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After having been in the program, what are some of the pros/cons that you have experienced and were not necessarily aware of prior to matriculating?

 

For instance, curriculum emphasis or style of delivery, rigidity or flexibility of class & clinical schedules, etc.

 

I guess, as an insider to the U of C med program, what do you like and not like so much about the program?

 

Thanks!

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I remember reading somewhere that all of the students spend some time getting clinical experience in rural areas. Can you explain how this works? Are they clerkship electives? It sounds interesting to me!

I field this one since the baby goats haven't gotten clerkship schedules yet!

 

Basically, when it comes time for clerkship, you rank your site preferences for each of the core rotations.

 

There are rural or regional options for family, psych, ob/GYN and Peds. Lots of people want to stay in the city, so if you're interested in a rural placement, there's a good chance you'll get it.

 

And then you always have the option to do rural electives.

 

The school will help you out with accommodation and travel, as well.

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Interviews are upon us shortly and I know the class of 2018 (us Goats!) are excited to see all of you here on your respective interview dates. If you have any questions about what it's like to study med @ UofC, ideas of where to stay in the city for your interview, or anything else, feel free to ask away!

 

OH ME I HAVE A QUESTION!

 

You going to AMSCAR? If you are (>^.^)> <(^.^<)

 

- G

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I remember reading somewhere that all of the students spend some time getting clinical experience in rural areas. Can you explain how this works? Are they clerkship electives? It sounds interesting to me!

 

To add to amichel's post, there are also many opportunities to shadow in rural regions throughout the year both from formal arrangements through RPAP (Alberta Rural Physician Action Plan) and of your own accord. We are frequently sent out e-mails with pre-arranged dates that have been set aside with a variety of rural practitioners throughout Southern Alberta--Three Hills, Canmore, Banff, Sundre, Crowsnest Pass, Olds, etc. It's a bit of a first-come-first-serve e-mail set-up where you reply with your top 3 choices of places and times (quite flexible--weekends, weekday evenings, mornings, etc.) you would like to shadow and off you go. I've shadowed in Three Hills over a weekend with an amazing doctor and in High River. You're reimbursed for travel expenses and you often get to do procedures like suturing in your first few of months of medical school. There is also the UCLIC program where you do your entire clerkship experience in a rural region, but head into more urban areas for specific blocks like anesthesiology for example. Lots of opportunities for rural exposure and it's quite rewarding.

 

Second question: do you find certain areas suffer from having a 3 year program? (E.g. grasp of anatomy?). I've heard this as a complaint about McMaster.

 

UofC pairs your anatomy learning with the course block you're taking at the time. For example, our first course was GI and hematology. You do your anatomy labs with that systems based approach and with relevant pathology being presented as well. Second course was MSK, so we focus our anatomy learning on the musculoskeletal system and related structures. The cadavers in the UofC lab are also prosected. We don't spend the time dissected the cadavers on our own, which is actually beneficial from the perspective that the specimens we used have been properly dissected. I'm sure many of you have had the experience of anatomy lab where someone has improperly dissected a specimen and as a result you don't get a proper view of an important structure. We are also provided with a lot of open lab time to study the anatomy on our own. However, I do wish I had more time available in the open lab simply because I need more repetition for anatomical learning than many others. In later years at UofC, you are able to take MED440 as an elective which allows you to dissect a cadaver on your own if that is something you're interested in. 

 

Many of my classmates also have a background in anatomy in physiology--physiotherapists, graduate level studies, etc. They were generous with their time and provided useful learning sessions in the lab that expanded upon what we were taught in class, but also clarified many of the important points using cadavers that were covered within our lectures. 

 

 

After having been in the program, what are some of the pros/cons that you have experienced and were not necessarily aware of prior to matriculating?

 

For instance, curriculum emphasis or style of delivery, rigidity or flexibility of class & clinical schedules, etc.

 

I guess, as an insider to the U of C med program, what do you like and not like so much about the program?

 

Thanks!

 

I'm only in my 7th month, so I won't have the experience of clerkship and later courses that my more senior colleagues have, but I'll share from my own personal perspective. Keep in mind that everyone is different. 

