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Second thoughts...


Guest gwendolenharleth

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Guest gwendolenharleth

After several years of applications and returning to school to pick up the required courses (I'm from a Humanities background) in order to follow through on this med school dream, I'm now in an excellent position to get an offer of admission -- and when I do, I'm thinking of rejecting it. Is there anyone else whose pro and con list is heavy on the cons? I feel baffled and let down that I've gone through the application process (several times) with due dedication, only to discover at the 11th hour that medicine may not be worth the fuss. How does one know if this is a case of cold feet or changed priorities? I've always been very pragmatic about this decision: I'm in it for the intellectual challenge, the good (read decent) pay, the flexibility, the portability of the career across countries, the independence (no boss) and the job security. While I like science, I don't have a passion for it and as for helping people, it's not high on my list of motivating factors. Should I run now while I still have the chance?

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Guest quebecboy

Hello Gwendolenharleth,

 

I believe that the choice to make a run for it or staying is a personal one, however you seem to be more in touch with the side of "wealth" and possibly even the "prestige" that comes with being a doc instead of the most important one, which is to be able to help people (it's the basis of medicine). Although you certainly would not be the first person to do an MD for the money, you should reconsider your choice for a career, because doing a lifetime of work in something that you have absolutely no passion for is very long, aside the fact that their are many more lucrative jobs that you could like. Also, the fact that helping people is not high on your motivational list leaves me highly sceptic as to your possiblities of becoming a decent MD.

 

Quebecboy

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This sounds sappy.. but I think someone who's life dream it is to become a doctor deserves to be in medical school, and if you're just wandering into it without the drive, you're stealing someone else of their dream. So just keep that in mind and make your decision.

 

Keepin it pimped out:hat

:D 0T6 :D

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Guest Ian Wong

You know something, I think deep down a lot of people have cold feet regarding starting med school. It may not be apparentat a superficial level, but deep down, medicine is a committment like anything else, and it WILL take a lot of energy and discipline out of you (I'm sure any of the second or third year students particularly on this board can attest to that).

 

With that said, it's perfectly natural to have cold feet. When I was accepted out of third year undergrad, I thought long and hard about turning down the acceptance to take an additional year to finish out my undergrad degree, not so much because I thought getting a BSc would be a great thing, but because of the extra time off. Looking back on things now, I think I made the correct decision to enter med school when I did.

 

The other thing is that an MD is an extremely portable degree. We all joke at various times when clinical medicine gets us down (ie. when you repeatedly get paged away at 4 am in third year) that we are going to get that JD or MBA along with the MD degree, and go to work doing medicolegal law, hospital admin (why wake up for the hospital when you could run it instead?). Still, of all 120 graduates in our class, each and every one of us has plans to complete a residency which will give us that ability to see patients and work, even if not on a full-time basis.

 

I think the desire to help people is a very good reason to go into medicine, but another I think has to be an innate interest in learning about medicine. In all four years of medicine, you will be "fed" a large amount of information, but it is your own responsibility to get it all organized into your active working consciousness. After residency, you'll continue to need that goal of life-long learning to be the most effective doc you can be; medicine is constantly evolving and updating itself. Best of luck on your decision!

 

Ian

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Guest j282

I find it strange, given your list of objectives from a career (wealth, stability, portability) that you spent so much time applying and re-applying, going back to school to get prereq's etc. There are several other careers that are just as stable, prestigious, lucrative with much less effort.

 

All the time you wasted trying to get into medicine could have been spent earning money, I guess that's water under the bridge. I don't think you should go to medschool. I think you really have to be in it for the reasons or the road that lies ahead of you (med school, resideny) would be just much too stressful and painful to endure.

 

BTW How old are you? How many years have you been at this trying to get into medschool? Did you interview this year?

 

Anyways good luck to you :)

 

J

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Guest peachy

If you're waiting for Friday (or Monday, or ...)'s letter, then don't worry about making a decision until you get the letter! I know before I got my letter I had completely convinced myself that grad school was what I wanted to do ... and I think now that it was just so that I wouldn't be upset if I got a rejection. When I actually had that letter in my hand, I felt a LOT different than I thought I would!

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Guest wassabi101

Ya, I have to agree with peachy and ian--just wait to hear from the med schools first and follow your gut intuition....

 

I myself am often thinking how I feel as if I've worked so hard to get in and yet other days, wonder if I'll really enjoy it as much as I enjoy what I'm doing now...

