 yrs). During a post-doc, you will make around 40 000 per year (keep in mind that this is you at around age 30, with a Ph.D. in hand). This would put most people at around 32 to 35 years old by the time they land a tenure-track position, which would then be at the assistant professor level. The road to tenure that follows can also be extremely stressful, and will depend on how successful you are at gaining funding and getting publications. So yes, some professors in the sciences make over 100,000/yr, but those really high salaries that you hear about are generally for business or law professors, with a few exceptions. Additionally, many people apply at upwards of 70 different schools before being hired, meaning that unless you're an absolute star in your field you will have next to no say over where you end up. I know that this post sounds pretty negative, but I just wanted to lend some reality to the discussion! If you're passionate about research, none of these will be real obstacles and the positives (academic freedom, etc) will make the journey not only well worthwhile, but also a lot of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bored Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 This is partially right. Profs actually make between $80,000 to $700,000. People don't realise that profs make way more than some physicians with time and experience: Source:http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/ This site contains the salary of EVERY prof and other occupations working for the public sector in Ontario making over $100,000. You can even see how much doctors make working at hospitals, you'll be shocked to see hundreds of jobs paying more than doctors. Ex. There's a few primary school teachers/ bus drivers making more than family doctors. There's even a senior scientist making $456,675.05.... show me a prof who makes $700 000... If you manage to find one, I can show you 10 Physicians that make over that Biology Profs barely break the $200 000 mark and they only do it when they are like 50+. and most biology phd/post docs are those that couldn't get into med. I looked at a random hospital. http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/hospit12a.html Vp of research makes $300 000, whereas most of the senior scientists (age 40-60) make ~150 000. Doctors make much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 the one thing i'm not sure everyone knows, is that many phd's (i worked in a very practically oriented environment where some people's research was worth big $$$) is that many phd's get paid to give private lectures, have patent rights, sit on committees for companies... i'm not talking everyone, but believe me, they're not non-existent, lol. show me a prof who makes $700 000... If you manage to find one, I can show you 10 Physicians that make over that Biology Profs barely break the $200 000 mark and they only do it when they are like 50+. and most biology phd/post docs are those that couldn't get into med. I looked at a random hospital. http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/hospit12a.html Vp of research makes $300 000, whereas most of the senior scientists (age 40-60) make ~150 000. Doctors make much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 show me a prof who makes $700 000... If you manage to find one, I can show you 10 Physicians that make over that Biology Profs barely break the $200 000 mark and they only do it when they are like 50+. and most biology phd/post docs are those that couldn't get into med. I looked at a random hospital. http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/hospit12a.html Vp of research makes $300 000, whereas most of the senior scientists (age 40-60) make ~150 000. Doctors make much more. 1. Look up UofT, there's a few economic profs hitting over $500k. I once saw a prof with 600k on that last last year and i'm not going to waste my time looking for that person again. And as for your statement about doctors making $700,000+, show me a single doctor on that list making over $700k. There are more professionals making doctors, I hate the fact that most premeds like you think doctors make the most money, in fact they dont get paid nearly as much as you think. 2. Regardless, you would be ignorant to believe doctoers make much more than 300k. What imginary world do you live in? If your specielizing, you might be able to make more than 300k but thats only with the highly competitive ones. Look at the list of pathologists, they are mostly in the 200k-250k range. Most doctors in canada make around $130k & specialist avg make $180k. It says so on one of those documents if you have time, take a look and find it yourself instead of speculating salaries. Those are official documents released by the government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bored Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 1. Look up UofT, there's a few economic profs hitting over $500k. I once saw a prof with 600k on that last last year and i'm not going to waste my time looking for that person again. And as for your statement about doctors making $700,000+, show me a single doctor on that list making over $700k. There are more professionals making doctors, I hate the fact that most premeds like you think doctors make the most money, in fact they dont get paid nearly as much as you think. 