 

PROS:

- You can really tailor your learning to what suits you best at UofC. Like many other schools, almost all of our lectures are podcast. I don't personally attend any lectures unless it's radiography or something practical like interpretation of ECGs. I often don't even podcast the lectures. I look at the materials we're given and learn what I need to learn on my own and with my own resources, for the most part. Half way through the first course, it's easier to pick out the high yield content.

- There are lots of small group activities that help to provide a different modality to your learning. We are assigned a small group of 10-12 people that you remain with throughout the first year of studies. You rotate through leading a small group a few times per course--ex: you lead a small group with a partner in the topic of chest discomfort using an outline that is provided to you by UME. In this way, you field questions and help teach the other members of your group in a collaborative way. It's also a great way to synopsize information within a presentation and helps a great deal with studying. 

- You are also assigned to be a part of a "core group" that you are a part of for two years. This group is only 5 or so students. You get into communications, physical exam, and on-the-wards experience very quickly at UofC. In the first couple of weeks you can be on the wards interacting with patients, conducting interviews, and working with your preceptor to discuss diagnoses and treatment plans. You conduct interviews with standardized patients in your communications course where you learn how to systematically interview a patient, construct a differential diagnosis, deal with emotional situations, etc. Very useful.

- The biggest surprise has been my classmates, honestly. Tons of truly amazing people are in my class with a diverse range of interests and backgrounds. You'll have many opportunities to participate in fundraising events, be really active in the mountains with the "Outdoorsy" FB group, there are weekly squash and badminton meet-ups, many academic interest groups, etc. You can also volunteer your time at the student run clinic and develop clinical skills by working with refugees and homeless populations. 

- We receive flex days (3 per academic year), excused absences, and can miss up to 10% of small groups without giving notice per course. This is nice if you need a break of have personal obligations to attend to.

 

CONS: 

- I find that the organization of courses sometimes doesn't work for me. We are sometimes presented with information later in a course that would have been useful much earlier in the course's timeline. However, UME listens to student feedback and adjusts courses for following years and that's very appreciated. I think that scheduling lecturers can also dictate when material is presented.

- I also find that mandatory events like small groups are spaced out throughout the week so that it's difficult to be away from the school for a full day to just focus and study. As a person that doesn't attend lecture, I'd much rather have larger blocks of mandatory time scheduled on a couple of days a week so that I can use the remaining time to study as I see fit. This is obviously a personal preference.

- If you are gunning for a specialty like derm, plastics, etc. that are quite competitive at CaRMS, a 3-year program is difficult to get in research time and other outside work since we don't have summers. This isn't the case for me, but I could see that being challenging for others. Conversely, we're done our undergraduate training faster and I definitely prefer this to spending time in a four year program while having summers off. You need to pace yourself mentally of course because you also get less vacation time (2 weeks in March, 2 in December).

 

Overall, I'm really enjoying my experience at UofC. Lots of early clinical exposure, flexible, and engaging with many opportunities to gain outside knowledge and practical skills.

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Hey!

1) when does the first round of admission offer usually come out? I'm trying to decide the time to take MCAT again if I don't get in.

 

2) for the interview, other than senario question, acting station, pic question, is there anything else like station with group activity or debate, and writing station?

 

3) I know interview doesn't have a break, but what if I really have to go to the washroom? Can I go during the 2 min after I quickly read the question stem?

 

Thanks!

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Hey!

1) when does the first round of admission offer usually come out? I'm trying to decide the time to take MCAT again if I don't get in.

 

2) for the interview, other than senario question, acting station, pic question, is there anything else like station with group activity or debate, and writing station?

 

3) I know interview doesn't have a break, but what if I really have to go to the washroom? Can I go during the 2 min after I quickly read the question stem?

 

Thanks!

First round of acceptances are usually mid May. But the last couple years it has been slightly earlier for a number of reasons. Last year mainly to give people extra time for the new MCAT. I would suspect earliest is end of April.

 

Second, note that it seems that the stations may have changed even more this year based on Dr Walker's post. Also, there's a confidentiality agreement that prevent anyone from discussing these.

 

Third, as you'll hear on interview day: the MMI stops for no one and for nothing. They will give you ample time to have a washroom break beforehand but you really can not stop during. Dr walker even told us a story of a candidate who's pants ripped and the med students helped duct tape them for him while he was interviewing.

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Hey!

1) when does the first round of admission offer usually come out? I'm trying to decide the time to take MCAT again if I don't get in.