 

but then I do know that to a certain extent, it is my defense mechanism, not only because I'm so frightened for friday's decision and what will become of me if I don't get in, but also because I'm very comfortable in the field I am in now (job security, salary, experience) and it's frightening to feel that I'd have to start all over from scratch :o

 

and the circular question and reasoning starts all over again....

 

I think you're determination and the fact that you're being so honest to ask this question on this forum must mean something-

 

good luck :)

 

-wassabi

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Guest MayFlower1

gwendolenharleth,

 

 

I'm going to take a slightly different perspective on this...as usual...

 

First of all, I sense a fair bit of frustration with respect to the application process...if this is true...I definitely hear you. While this is only my second time applying...it still gets me down sometimes...it's long...it's ambiguous...it's competitive as heck...and sometimes it just seems quite unfair. However, it is a reality...one that we must face...perhaps many times...if this is truly our dream. On the other hand, if it is too much...or if one applies too many times without success...the possibility that it isn't the right path for us must at some point be entertained.

 

That being said...

 

I feel baffled and let down that I've gone through the application process (several times) with due dedication, only to discover at the 11th hour that medicine may not be worth the fuss.

 

I think this is a very personal issue. Medicine isn't all that glorius in and of itself...what makes it glorious is when it energizes you...when you believe you would wake up every morning looking forward to going to work...when, studying, keeping up to date...doing long hours...doesn't seem like work at all...but rather...it seems like a gift that you are priveledged to work in a field/career that brings you so much joy and intrinsic satisfaction. I've had some awful careers/jobs...and I can tell you...regardless of the money...and it was good...I detested it...was depressed...and could barely drag myself out of bed to go into work...not much fun at all. Above all else, your chosen career should excite and exhilirate you.

 

I've always been very pragmatic about this decision: I'm in it for the intellectual challenge, the good (read decent) pay, the flexibility, the portability of the career across countries, the independence (no boss) and the job security.

 

Don't get me wrong here...these are great reasons to be attracted to medicine...especially the intellectual challenge...but, realistically, there ARE other jobs you can get this from. What concerns me is that helping people isn't on your list...or...at best...is last or appears as mere mention. My wife is a practicing physician...and believe me...helping people and society is tops on her list...and during times of stress...wicked call...etc., etc., she has had several episodes of barely being able to deal with another sick patient...or anybody, for that matter, pulling for a bit of her time. The love of people, helping people and sacrificing your own time, etc., for people and their well-being is really central to happiness in medicine...if you aren't absolutely in love with this aspect of medicine...and you plan on seeing patients...things might get rough...unpleasant...or just plain ugly. Let's face it, most people don't come to a physician when they're in good health and happy...they come with problems...physicial, social, psychosocial...and the central role of the physician is to prevent things from getting worse...ideally help them through it by healing them...and help educate them so they can avoid it (if possible) in the future through better choices, etc...it's always about people...

 

Should I run now while I still have the chance?

 

Nobody can tell you whether you should "run" or stick with it...this, I'm afraid, is one of those decisions you have to make on your own. The only advice I can lend is to really focus on what makes you happy...look objectively at what you're likely to get out of medicine...see if those things align or not...and make your decision. I would have to agree wtih one of the previous posters though...if you don't think you're going to enjoy medicine...please do applicants a favour and withdraw so that someone who is truly motivated and driven by a career in medicine will have a chance. I have a neighbour who has their licence to practice medicine...they told me they knew....almost as soon as they were accepted...that they didn't like medicine...but that they didn't know what else to do...they have since chosen not to practice...what a waste...

 

Peter

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Guest j282

Mayflower:

 

Beautifully said :)

 

I just wanted to comment, I love the way you articulate things, a real gift of scribe that your blessed with indeed ;)

 

Just curious what is your neighbor doing, now that they're not practicing medicine?

 

Take care

J

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Guest bcdentalgirl

Asking the hard questions about your chosen career path shows maturity and intellect. You obvously take the decison very seriously. I admire that. If you can be honest with yourself, and resolve these issues, I think you are just as deserving of a spot as anyone.

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Guest scalar

Hi gwendolenharleth:

 

To some degree I'm in your shoes.