2. Regardless, you would be ignorant to believe doctoers make much more than 300k. What imginary world do you live in? If your specielizing, you might be able to make more than 300k but thats only with the highly competitive ones. Look at the list of pathologists, they are mostly in the 200k-250k range. Most doctors in canada make around $130k & specialist avg make $180k. It says so on one of those documents if you have time, take a look and find it yourself instead of speculating salaries. Those are official documents released by the government. Well I was referring to science profs. I believe business, finance and economics profs are listed on thee as making a lot because most teach on a part time basis because they own a business or work in the private sector. I think thats why many business profs are listed as making so much more than biology profs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Well I was referring to science profs. I believe business, finance and economics profs are listed on thee as making a lot because most teach on a part time basis because they own a business or work in the private sector. I think thats why many business profs are listed as making so much more than biology profs. Yes but that list composes of the public sector only. What they make in the private sector (their own investments) is not included. Therefore this means those business, finance and economic profs probably make even more than whats listed. I wouldn't be surprised if they make close to 7 figures with their own strategic investments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Yes but that list composes of the public sector only. What they make in the private sector (their own investments) is not included. Therefore this means those business, finance and economic profs probably make even more than whats listed. I wouldn't be surprised if they make close to 7 figures with their own strategic investments. Well anyone else could do that as well A lot of this data can be shown on the sunshine list for the public versions of things in Ontario. Gives a good snapshot as others have mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Well anyone else could do that as well A lot of this data can be shown on the sunshine list for the public versions of things in Ontario. Gives a good snapshot as others have mentioned. Yea I know, I posted a link to the sunshine list on the first page. I know others can do that as well but my point is that doctors don't make as much as what most people think. Their overhead is extremely high and the time to become a doctor is not worth it if you want to do it for the money. Do it only if you really want to, heck I see elementary school teachers making more than some of those doctors on that list. I find it mind boggling that some of the premeds i met want to do this for the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medigeek Posted January 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 This is partially right. Profs actually make between $80,000 to $700,000. People don't realise that profs make way more than some physicians with time and experience: Source:http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/ This site contains the salary of EVERY prof and other occupations working for the public sector in Ontario making over $100,000. You can even see how much doctors make working at hospitals, you'll be shocked to see hundreds of jobs paying more than doctors. Ex. There's a few primary school teachers/ bus drivers making more than family doctors. There's even a senior scientist making $456,675.05.... lol those are salaried doctors...... that list is highly irrelevant when it comes to medicine. The vast majority of doctors are not salaried. Also, most profs will be hitting 40 (bachelors/masters/phd/post doc, second post doc? get hired? or not? ) by the time they're making 80k a year. In medicine you can be a family doc seeing 35-40 patients a day and make >400k/year before you're even 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medigeek Posted January 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 What a lot of people don't realize is how extremely difficult it is to get a tenure-track position. It's virtually unheard of these days for someone fresh out of their Ph.D. to be hired, so the general route goes something like this: bachelors (4 yrs), master's (2-3 yrs), Ph.D. (4-6 yrs), one or two post-doc positions (2-4 yrs). During a post-doc, you will make around 40 000 per year (keep in mind that this is you at around age 30, with a Ph.D. in hand). This would put most people at around 32 to 35 years old by the time they land a tenure-track position, which would then be at the assistant professor level. The road to tenure that follows can also be extremely stressful, and will depend on how successful you are at gaining funding and getting publications. So yes, some professors in the sciences make over 100,000/yr, but those really high salaries that you hear about are generally for business or law professors, with a few exceptions. Additionally, many people apply at upwards of 70 different schools before being hired, meaning that unless you're an absolute star in your field you will have next to no say over where you end up. I know that this post sounds pretty negative, but I just wanted to lend some reality to the discussion! If you're passionate about research, none of these will be real obstacles and the positives (academic freedom, etc) will make the journey not only well worthwhile, but also a lot of fun. Very accurate. Keep in mind post docs involve TONS of hours of work as well. A ph.d can also take 7-8 years and possibly 9-10... OR you may never even finish (solid chance). Our organic chem prof told us doing a second post doc is common nowadays. So being finally hired at age 36-37 is a more likely scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medigeek