 

2) for the interview, other than senario question, acting station, pic question, is there anything else like station with group activity or debate, and writing station?

 

3) I know interview doesn't have a break, but what if I really have to go to the washroom? Can I go during the 2 min after I quickly read the question stem?

 

Thanks!

 

bearpuppy makes good points. I'm happy to answer as well.

 

1) I received my acceptance e-mail last year on April 20th at 11:30 MST <3. As bearpuppy mentioned before me, I got the sense that the admissions team really went above and beyond to accommodate the new MCAT for those candidates that didn't receive the best news on the day. I don't know what the date of offers will be this year. An additional point is that rolling admissions begin for waitlisted candidates 2-4 weeks after initial offers are released.

 

2) I'm not permitted to disclose the details of the specific MMI stations I experienced last year. All I can say is that the experience I had was very reflective of what Dr. Walker has stated in his interview podcasts. They're definitely worth a listen. The podcast can be found here, http://www.ucalgary.ca/mdprogram/prospective-students/mmi-information. You don't need to have any specific or detailed background knowledge of any subject area to do well in the interview. A sense of current event topics and your own life experiences + how you deal with the pressure of interview day are the biggest factors that affect your performance, in my opinion. Us goaties will do our best to calm you down and get to know you before you walk through those doors. If there's anything we can do, please let us know. Once you're one or two stations along in the process, you'll probably hit your stride and time will fly. Last year, I stood up and quickly shook the interviewer's hand, said thank you and turned around to get out of the door for the next station only to realize that applause had erupted because our interview had concluded and I didn't even realize it. 

 

3) If you have some sort of bathroom situation where you absolutely must leave the interview, obviously leave and go to the bathroom. Just know that the interview process will not stop in your absence simply for logistical reasons, to maintain a standardized experience between interview dates, and time constraints. I believe two stations are dropped from your 12 in giving you an MMI score, but I'm not sure of the protocol of getting back into the interview once you've left (perhaps someone can provide an answer here). I would think that your interview wouldn't be concluded--that seems terrible--but you may have to eat the lost station score and hope for the best with the other stations you completed.

 

If there's anything people would like to be elaborated upon in my previous posts, let me know. Keep'm coming.  :lol:

 

**edited re: nick's point below. Will confirm about dropping station scores and adjust accordingly. 

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3) If you have some sort of bathroom situation where you absolutely must leave the interview, obviously leave and go to the bathroom. Just know that the interview process will not stop in your absence simply for logistical reasons, to maintain a standardized experience between interview dates, and time constraints. I believe two stations are dropped from your 12 in giving you an MMI score, but I'm not sure of the protocol of getting back into the interview once you've left (perhaps someone can provide an answer here). I would think that your interview wouldn't be concluded--that seems terrible--but you may have to eat the lost station score and hope for the best with the other stations you completed.

 

 

Thank you. Awesome, detailed reply, but how sure are you about the "drop the worst two stations" policy? I thought DIW (Dr Ian Walker) said in the podcast that they don't drop any stations ... of course it is from 2014, so they may well have changed things :)

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Thank you. Awesome, detailed reply, but how sure are you about the "drop the worst two stations" policy? I thought DIW (Dr Ian Walker) said in the podcast that they don't drop any stations ... of course it is from 2014, so they may well have changed things :)

 

Hmmm. You may well be right. For some reason this isn't what I remember, but I may be incorrect. I'll edit my post until I can confirm one way or the other. Thanks for calling that out, nick.

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1) What is a typical day like as a U of C med student?

ex. What times do classes normally run, how much time do you have available to study on a typical day, labs, working out, etc.?

 

2) In terms of workload or school/social balance, how would you say your experience at U of C med compares to undergrad?

 

3) How often are assessments and what format are they provided in?

 

4) I assume U of C is pass/fail, is this correct?

 

5) What is the sense of community like at U of C?

 

6) How are you finding your ability & classmates' ability to manage the stress of a 3 yr program with minimal breaks?

 

7) Do you feel that you have an appropriate amount of support and opportunities to identify what kind of speciality you may be interested in?

 

8) If I remember correctly, U of C has some clinical electives prior to your clerkship. Do you feel this puts you at a disadvantage when it comes to your residency application and your competitiveness as a candidate, or do you feel that there are ways in which this effect is attenuated through other early forms of clinical exposure while at U of C?