I'm also awaiting my admission results from Western, UofT and Mac. While I don't have "the feeling" that I will surely get in, I can understand your thought process

 

You see gwendolenharleth, I'm not so wet behind the ears, I'm 35, I've had a great career but since my first rejection 12 year ago, I have always been persistenst. Persistent with myself and what I truly desired from myself and my future and my career. It seems that my rejections over the years have become as sure as the change in seasons. More than anything I can say with confidence that want to be a doctor, I watched my Mom die to cancer, then my Dad to a heart attack. I've spent a great deal of time in hospitals and I've seen what the job entails. It is at its essence a profession that takes everything out of you, only to fill you with hope the very next day. It's a job that reminds me of what I've been through to get to this position, two undergrad degrees, two masters degrees and 12 years of giving myself to the community, to hosipitals, to fundraising and to international relief. My only hope is that on this my 13th attempt, the interviewers see my drive, desire and dedication to this profession.

 

While, I may be an extreme case, I think you should truly ask yourself what you hope to get out of this profession and how much is within you to dedicate to medicine both during schooling and afterwards during practice. The variables you mentioned could easily be attained as a University Prof, Pharmacist, Lawyer, Physiotherapist, Dentist, Engineer etc.

 

I would be interested in knowing what career path you currently are engaged in and what path you wish to follow should you turn down your acceptance?

 

I wish you luck, you have alot thinking to do. If I could offer a small piece of advice, I would say that; "It are those that are most happiest that realize where their true passion and desire lie and if it not the current path, they are brave enough to step aside and find it so that others may have a chance at finding their own"

 

Perhaps we will meet this September. If not I will commence my 14th application, that is something you can bet on!

 

Good Luck my friend

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I agree with previous posters. I was so sure that I did not get in that I had all these other plans set up (plan B,C,D...). So when I got in I was extremely excited yet at the back of my mind for like a month I was thinking plan B sounded good, so did plan C. I wondered about what would happen if I chose plan B instead. Feeling cold feet? I think is normal. But soul searching is good, if you truly think that meds is no longer for you then don't chose it. It is lots of studying to do... lots (and I am only in first year)

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Guest banana

I was just wondering if perhaps when you said that you are not so interested in helping people, you really meant that you were not interested in working directly with patients? I know that some people might really enjoy the practice of medicine, but not the many joys and pains that come with looking after the sick.

 

I don't know if this is how you feel, but if it is, please consider that there are specialties in medicine that can give you the academic challenge of medicine without so much of the emotional stress and heartache (and, of course, wonderful fulfullment). You might also want to consider clinical medicine and research if the academic challenge is what you love.

 

I think that a lot of us dream about medicine for so long that it can be easy to question 'why' in this stressful and tiresome process. If you decide not to pursue medicine, I would just suggest that you make sure you won't regret it later.

 

And if you're still unsure, you can maybe defer your acceptance or wait and reapply when your ready.

 

hope that helps.

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Guest scalar

Of the 13 times this time the 13th time was the first time I was granted an interview. I finally gave in and completed a second undergrad degree recently while working full-time. Despite having done two masters since my first undergrad (tons of pubs and awesome grad marks and pretty decent undergrad marks) it was this second undergrad that opened up the doors for Western, UofT and as luck would have it I was granted an interview at Mac this year, the first in 13 attempts :)

 

Now that they've met me we'll see what happens, I'll keep you posted :)

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Guest MayFlower1

j282,

 

Thanks so much for the kind words.

 

My neighbour, has decided to stay home with her children.

 

Peter

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Guest baystreet

may be veering off topic but I was actually watching the show "American Gladiators" today and one of the female contestants was this woman who got her MD from Yale and then decided medicine wasn't for her. She said something about not working in a "stuffy smelly building all day long and... being able to take care of her body". Alas she decided to become a body builder, go figure. Point is you always have a choice. But here we have an interesting connundrum. There's the poster who really seems passionate about the profession, seems to know what it entails and keeps going to extraordinary means to try to achieve that goal for 13 tries and is committed to trying until he/she gets in. Then we have the poster who "is' getting in but doesn't know if they want to and doesn't seem interested in what many consider the cornerstone of medicine (i.e helping people).

 

I would say for the OP it is in her best interest to maybe go through med school and see what its like and then decide if they want to become a doctor or not. I will take a huge leap away from everyone else expecially after reading scalar's post and say if you don't really want to do it DON'T. I know this may be unpopulat, but one of the last things a patient needs is a doctor uninterested in their fundamental well-being, and who is malcontent with their career. I know everyone is saying wait it out but I don't think you should wait too long or else you may end up with huge loan debts you feel the need to payoff by being a practicing doctor.

 

First things first though, and see if you do get in. If you do, take some time to really think about it and ask yourself if this is really what you want to do. You always know the answer so really listen to yourself. Yeah everyone second guesses themself but they are mostly find with the decision they make, but you must choose. Otherwise you will not be doing either yourself, your future patients, or other applicants like scalar any good.

