Ask me anything about nursing

[mursing]

Hi Mursing,

 

Just some questions for you

 

1) Are male nurse really in high demand? Are there advantages in terms of higher salary or ease of finding a job?

 

2)Is there a real difference between becoming an RN via university versus college? The general thinking is college is more practical, and university has higher success rate in passing the RN. People do say university RN is better.

 

3) What uni/college did you go to for your RN? Can you provide any general info of the different nursing programs in Ontario.

 

4) Is the nursing field in Ontario becoming saturated? People say more RPN are being hired to save on costs.

 

5) Is the dirty side of nursing (poop, cleaning patients) being overblown? I heard you may have to do it your first couple of years working. Is this decreasing with more RPN and personal support workers being hired?

 

 

I'm a male, with a degree in kinesiology. I am planning on applying to physio and nursing for next year. My gpa is around 3.55, and my cgpa is over 3.5.

 

1. All I know is that all of my male nursing colleagues are full-time employees. I found that my female nursing colleagues preferred having male RNs around.

 

2. In Ontario, you have to get Bachelor of Science in Nursing degree from a university.

Some nursing programs are 2 years accelerated (You need post-secondary pre-req to enter - many have degrees)

Some nursing programs are 4 years in a university.

Some nursing programs are 2 years in a college and from 3rd year you go to University to finish the degree program. You get a university degree at the end.

 

3. I went to a nursing program in GTA. That's all I can divulge for now.

 

4. Not worried at all. My univ colleagues were worried that they were not going to get a job as a RN upon graduation due to similar reasons (RPNs, nursing job saturation). Every single one of them are working.

 

5. Poop, vomit. You will deal with them as a student and as a RN. Many hospitals and departments don't have nursing assistants. It will be your duty to clean up poo, vomit, give bed bath, and so on.

 

I never got used to the poop and vomit smell. I always gagged really badly.

 

Some patients get c-difficile... very smelly. VERY SMELLY.

Some immobile patients have bowel movement on the bed pan, and you have to clean them.

Some patients use a diaper to poo and urinate. You have to change their diaper.

[dbz]

thanks for all your input!

 

Im just still not sure if I can get use to the poop cleaning.

[VCanucks]

Hey mursing, just wondering how you found the mcat with a nursing degree? Did you have to go back and take prereqs before applying into medicine?

[mursing]

thanks for all your input!

 

Im just still not sure if I can get use to the poop cleaning.

 

Take a dump in the toilet, get your face near it, and breathe in and out with your nose multiple times.

 

That's how some of my friends trained themselves to get a bit used to the smell.

 

Hey mursing, just wondering how you found the mcat with a nursing degree? Did you have to go back and take prereqs before applying into medicine?

 

As long as you study regularly, you would have plenty of time to study for MCAT.

 

Furthermore, you have the entire summer to study for MCAT.

[Oliver1245]

Just some information about NP. I am a primary care NP with 3 years experience in Ontario at a Community Health Centre, before that with a Family Health Team. I currently see as many clients as my physician counter-parts, I also see the same acuity level of client. Not all are stable. I diagnose, treat, refer and prescribe everyday. My wage is around $90k before taxes. My issue is that although I love what I do, I feel we are cheap help. I am doing what my physican friends are doing (mostly), I still need their signature on narcotics and benzos, but I prescibe everything else. I can do small procedures, sutures, excisions, endometrial biopsies,.....end of story is like I said, love what I do, but frustrated with the pay level. I have a long nursing background, including research and teaching both at college and university level, also have a master of science from Queens. Currently, this is:) my second year for applying to med schools. I just want to do more and get credit for what I do. There are lots of NP jobs right now in Ontario, mostly around Toronto area, but they are there.

[hexonu]

Just some information about NP. I am a primary care NP with 3 years experience in Ontario at a Community Health Centre, before that with a Family Health Team. I currently see as many clients as my physician counter-parts, I also see the same acuity level of client. Not all are stable. I diagnose, treat, refer and prescribe everyday. My wage is around $90k before taxes. My issue is that although I love what I do, I feel we are cheap help. I am doing what my physican friends are doing (mostly), I still need their signature on narcotics and benzos, but I prescibe everything else. I can do small procedures, sutures, excisions, endometrial biopsies,.....end of story is like I said, love what I do, but frustrated with the pay level. I have a long nursing background, including research and teaching both at college and university level, also have a master of science from Queens. Currently, this is:) my second year for applying to med schools. I just want to do more and get credit for what I do. There are lots of NP jobs right now in Ontario, mostly around Toronto area, but they are there.