 

 

Sorry for all of the questions! If you happen to have the time to even answer a few that would be awesome. Thanks!   :)

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1) What is a typical day like as a U of C med student?

ex. What times do classes normally run, how much time do you have available to study on a typical day, labs, working out, etc.?

 

2) In terms of workload or school/social balance, how would you say your experience at U of C med compares to undergrad?

 

3) How often are assessments and what format are they provided in?

 

4) I assume U of C is pass/fail, is this correct?

 

5) What is the sense of community like at U of C?

 

6) How are you finding your ability & classmates' ability to manage the stress of a 3 yr program with minimal breaks?

 

7) Do you feel that you have an appropriate amount of support and opportunities to identify what kind of speciality you may be interested in?

 

8) If I remember correctly, U of C has some clinical electives prior to your clerkship. Do you feel this puts you at a disadvantage when it comes to your residency application and yoru competitiveness as a candidate, or do you feel that there are ways in which this effect is attenuated through other early forms of clinical exposure while at U of C?

 

 

Sorry for all of the questions! If you happen to have the time to even answer a few that would be awesome. Thanks!   :)

 

1) Our days are typically 8:30-5:30, but we often have times that are flexed. Ie: we might have a day that goes 10:30-5:30 or another that goes 8:30-12:30. Typically, it is 8:30-5:30 with a one hour lunch. The day is often a mix between lectures, physical exam groups, conducting interviews in communications, anatomy labs, etc. It's less frequently a day of 8 hours of lectures and is much more often a mix of different learning modalities (as I mentioned in my previous post). That said, the lectures are usually not mandatory. I personally do not attend lecture unless it is something like x-ray interpretation. Instead, I study at home or in the library and just attend mandatory sessions. So this frees up a lot of time to take care of business, so to speak. I have also met classmates to run to the gym at lunch, workout, and run back. I hit the gym 3-4 times a week, ski, participate in interest groups at the schools, hang out with friends, go cycling, visit family on weekends, etc. It's quite manageable to maintain a healthy balance, but it does require some effort and good organizational skills.

 

2) I feel like I answered this question in (1) and in (6). Let me know if you'd like me to elaborate further.

 

3) Assessments differ somewhat between our course blocks. For example, our first course (Heme&GI) consisted of a multiple choice midterm and cumulative multiple choice final exam. We also had a midterm and final exam in anatomy/pathology in the format of a bell-ringer in the cadaver lab. In addition to the actual exams, we are given "formative" exams that don't count as marks. These exams are provided to us as a way for us to gauge how we're feeling about our knowledge prior to the actual exam, but also to give us a sense of the style and format of the questions on the actual exam. In course 2 (derm/ortho/rheum) we had group and individual quizzes throughout the semester, a summative multiple choice final exam, and anatomy lab bell-ringers similar to course one. In our pop health class, we had a summative multiple choice exam at the end of the term and one large group project in the second term. The exams are not easy, but I would also call them pretty fair. Outside of a traditional style of exam, we have OSCEs (objective structured clinical exam) which are actually somewhat similar to an MMI. You walk up to a door, are presented with a situation or physical exam task for a couple of minutes, you walk in the door and begin.

 

4) Correct

 

5) It's actually really great. There are tons of social events that are planned throughout the term--both formally through the school/committees, but also through casual drop-in sports clubs, FB groups, and similar. We have a squash club, a badminton club, multiple volleyball intramural teams, basketball teams, beach volleyball, etc. Our outdoorsy group gets together to hike, run, ski throughout the year. There is a class ski trip and the Icebowl--a multi-medical school hockey tournament that occurs yearly [this year it was in Saskatchewan]. Outside of the extra-curricular events that happen very frequently, UofC med also has a strong sense of community in the academic sense. When you become a UofC med student, you become part of the animal family or menagerie. The naming ceremony where you get your class's animal name is a pretty huge deal (super secrets!) and is put on by the previous 1st year's class. We are the Goats, the second year's are the Humuhumunukunukuapua'as (yes, really), third years are the Narwhals, etc. When you run into doctors when shadowing, you're often asked what animal you are. We also have a naming ceremony where everyone in the class is given a nickname. The event is super fun and the nickname you are given goes on the back of a class jersey that you and your classmates design--complete with a class animal logo, arm patches, etc. We have the med olympics, and tons of events during orientation week, and we have second year and faculty mentors that really take the time to help you throughout your training. Tons of academic and social clubs, learning nights, skills training and leaderships seminars, and each year UofC and UofA come together at AMSCAR (which happened this past weekend in Banff) for a wellness retreat. I could go on, but I think you get the picture.

