Any Horror Stories?

[loodogg]

We always hear how difficult it is for IMGs to match for a residency position, return to Canada, find work; how they've spent 300,000$ for a piece of paper, etc.....Yet, I'm having a hard time actually finding posts anywhere on the internet of someone's experience who went abroad and ended up with absolutely no job in the long run, and was in 300,000$ debt like many people on these forums like to say will happen to all who choose to study abroad. All I'm finding are stories of people who have matched for a residency in Canada/US. Does anyone actually know of anyone who has went abroad and never match for residency?

[Arztin]

I don't know any Canadian in that situation.

 

However, last year, in my graduate level classes, there were a few recent immigrants who were medical doctors in their home country (real specialists), who never got a spot here unfortunately.

Now, they're doing some sort of masters, and hopefully they can find a job.

 

As for Canadians going abroad, well you don't typically hear about them. The Carribean schools will never talk about this. They are for profit schools. The people who go through that, without a spot now, are too ashamed too, to talk about it I guess. Also, you will find more posts on this issue on SDN than pm101.

[MD2015]

I expect the people to whom you are referring don't come on this forum. I personally know physicians from other countries who immigrated to Canada and are now massage therapists or the like to support their families.

[duoduoa]

just met a guy who came back from Ireland, was competing two residency spots with thirty other IMGs. he was also in the process of writing USLME and another Canadian board exams, and was also taking a training class at that time. Best luck to him but yeah he was stressed.

[duoduoa]

but i agree with OP, if the 50-60% match rate is real, then everybody should go for Ireland because you go straight to med school after high school.

[duoduoa]

well i don't know about other IMGs but I know many Chinese doctors who came here and became postdoc-for-life.

[NLengr]

I know a person who went down South and never matched to either the US or Canada. She was never able to secure a spot.

 

I know someone else who needed 4 years post MD to secure a residency spot, and then only got one because of family connections I'm pretty sure. That person never would have been offered a spot if their academic doctor parents both didn't lean on the school they were at very very hard. So I'd count that person too if you don't have those kind of connections.

 

Likely, most people who don't match aren't writing blogs about it or are very eager to tell their stories.

[Edict]

but i agree with OP, if the 50-60% match rate is real, then everybody should go for Ireland because you go straight to med school after high school.

 

Its not going to stay like that for long. 

[Robin Hood]

It's becoming harder and harder.

When leviathan went to Saba, it had an excellent match rate, comparable to Canadian schools, so it worked for him and he matched IM. But you don't know how it will be after four years. What if Canada decides to abolish all IMG residency spots?

[Edict]

It's becoming harder and harder.

When leviathan went to Saba, it had an excellent match rate, comparable to Canadian schools, so it worked for him and he matched IM. But you don't know how it will be after four years. What if Canada decides to abolish all IMG residency spots?

 

That is very unlikely, mostly because there would be plenty of outrage from true IMGs as well as CSAs. I've spoken to a higher up senior academic physician involved in the exam processes. Most likely the number of spots won't change for the next few years. However, the number of CSAs has really jumped you can look at the match reports the numbers have gone up dramatically so competition is getting higher and higher each year. It really is not recommended going abroad if you have plans to return to Canada. 

[leviathan]

I've met many people who didn't match the first time around and were lucky to match the year after. I've also read online about people teaching at health care institutions (usually nursing and LPNs etc) who have MDs but never secured a residency, so they are teaching instead for who knows what kind of salary.

 

As discussed in many other threads - the odds of matching are still pretty good, but maybe not good enough based on how much money you are putting on the line.

 

And of course many people don't even make it to the point of applying to the match, dropping out far sooner. That said, those people didn't have to spend the full amount of money either.

[Mashmetoo]

Well, horror stories shouldn't be hard to find, I know of a few.

 

1) Guy went to international med school in 2004, it's now 2014, and he still hasn't matched yet (although he did become a millionaire if that is a consolation). Failed step 1 first time, then scored a 273 on the second try, but no go.

 

2) Guy goes to SGU in 2008, now its 2014, still hasn't matched, moved back to Toronto. Started a popular fashion blog.

 

3). Guy goes to SGU in same class as guy 2), failed step 2 CS, applied two application cycles for IM in the US - didn't match both time. Now studying for NAC OSCE to try for FM in Canada.

 

4) Guy goes to Australia, decided it was the "worst decision he's ever made", switched over to a Caribbean school, now taking the USMLEs, and starting rotations in the good old US.