 

Have you thought about relocating? 90K is is what a new grad NP starts at in my health authority and this is a negotiated salary, with 3 years and two masters degrees I think you'd make substantially more somewhere else. That's actually grossly low as I know of RNs who can make that with minimal overtime.

 

Word of mouth is that Health Canada soon allow NPs to prescribe more meds (including narcotics). Pain management is a big part of our practice (rural) so it only makes sense.

[mursing]

Have you thought about relocating? 90K is is what a new grad NP starts at in my health authority and this is a negotiated salary, with 3 years and two masters degrees I think you'd make substantially more somewhere else. That's actually grossly low as I know of RNs who can make that with minimal overtime.

 

Word of mouth is that Health Canada soon allow NPs to prescribe more meds (including narcotics). Pain management is a big part of our practice (rural) so it only makes sense.

 

I think NPs should get at least $100K/year.

 

I'm guessing NPs in Alberta gets paid a lot.

How much do doctors make there? (Curious, since I'm going to be a doctor in a few years).

[mursing]

90k before taxes while only working 60 hours per week. Are you serious?

Isn't 90k before taxes a lot though lol.

 

It's not that much for the amount and the kind of work they do.

 

My RN friends (Not NP) are all making $80K and over before taxes.

[Oliver1245]

I disagree since NP's don't do much compared to physicians.

 

This comment may take on different meaning depending upon the place of employment. If we are talking family physicians and nurse practitioners, honestly, in a community health centre clinic, we are doing mostly the same stuff....same number of patients. Of course there are differences, but to say "NP's don't do much compared to physicians" as a global statement is untrue.

[hexonu]

I think NPs should get at least $100K/year.

 

I'm guessing NPs in Alberta gets paid a lot.

How much do doctors make there? (Curious, since I'm going to be a doctor in a few years).

 

As far as I know FM is ~150k (AB) when you get into competitive specialities like optho I've seen people making upwards of 900k (used work for an optho).

 

I disagree since NP's don't do much compared to physicians.

 

In primary healthcare NPs do everything an MD would do with the exception of a few things.

 

In the hospital setting NPs function very similar to senior residents. The difference being that residents move on after 3-4 years.

 

Also note that (most of the time) NP renumeration has no "call" factored into. While that MD is making 150k I'd rather not have to take call.

[NLengr]

In the hospital setting NPs function very similar to senior residents. The difference being that residents move on after 3-4 years.

 

My experience with NP's, even in community hospitals, doesn't agree with this, at least in the surgical specialty setting. They function much closer to a junior (probably PGY-1/2) on service resident. I think comparing them to senior residents is a bit of a stretch. Their knowledge level certainly isn't comparable to a PGY-4/5. That includes the NP's I have worked with who had received very specific specialty training.

 

That being said, the NP's played a valuable role in the team and everyone loved having them around.

 

Things may be different in the medical specialties.

[Oliver1245]

Thank you NLengr, you are totally correct, thanks for your insight and your input.

[mursing]

My experience with NP's, even in community hospitals, doesn't agree with this, at least in the surgical specialty setting. They function much closer to a junior (probably PGY-1/2) on service resident. I think comparing them to senior residents is a bit of a stretch. Their knowledge level certainly isn't comparable to a PGY-4/5. That includes the NP's I have worked with who had received very specific specialty training.

 

That being said, the NP's played a valuable role in the team and everyone loved having them around.

 

Things may be different in the medical specialties.

 

Thank you NLengr.

 

hexonu will be hit with a dose of reality when he actually starts practicing as a NP.

[hexonu]

My experience with NP's, even in community hospitals, doesn't agree with this, at least in the surgical specialty setting. They function much closer to a junior (probably PGY-1/2) on service resident. I think comparing them to senior residents is a bit of a stretch. Their knowledge level certainly isn't comparable to a PGY-4/5. That includes the NP's I have worked with who had received very specific specialty training.

