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Quality Of Calgary Fm Training?


blacktowel

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On 8/13/2020 at 11:10 PM, Keege T said:

In first year, there are a lot of "ACEs" - ambulatory clinic experiences. They basically send you to a random clinic, often for just a half-day (then you go somewhere else for the other half-day). Very few of these experiences are useful at all. Often the clinic doesn't even know you're coming. It's not enough time to learn any actual medicine, the preceptor just wants to get on with their clinic and feels burdened with yet another resident they'll never see again, and it's a lot of pointless travel and direction-seeking.

They make you submit "field notes" - little feedback forms describing a learning experience from every half-day (!), which preceptors HATE to do because it's just ridiculous. It's awkward as hell asking a busy preceptor for this.

I found they also do quite a poor job retaining good preceptors and dropping bad ones, despite collecting regular feedback from residents. There was a particularly bad preceptor at the Central Teaching Clinic, whom so many residents complained about, that he was finally "encouraged" to take a sabbatical for two years... but now he's back. Surprise. This is just one example. Also, they tend to just assume away precepetor problems by taking it as absolute truth that all preceptors are good, and any problem stems from resident factors. This is unhelpful, and has resulted in major problems for the few residents who were unlucky enough to have a difficult main preceptor, who mentors and evaluates you for the entire two years (people have had extreme problems switching, and have been asked to "work out" their issue with the preceptor, after the issue was apready escalated to program director).

Returning to the first issue, because there is a relatively high proportion of just weaker preceptors in "home clinics" (academic teaching clinics where residents work 2-3 days a week for the entire two years), you just run out of things to learn from them. By the end of the second year, you could end up in a weird situation where you start being more competent than your preceptor at times, yet have to hold back, lest you get on their bad side, or even worse - get slapped with a professionalism issue.

A significant proportion of residents were fortunate enough to avoid all of above issues. There are some home clinic preceptors who are excellent, and you could get lucky/be proactive and get quality rotations for the most part. But there's little recourse to help if you run into any problems, and a high chance you'd end up with many mediocre rotations and have a bad time in home clinic.

 

 

I was also told to avoid Calgary FM program for these reasons and apparently given the situation in AB some FM grads have to practice in a rural area after graduation...

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  • 1 month later...
39 minutes ago, insomnias said:

I found this post written by a U of C FM grad which suggests their admin isn't the best, echoing above comments. https://www.**DELETED**.com/r/Residency/comments/kke63n/suing_your_residency/

The link no longer exists. Can you tell us the story?

I have heard not so great things about the Calgary FM program, I was even told by few residents that it may be the worst in country and to avoid it if possible. Can you share details?

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5 minutes ago, last min switch said:

The link no longer exists. Can you tell us the story?

I have heard not so great things about the Calgary FM program, I was even told by few residents that it may be the worst in country and to avoid it if possible. Can you share details?

It does, just can’t write out the main website name on here. Starts with an R and ends with a t. Rhymes with meddit. Interesting story. 
tldr: had to do an extra year of residency while fighting admin that they weren’t deficient due to one preceptor near the end who went out of their way to try snd fail them, admin never looked at their records stating they were an amazing resident by other preceptors. 

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35 minutes ago, IMislove said:

It does, just can’t write out the main website name on here. Starts with an R and ends with a t. Rhymes with meddit. Interesting story. 
tldr: had to do an extra year of residency while fighting admin that they weren’t deficient due to one preceptor near the end who went out of their way to try snd fail them, admin never looked at their records stating they were an amazing resident by other preceptors. 

ok, yikes! I feel sorry for them, but I think they should move on!

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14 hours ago, IMislove said:

It does, just can’t write out the main website name on here. Starts with an R and ends with a t. Rhymes with meddit. Interesting story. 
tldr: had to do an extra year of residency while fighting admin that they weren’t deficient due to one preceptor near the end who went out of their way to try snd fail them, admin never looked at their records stating they were an amazing resident by other preceptors. 

No idea if Calgary family is good or bad but that is a one sided story of someone who has clearly been struggling with mental health issues that affect their performance. It's a shame the program forced them to do strict remediation stuff instead of seek counselling/mental health support which would likely have been more beneficial in the long run.

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Would most residents say that these situations are rare? And do most people in FM residency actually feel supported? I would rather be doing most learning "on the job", ie. while in clinic, rather than trying to learn the bulk "after hours" - is that possible or naive? It's not just that I feel that hands-on learning is best, it's also because I want to have as much family time as is possible in residency. I'm trying to learn as much as possible from people's experiences/anecdotes/perspectives, so I would appreciate any insight!