 

6) It ebbs and flows. I think this is really an individual thing. People have different ways of dealing with the stress. Overall, I find it very manageable. This relates back to your first two questions. It's quite easy to get bogged down and study every hour of every day. The volume of information thrown at you in med is definitely much higher and at a much faster speed than what comes at you in undergrad. You have to really make the time to do things that are good for you, but I find making the time to be quite reasonably easy to achieve (with the exception of during exam weeks, maybe). There are people in my class with kids and large families and they seem to be doing quite well. It's important to maintain some semblance of balance so you don't burn out and that comes down to how you effectively manage your time. Outside of the schoolwork, many of us still take on shadowing opportunities, take on committee and executive work, volunteer in the student run clinic, maintain a physically active lifestyle, etc. That said, I do know some people that struggle with the workload and with balance. 

 

7) There are many opportunities for you to arrange shadowing. There are also skills training nights, journal nights, and interest groups for each of the specialties that put on pretty awesome evenings for learning. You also get hands-on clinical exposure in your core group training throughout the year specific to the course content you're working through at the time. Overall, I would say that you have many opportunities, but you also have to seek out those opportunities yourself.

 

8) I'll respond to this when I have a bit more time, but perhaps amichel or other classmates can help me out here as well.

 

Don't apologize. Your questions are thoughtful!

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1) What is a typical day like as a U of C med student?

ex. What times do classes normally run, how much time do you have available to study on a typical day, labs, working out, etc.?

 

2) In terms of workload or school/social balance, how would you say your experience at U of C med compares to undergrad?

 

3) How often are assessments and what format are they provided in?

 

4) I assume U of C is pass/fail, is this correct?

 

5) What is the sense of community like at U of C?

 

6) How are you finding your ability & classmates' ability to manage the stress of a 3 yr program with minimal breaks?

 

7) Do you feel that you have an appropriate amount of support and opportunities to identify what kind of speciality you may be interested in?

 

8) If I remember correctly, U of C has some clinical electives prior to your clerkship. Do you feel this puts you at a disadvantage when it comes to your residency application and yoru competitiveness as a candidate, or do you feel that there are ways in which this effect is attenuated through other early forms of clinical exposure while at U of C?

 

 

Sorry for all of the questions! If you happen to have the time to even answer a few that would be awesome. Thanks! :)

Sure, I can tackle number 8. My thoughts will probably not be as neatly organized though.

 

Most of your clerkship electives (8/12 weeks) will be before your core rotations.

 

Is it a disadvantage? Potentially, but the match stats and anecdotal word of mouth seem to indicate that we do at least as well as the 4 year schools (on average).

 

Now - as for what negates the potential disadvantage. I have a few thoughts.

 

1) We really do get lots of practical clinical teaching at an early stage. I personally think communications and physical exam is integrated into preclerkship a bit better than at some other schools.

 

2) Then there's clinical core, and shadowing (which, as a side note, I've never done and I've received excellent clinical evals so far. Not to say it's not valuable, but it's not for everyone) and summer electives between year 1 and 2. I think it's enough to get your feet wet enough that you won't fall completely on your face during clerkship electives.

 

3) One of the narwhals pointed this out to me the other day, and I'd never thought of it that way before: you'll be so keen still for your clerkship electives. 4th years will already be exhausted by all of 3rd year.

 

4) Continuing on that note, I've mostly heard that elective evaluations are more based on your teamwork, personality, work ethic, etc, than your medical knowledge.

 

5) (most) preceptors understand how Calgary and Mac work and will evaluate you accordingly.

 

Let me know if you have more questions!!

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I'll share a Narwhal (2016) perspective for people wondering about electives/carms, etc:

 

If you want FM, internal, or something equally as broad/non competitive then 3 years vs 4 is amazing. I have been FM all the way and had zero stress planning electives and getting to check out all the programs that interested me. My pre-clerkship electives were in Samoa :)

 

The more competitive your specialty, or (especially) the more undecided you are, the greater the challenge posed by the 3 year program. 