 

That being said, the NP's played a valuable role in the team and everyone loved having them around.

 

Things may be different in the medical specialties.

 

In terms of expertise I don't think it's a stretch to say an NP who has worked for a decade in cardiology functions as a PGY-3/4. I guess this depends on your health authority too and what the NP scope allows for.

 

Thank you NLengr.

 

hexonu will be hit with a dose of reality when he actually starts practicing as a NP.

 

I've worked as an RN for many years and I've had many friends who have been NPs. I'm sure I'll be fine, but thanks for your genuine concern .

[NLengr]

In terms of expertise I don't think it's a stretch to say an NP who has worked for a decade in cardiology functions as a PGY-3/4. I guess this depends on your health authority too and what the NP scope allows for.

 

A PGY-4 cardiology fellow is, or will soon be, a fully certified royal college IM physician (they write the IM exam that year). It is a stretch.

 

It would be rare for an NP, no matter how experienced, to be managing the complex cases that the cardiology fellows would be expected to handle.

[medicine man]

A PGY-4 cardiology fellow is, or will soon be, a fully certified royal college IM physician (they write the IM exam that year). It is a stretch.

 

It would be rare for an NP, no matter how experienced, to be managing the complex cases that the cardiology fellows would be expected to handle.

 

I agree. I've worked with many NPs and couple in the cardiology department most of them having >30 years of experience in the field. They function as a PGY-1 resident in a narrow focus on the team, PGY-2 at best in the outpatient setting where usually multiple issues are not being dealt with, however the PGY-1/2 resident has much much more knowledge on interpreting everything else thats not directly that narrow focus. That PGY-1 resident however becomes exponentially better as the year goes on because of different consolidation processes.

 

Its simply difficulty to appreciate all the other factors of medicine that go unnoticed if you don't have broad training.

 

Fellows are exponentially better at everything. Its not even close. PGY4 in cardiology is better at everything. The intensity of study, hours, broad range of decision making and autonomy makes the PGY-4 light years ahead. The consolidation of book knowledge, experience, autonomy, teaching and broad base comes together to make a PGY-3/4 exponentially more badass than a PGY-1 as well. Its also scary to see how many light years ahead a PGY-6 is than the PGY-4s as well. Its totally different when the buck stops with you and how that changes your insight/learning etc...One of the reason the biggest jumps occur after the first PGY1 year, first fellow year and first year as staff.

 

When i was an R-1 in cardiology, the NP was great at a very focus section secondary to lots of experience and got to learn from their experience. But its very narrow focus and PGY-3/4 knows a crap load of general cardiology and general medicine which completely changes perspective and management plans drastically on an everyday basis which is difficult to appreciate from the outside looking in.

[elsa22]

Hi

Thanks for your time

I've just applied for nursing at UBC , looking for a motivated study group to study with them , not all together but at least in same place or schedule to keep motivating each other.

p.s: I'm a new-comer .

 

any idea ?

[robertsherwood34]

I am asking you everything regarding nursing to explain in my nursing essay. I was looking for a place like this to get a good assistance for my assignment. Please tell me everything about nursing. Else I would like to get help from essay writing companies online. I have nothing to ask, because I do not have an idea about it. I believe in you and I would feel great if anything you would like to share with me.

[lozah]

i definitely think it's a stretch to say that NPs function about the same as senior residents because they have such a different educational background. residents have learned/are learning much different things than NPs – they've had 4 years of a deep & wide study of medicine (med school) and now have chosen a specialty to focus in on. NPs learn very different things in a nursing undergraduate degree (they study to become nurses, there is much instruction on patient care, etc. and less HARD SCIENCE), and NP programs vary greatly from medical school curriculum. therefore, NPs and physicians, while there is quite a bit of overlap in family medicine (obvi) etc, have completely different experiences that make them good for different jobs.

 

NPs and physicians are both important and both have awesome jobs, but they aren't the same.

[thebouque]

As far as I know FM is ~150k (AB) when you get into competitive specialities like optho I've seen people making upwards of 900k (used work for an optho).

 

 

 

In primary healthcare NPs do everything an MD would do with the exception of a few things.

 

In the hospital setting NPs function very similar to senior residents. The difference being that residents move on after 3-4 years.