Posted January 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 show me a prof who makes $700 000... If you manage to find one, I can show you 10 Physicians that make over that Biology Profs barely break the $200 000 mark and they only do it when they are like 50+. and most biology phd/post docs are those that couldn't get into med. I looked at a random hospital. http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/2012/hospit12a.html Vp of research makes $300 000, whereas most of the senior scientists (age 40-60) make ~150 000. Doctors make much more. strong truth in the bold. keep in mind the highest paid doctor in ontario last year made 6.4 million dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medigeek Posted January 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 1. Look up UofT, there's a few economic profs hitting over $500k. I once saw a prof with 600k on that last last year and i'm not going to waste my time looking for that person again. And as for your statement about doctors making $700,000+, show me a single doctor on that list making over $700k. There are more professionals making doctors, I hate the fact that most premeds like you think doctors make the most money, in fact they dont get paid nearly as much as you think. 2. Regardless, you would be ignorant to believe doctoers make much more than 300k. What imginary world do you live in? If your specielizing, you might be able to make more than 300k but thats only with the highly competitive ones. Look at the list of pathologists, they are mostly in the 200k-250k range. Most doctors in canada make around $130k & specialist avg make $180k. It says so on one of those documents if you have time, take a look and find it yourself instead of speculating salaries. Those are official documents released by the government. lolno. http://www.health.gov.bc.ca/msp/legislation/pdf/bluebook2012.pdf (this list contains lots of doctors working part time btw, but you have a massive number of docs hitting 500+ and quite a few making over a million as well as a few over 2 million a year) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/six-ontario-doctors-each-billed-taxpayers-more-than-3-million-last-year/article4571129/ And it is VERY possible to make over 400k/year as just a family doctor. See 40 patients a day.. do the math yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medigeek Posted January 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Yea I know, I posted a link to the sunshine list on the first page. I know others can do that as well but my point is that doctors don't make as much as what most people think. Their overhead is extremely high and the time to become a doctor is not worth it if you want to do it for the money. Do it only if you really want to, heck I see elementary school teachers making more than some of those doctors on that list. I find it mind boggling that some of the premeds i met want to do this for the money. Those are docs working like 20 hours a week vs. teachers who teach regular schoo, night school AND summer school all combined (and I've known a couple). Horrible comparison, and those doctors are salaried again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 well, one thing that i have noticed is that people have only mentioned phd's in academia... the only way i would do a phd would be if i expected to be the best in my discipline... pharma's top drug design phd's make a lot more than the biochem prof at ubc... personally i can be quite hedonistic, but even get bored of hedonism... there's only so many parachute dives, cocaine, and sex parties you can go to... then what... i want more than money... and then probably something new again and again, ultimately power and autonomy would be my real real temptations... to decide which laws are frivolous and which are worthwhile, restructure our educational and health care system... i also wouldn't mind playing in front of that 100,000 person crowd at the worlds biggest festivals... and on, an on. Those are docs working like 20 hours a week vs. teachers who teach regular schoo, night school AND summer school all combined (and I've known a couple). Horrible comparison, and those doctors are salaried again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 lolno. http://www.health.gov.bc.ca/msp/legislation/pdf/bluebook2012.pdf (this list contains lots of doctors working part time btw, but you have a massive number of docs hitting 500+ and quite a few making over a million as well as a few over 2 million a year) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/six-ontario-doctors-each-billed-taxpayers-more-than-3-million-last-year/article4571129/ And it is VERY possible to make over 400k/year as just a family doctor. See 40 patients a day.. do the math yourself. 1. Those 400k+ are specialists & thats UBC, not Ontario. 2. And your forgetting family doctors have costs to run clinics: insurance, employee costs, property tax & others. They can take in 400k - costs = left with less than half that in many cases. 3. There are documents that say avg salary is $130k & $180k. Of course salaries vary according to which specialty, but just by looking at that list and seeing bunch of high numbers doesn't mean every doctor makes that. Those are the top tier doctors who killed the rest for their choice in speciality positions after med school. And last thing, keep in mind location a Doctor in Toronto may not make as much as some in other places due to the heavy competition in Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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