 

Good luck in your decisions and goals.

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Guest NASDAQ

Hey, First time posting, I must say great stuff going on here!!

 

First to comment on the student in the dilema , don't go for selfish reasons. Sure it's your spot you can do as you wish but think of people like scalar, do you really want to take a spot from a person that breathes every breath for med school. If your serious that's another story but give this one some thought. The fact that your in it for the cash does not however make you the exception. In a 1997 poll I read published by the OMA cited 92% of incoming med students surveyed ranked compensation the number one reason for choosing medicine as a career. Helping people ranked 8th after things such as prestige, power, independence, challenge, commumity involvment, interest in medical knowledge etc. Those numbers blew my mind:eek . I'm curious do people ever mention money when asked why become a doctor in the interviews?

 

I guess these same lemmings, moved in lock step into the highest paying residencies remdering them the most competitive from yr. to yr. ENT, Radiology now, Dermatology, Plastic Surgery (this is not part of the poll, just my own guess here)

 

BTW Baystreet, what's your deal? with a name like that are you heading off the street into the white coat this year or in the future?

 

Thanks for letting me post here folks, great forum BTW

 

Market Commentary: Markets will move up today, slighty on the Dow, Nasdaq toss up, but stay away from Talisman Energy for all the traders out there :)

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Guest baystreet

nasdaq: I finished undergrad, had a SWEET high paying job lined up on wall street actually, and a couple of people offering me positions (as broker etc) on bay street and in Montreal. For some damn reason I had to go and grow a conscience where I want to do something that gives back to society and there goes my wonderful signing bonus and my huge paycheque everyone was planning on helping me spend. @#%$ I even gave up this amazing loft I found in SoHo (that was 'cheap' too) to go back to be a lowly undergrad again and take first year science courses with 17 year olds (no offense anyone:D ). So I guess in a way I went through what the OP is currently going through but the difference is I've already given up the income so I know that I'm not in it for the money now. (Although come finals in December during the company's annual trip to a 'warm destination' I may begin to curse myself).

 

What's your deal?, and if you are in the market? what do you think about the options market on livestock right now? I'm day trading this summer hoping to have some luck and recoup some of that lost income.

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Guest NASDAQ

Hey baystreet

 

My deal is I took the deal from undergrad :)

I entered into SSB's trading program NY, through the recruiting program from undergrad. I did my first year on the forex options desk, moved to SSB's Toronto office and did a year of fixed income trading, and for my third year I headed to London for a run at the exotic options desk. Fun times, fun times indeed. after my three years at Salomon it was either go to Business school or work at a boutique, I chose the latter and headed to a firm in Toronto, trading options for the most part. It was a good run, made a @#%$ of money. I was in NY when our total comp (base+bonus) was 250K US in my second year (not including all the doe I made trading on my personal account)

 

I made my money I have a house, I have three cars and a cottage all fully paid, RRSP's well under way and I'm only 26. Now I can head to med school debt free and rent out my house for additional income if I want it.

 

That's interesting that you were recruited for a broker position, those things are hard to come by straight from undergrad. Good for you mate :) Did you do your undergrad at Ivey, Queens, McGill, Rotman or the States?

 

Soho, that's awesome, I couldn't find anything under $2200 and that doesn't even include that damm real estate broker finders fee. I ended up living in midtown pretty close to Penn Station. You know what's crazy, I heard that Harlem is now one of the posh places to live, crazy place that NYC!!!

 

If I could offer some advice, if you still have those offers kicking around, you may want to take it for a year or two. You will be eons ahead of the rest of the medschool class financially and it will allow to focus on the work.

 

The reason, I'm making the switch is to be honest, I'm feeling a little burned out, and I need something less stressful!!!! I also love the science and the human body. A surg speciality would be the ultimate.

 

To answer your question.

 

Livestock options, hmmm depends on which way your going. I would collar it for sure. Collar it with a long put and call both at the same strike, you will be able to participate on the upside while limiting the downside. Rather than options, if your set on commodities, I would short Livestock Futures and then buy back at the lower price in the future (I'm pretty sure the futures price is headed down, Mad Cow anyone).

 

Anyway take care man. Good luck with everything

 

BTW Where are you situated right now?