 

People end up doing fine in the match year after year, but I think those who have it the worst are the ones who really didn't know what they wanted to do, and by the time they figured it out were basically out of elective time.

If you forsee needing a LOT of time to decide on a specialty, then you will be at a disadvantage. If you're a real gunner expect to be working your tail off, however I think this is the case across the country.

 

Personally, I wouldn't change a thing about my U of C experience. I'd been working for a few years before med school and found the pace similar to that of a fairly demanding job, with periods of added workload for exams etc. Clerkship can be rough but experiences vary. 

Also, I did a rural clerkship and would recommend that to anyone, it's been amazing.

 

Good luck with interviews future animals!

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 Clerkship can be rough but experiences vary. 

 

 

Can you expand upon this a bit? I am a mature applicant and I realize that being in school means I'm a student, but I also consider myself a professional and I've heard horror stories of med students being treated quite poorly during their clerkships. Does it really just come down to the team you are working with?

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I have been FM all the way and had zero stress planning electives and getting to check out all the programs that interested me. My pre-clerkship electives were in Samoa :)

 

Also, I did a rural clerkship and would recommend that to anyone, it's been amazing.

 

As someone who is also interested in FM and rural medicine, it would be awesome if you could share your rural clerkship experience.

 

Hope it's not too much to ask, thank you!  :D

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Can you expand upon this a bit? I am a mature applicant and I realize that being in school means I'm a student, but I also consider myself a professional and I've heard horror stories of med students being treated quite poorly during their clerkships. Does it really just come down to the team you are working with?

 

Definitely team dependent. I've been treated really well so far by everyone I've worked with, including nursing staff and other learners. However, I know not everyone is as lucky. There are many times where you just have to shut your mouth and get on with it, but that's life as a junior no matter where you are. If you've worked before you'll get it. Being on time and having a decent attitude will get you most of the way there.

 

I guess I also meant that clerkship moves at a pretty fast pace, and when life gets complicated (as it always does) and you're on a particularly tough rotation it can feel like "the system" doesn't give a damn. Luckily, colleagues who did need to take a week off and take a breather were accommodated, but you have to defer the exam and make up the time in the spring, so that's not always ideal. I think applying to residencies gives the whole year this feeling of time crunch which causes a lot of extra stress. 

 

 

I've avoided most of that being at a rural site. When I had a personal issue that took me away for several days, my preceptors were great, and all I had to do was make up the missed time on a weekend, which would not have been possible on some hospital rotations. 

 

As someone who is also interested in FM and rural medicine, it would be awesome if you could share your rural clerkship experience.

 

Hope it's not too much to ask, thank you!  :D

 

 

It's the best! 9 months at a rural site where you do integrated FM, EM, Psych, Emerg, O&G, and Anesthesia. We go back to the city for peds, IM, and surgery, albeit for only 4 weeks each since we do get some exposure throughout the year. We also get free accommodation while we're here. All the sites are different in terms of what they offer. In my town there are no specialists, so we have GP surgeons, anes, ER, and low risk obs.

 

In general, scheduling is more flexible at a rural site, not many learners, greater independence, and everyone at the hospital/clinic knows you and tries to give you the best experience possible.

Cons would be less exposure to subspecialties, less acuity on the wards/in the OR, and the need to learn a lot independently, since there are 1-2 students at each rural site. I also feel like there will be a learning curve when I'm back fin the city and need to figure out how to get stuff done in the bigger hospitals, but that should be easily overcome.

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I've heard that apparently McMaster allows a 4th year to do research and/or additional electives. Is there any indication that Calgary might do something similar in future? It seems like it would be a nice option, if available (e.g. if you're interested in a competitive specialty and want more experience).

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I've heard that apparently McMaster allows a 4th year to do research and/or additional electives. Is there any indication that Calgary might do something similar in future? It seems like it would be a nice option, if available (e.g. if you're interested in a competitive specialty and want more experience).

 

I don't have a clear answer to your question, unfortunately. I do know that you can apply to take a gap year during your training and I have heard rumors of some people doing this year between graduation and residency. I would suggest contacting UME for a definitive answer to your question if an additional year for research or CV building is something you would like to pursue. UME's number is (403) 210-3841. 

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