 

Also note that (most of the time) NP renumeration has no "call" factored into. While that MD is making 150k I'd rather not have to take call.

 

family docs make way more than 150k after overheads, and that's in Quebec…

[hexonu]

family docs make way more than 150k after overheads, and that's in Quebec…

 

Hearsay, post reference.

 

Here's mine.

[NLengr]

Hearsay, post reference.

 

Here's mine.

 

That data isn't the greatest. For one thing the average hours worked per week is only 29, which makes me believe that there are a significant number of part time docs dragging the salary down. Also, I'm unsure if they included FFS docs, salaried docs or both.

 

It also lists the average salary for a specialist physician as 85k, so I'm 100% sure their data on physician salaries doesn't come close to reflecting reality.

 

http://www.cma.ca/becoming-a-physician

 

That's the CMA numbers. They included all family docs making greater than 60k a year. That likely means full time family docs make more than the average listed due to part timers.

 

Their numbers:

Gross 246k

Overhead: 28%

Therefore net: 177k

[TML123]

Hey mursing, I am in my 3rd year of nursing and have only done placements on med/surg floors.....PLEASE tell me ER/critical care nursing gets better.

 

Working on these floors, the only thing that's going through my mind is do I really need a 4 year bachelors degree to hand out medications, do bed baths and change diapers? I know if I said that to any nursing prof./nurse they would tear my head off and tell me I don't understand nursing but that is quite literally all I have done....

 

With this in mind the only thing I want to do with my BScN degree now is to get into medicine, but I know how difficult it is to get in so I'm really hoping your going to tell me how awesome ER nursing is......

 

Thanks!

[hexonu]

Hey mursing, I am in my 3rd year of nursing and have only done placements on med/surg floors.....PLEASE tell me ER/critical care nursing gets better.

 

Working on these floors, the only thing that's going through my mind is do I really need a 4 year bachelors degree to hand out medications, do bed baths and change diapers? I know if I said that to any nursing prof./nurse they would tear my head off and tell me I don't understand nursing but that is quite literally all I have done....

 

With this in mind the only thing I want to do with my BScN degree now is to get into medicine, but I know how difficult it is to get in so I'm really hoping your going to tell me how awesome ER nursing is......

 

Thanks!

 

The competencies you've posted are at a first or second year level. What school do you go to? By third you should be learning hemovac drains, central lines, iv therapy, trach care, 5 lead EGKs etc. Also realize that most of what you learn as a nurse is on the floor not in school. I learned about ABGs and pressors outside of school.

[mursing]

Hey mursing, I am in my 3rd year of nursing and have only done placements on med/surg floors.....PLEASE tell me ER/critical care nursing gets better.

 

Working on these floors, the only thing that's going through my mind is do I really need a 4 year bachelors degree to hand out medications, do bed baths and change diapers? I know if I said that to any nursing prof./nurse they would tear my head off and tell me I don't understand nursing but that is quite literally all I have done....

 

With this in mind the only thing I want to do with my BScN degree now is to get into medicine, but I know how difficult it is to get in so I'm really hoping your going to tell me how awesome ER nursing is......

 

Thanks!

 

You just described nursing perfectly. It doesn't get that much better.

 

The competencies you've posted are at a first or second year level. What school do you go to? By third you should be learning hemovac drains, central lines, iv therapy, trach care, 5 lead EGKs etc. Also realize that most of what you learn as a nurse is on the floor not in school. I learned about ABGs and pressors outside of school.

 

You make it sound like these things are complicated.

You can master central lines and trach care in a few days.

 

Hemovac drains? All you do is empty the blood content and measure the amount... just like how you would measure the urine amount.

Nothing complicated about this. It's not like you insert/pull out hemovac drains as a nurse. It's the physicians who do this.

 

5 lead EGKs? All you do is place them on the right places of the body (takes a few minutes to learn at max).

If you are working in a cardiology floor, you are pretty much required to take continuing education courses related to cardiology (this is where you will learn about interpreting ECG/EKG readings).

 

IV therapy? Don't make it sound so complicated.

Giving IV fluid, med, lipid, TPN, blood.

Don't need to be a brain surgeon to learn this. I learned all of this at my job... pretty fast.