 

http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/sites/pa/prospective-students/international-applicants/medical-graduates.html --> this here is a program that accept IMGs and ask for more tuition and time to become a PA (physician assistant).... There are PA programs specifically for IMGs also popping up in Canada... so.. there are probably lots of failed stories.

[thsc]

Well, horror stories shouldn't be hard to find, I know of a few.

 

1) Guy went to international med school in 2004, it's now 2014, and he still hasn't matched yet (although he did become a millionaire if that is a consolation). Failed step 1 first time, then scored a 273 on the second try, but no go.

 

2) Guy goes to SGU in 2008, now its 2014, still hasn't matched, moved back to Toronto. Started a popular fashion blog.

 

3). Guy goes to SGU in same class as guy 2), failed step 2 CS, applied two application cycles for IM in the US - didn't match both time. Now studying for NAC OSCE to try for FM in Canada.

 

4) Guy goes to Australia, decided it was the "worst decision he's ever made", switched over to a Caribbean school, now taking the USMLEs, and starting rotations in the good old US.

 

http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/sites/pa/prospective-students/international-applicants/medical-graduates.html --> this here is a program that accept IMGs and ask for more tuition and time to become a PA (physician assistant).... There are PA programs specifically for IMGs also popping up in Canada... so.. there are probably lots of failed stories.

Lol, how did # 1 become a millionaire?

[Mashmetoo]

Lol, how did # 1 become a millionaire?

He saw a demand during med school, and he became the supplier. Nothing illegal Actually a brilliant story of entrepreneurship.

[cookiemonster99]

He saw a demand during med school, and he became the supplier. Nothing illegal Actually a brilliant story of entrepreneurship.

mind expanding?

I'm always curious at to what entrepreneurs are doing these days to make money 

[Mashmetoo]

Lunch meal in London England around campus - 9 pounds. Supplies, food, etc cost for a home cooked meal - 3 pounds. Selling a box of gourmet home cooked meal on campus - 6 pounds. 6 - 3 = 3 pounds of profit!

Now think BIGGER.

[rogerroger]

I know of a person who went overseas. Couldn't match x 3 years. Currently working in a lab as a research lab tech overseas and trying to get a residency position in Canada or the USA. Apparently they are pretty much applying for anything they can get at this point...

 

I feel for these folks. They are definitely quietly out there. However, I know of more success stories than failures for those who went the IMG route between 2006-2010.

[rmorelan]

I know quite a number of people with really bad outcomes going this route or extremely extended paths into a residency program. It isn't easy at all, and the risks are very real.

[makingfetchhappen]

I only know people who have been successful going international, but that's obviously 100% anecdotal. I wonder what the difference is between the people who succeed and those who do not? I know a number of successful Saba grads, and one who went to Ireland (which I understand to be even more risky).

When it comes to other second-entry programs such as teaching, law, MBA, etc, my opinion is that if you cannot make it into the program in Canada, you are not cut out for it. Medicine is trickier. There are way more qualified people applying than there are spots. The question is, how do you know that you will be one of the successful ones if you go abroad? I would love to know the answer.

I know people whose parents have taken out a mortgage on their homes to pay for an international medical education. They ended up matching right out of school (in the U.S. and actually one in Canada). I'm glad it worked out for them, but it's a huge risk. How did they know they would make it? Does anyone have any insight?

I think that it's worth a shot if you get money from a bank. Leveraging your family's money/home is another story.

[lost__in__space]

I know a few Canadians who went to the Caribbean and ended up not matching here. They all went to lesser known schools though, not the big 4. I've also met some lab techs at the hospitals I work at in the same situation. Always applying for residency and never getting a match. So sad to see all that time/effort/money wasted

[Edict]

I only know people who have been successful going international, but that's obviously 100% anecdotal. I wonder what the difference is between the people who succeed and those who do not? I know a number of successful Saba grads, and one who went to Ireland (which I understand to be even more risky).

 

When it comes to other second-entry programs such as teaching, law, MBA, etc, my opinion is that if you cannot make it into the program in Canada, you are not cut out for it. Medicine is trickier. There are way more qualified people applying than there are spots. The question is, how do you know that you will be one of the successful ones if you go abroad? I would love to know the answer.

 

I know people whose parents have taken out a mortgage on their homes to pay for an international medical education. They ended up matching right out of school (in the U.S. and actually one in Canada). I'm glad it worked out for them, but it's a huge risk. How did they know they would make it? Does anyone have any insight?

 

I think that it's worth a shot if you get money from a bank. Leveraging your family's money/home is another story.

 

Maybe the prospect of debt and their lives falling apart was motivation for them.