 

Peace

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Guest grandmellon

if I could be the devil's advocate and ask... are you trying to rationalize not getting into medschool this year? I know that for a lot of us this is what we try to do because we have these great expectations and have told many people that we have applied while waiting for the final verdict. It would be a huge disappointment to have to tell others that you were rejected. By rationalizing (which is good :) ) we can make the rejection letter not so harsh. No offence meant to anyone... :hat

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Guest grandmellon

if I could be the devil's advocate and ask... are you trying to rationalize not getting into medschool this year? I know that for a lot of us this is what we try to do because we have these great expectations and have told many people that we have applied while waiting for the final verdict. It would be a huge disappointment to yourself if you had to tell others that you were rejected. By rationalizing (which is very good) we create a buffer zone that will pad the effects of the big envelope that will come telling us we are accepted... or the small envelope......:hat

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Guest baystreet

holy @#%$! This is downright erie!! It appears that my life is heading in the direction that yours was going even down except at Credit Suisse!!! VERY strange:D . I go to a decent undergrad but I just had a few connections in getting the NY job and the broker positions came from a visiting prof I had (who runs his own succesful investment firm) and his montreal connections (a really intensive tading class that was). I also had an options and futures prof who took a shinning to me and passed my resume around his job which just happens to be the montreal floor.

 

I agree with the burnout and that is what I really want to avoid, in something I don't love. It will be much easier for me to work 90 hours a week at a job I care about than at one where I just make lots of money I can't spend. Granted its not the kind of dough you were pulling in but times have changed but it is substantial coin as I'm sure you're aware.

 

The loft in Soho was one of those things that only locals find. A friend say it while hanging around the area and it was ours. He just went up and spoke to people I guess and they felt sorry for him. He is going to NYU Law and basically the old tenant is an alum and a fellow minority and so this was his thing in giving back to the people. You want to know the best part of it all... it was rent controlled! Seriously though, the Harlem 'revitalization' effort is working very well for some. Some of the properties that have been renovated are amazing.

 

Oh, and I don't really need money. I hate to say it but my parents pay for my education and are willing to. So no debt for me either way.

 

I hear you about livestock futures. I'm not really into commodities but with this mad cow scare I figured I could make a quick buck cause of volatility. I really believe there is nothing to worry about but the price will fall for a while and then climb back up to its resting spot. I'm more of a currency gal myself and that's my focus lately (the Canadian $ had paid for my end of summer and XMas vacation already).

 

I'm in MTL, you? What schools are you looking at?

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Guest NASDAQ

Hey Baystreet:

 

That's pretty insane, our lives are mirroring each other!!!

To top it off you are in Montreal and probably speak French, I am in Toronto and speak Anglais, you are a girl (sorry for calling you man, in the other post, I had no idea a girl could be this cool about Finance stuff :P ) and I am a boy. ITS BIZZZZZZZAAAAAAARO WORLD (from Seinfeld, please tell me you've seen that episode or this whole setup will seem really gay :lol )

 

The schools, I'm looking into, are anywhere that will take me!!!! I'm doing some science courses right now and I'll probably apply next year or the year after. McGill would be cool, get out Toronto, The states may be an option (Harvard MD, I like the sounds of that :) ), UBC perhaps. I guess you can't be too choosy with where you go, just go where you get in I suppose. What about you, where are you thinking of applying? What's your game plan for the next little while?

 

That's awesome that your parents will pick up the tab, BTW do they know how much loot they will have to part with for the medschool part? Are your folks in the Finance world also? With that kind of generosity, I bet Pops is a Managing Director at RBC DS or CIBC World Markets, perhaps a pimp daddy :hat

 

Oh yeah my real name's not Nadaq, Surprise, Suprise it's Craig, so if you run into a Craig during Med school interviews etc. you better say Hi :)

 

Cheers

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Guest baystreet

humm, how do I answer without revealing my true identity. Okay I'll try my best.

 

I am in Montreal but I'm not from here, I'm a Western Canadian girl, but I do speak french a bit. I'm looking into most all schools also but I have a huge preference for Calgary and Saskatchewan. Saskatchewan because it seems like such a small cohesive program that takes personal interest in their students, and Calgary because I love the facilities and I've gone to school there before. I'm open to any other schools though and even US schools.

 

I'm going back to schools for the next two years to take those science courses and get a BSc while I'm at it.

 

My parents are great for picking up the tab. They know how much loot it costs because they are involved in the Canadian med school scene. The are actually in the medical world also not the finance one even though my dad wants to do an MBA now (go figure). I would tell you my real name but then that would be the end of it (not too many people with my name). Humm, I think this should be done on emails or something:lol .

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