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On 2/15/2021 at 1:22 PM, Deferred said:

Would most residents say that these situations are rare? And do most people in FM residency actually feel supported? I would rather be doing most learning "on the job", ie. while in clinic, rather than trying to learn the bulk "after hours" - is that possible or naive? It's not just that I feel that hands-on learning is best, it's also because I want to have as much family time as is possible in residency. I'm trying to learn as much as possible from people's experiences/anecdotes/perspectives, so I would appreciate any insight!

Before carms I was told by a Calgary FM resident that if they could give me one piece of advice it would be to *not* apply to the Calgary program because of how negatively they felt about it. This person seemed like a rational, reasonable human being and I don't think they had a particular vendetta against the program, I think they just truly believe that it is not a good program to train at. Whether or not this is how the majority of residents feel I'm not sure. I have heard that in general the program is quite "chill" and a lot of residents enjoy being in the program, but if you are wanting to seek out more opportunities/experiences (esp if you want to apply to a +1) that it can be difficult and you have to be really motivated to do so, otherwise it sounds like it's pretty easy to just coast along. Given your concerns above this might not actually be a bad thing for you if you are planning to practice in an urban FM clinic.

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11 hours ago, psychsohard said:

Before carms I was told by a Calgary FM resident that if they could give me one piece of advice it would be to *not* apply to the Calgary program because of how negatively they felt about it. This person seemed like a rational, reasonable human being and I don't think they had a particular vendetta against the program, I think they just truly believe that it is not a good program to train at. Whether or not this is how the majority of residents feel I'm not sure. I have heard that in general the program is quite "chill" and a lot of residents enjoy being in the program, but if you are wanting to seek out more opportunities/experiences (esp if you want to apply to a +1) that it can be difficult and you have to be really motivated to do so, otherwise it sounds like it's pretty easy to just coast along. Given your concerns above this might not actually be a bad thing for you if you are planning to practice in an urban FM clinic.

this is really interesting - i felt their PD during their info sessions was so motivated to hear feedback and make changes based on resident feedback. and they seemed like they really cared about their students. i realize its an info session meant to promote their program but genuinely i had a good vibe. i've also heard similar rumours but i'd rather match to calgary FM than go unmatched so..

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1 hour ago, bellejolie said:

this is really interesting - i felt their PD during their info sessions was so motivated to hear feedback and make changes based on resident feedback. and they seemed like they really cared about their students. i realize its an info session meant to promote their program but genuinely i had a good vibe. i've also heard similar rumours but i'd rather match to calgary FM than go unmatched so..

I'm just relaying something I heard from a resident, definitely not the gospel. I personally didn't apply to Calgary FM, partially because of the reputation but also partially bc they have a history of not ranking or often even not interviewing seemingly qualified applicants, so I didn't want to waste my time. But obviously each person has their own decision to make

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On 2/17/2021 at 8:22 PM, birdy21 said:

Before carms I was told by a Calgary FM resident that if they could give me one piece of advice it would be to *not* apply to the Calgary program because of how negatively they felt about it. This person seemed like a rational, reasonable human being and I don't think they had a particular vendetta against the program, I think they just truly believe that it is not a good program to train at. Whether or not this is how the majority of residents feel I'm not sure. I have heard that in general the program is quite "chill" and a lot of residents enjoy being in the program, but if you are wanting to seek out more opportunities/experiences (esp if you want to apply to a +1) that it can be difficult and you have to be really motivated to do so, otherwise it sounds like it's pretty easy to just coast along. Given your concerns above this might not actually be a bad thing for you if you are planning to practice in an urban FM clinic.

Thanks for your reply! Yes it might be better suited for someone like me, interested in more family time outside of hours and no +1. Although not so much if you’re not trained well, I think maximizing learning during work hours is what I meant. I still have lots of time to check out the program and learn more. Thanks again 

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  • 8 months later...
9 hours ago, Redpill said:

Any updates on this, particularly from recently matched residents? Have things changed with new leadership?

 

I'm a current FM resident. Through my CaRMS tour, I interviewed at all of the FM programs in Canada. I have mostly enjoyed my program so far, but  I can tell you the following pros and cons to doing my residency in Calgary ( from my experience and from witnessing the experiences of other residents).

Pros:

- Calgary is beautiful city - close to the mountains.

- Program is very manageable overall.

- Other residents are very collegial and friendly.

- Block system overall has been a major positive change in the program.

- We get Thursday academics every week and it is usually either lecture based or procedural skills. I've enjoyed procedural skills so far. 

Cons:

- Overall, most faculty are supportive and are willing to teach you/easy to work with. However, some faculty are more on the 'abusive' side and can be unpleasant to work with. Some residents may get in conflict with their preceptors, and when that happens, residents are always the ones to be blamed.  I have also seen residents get into further conflict with worse outcomes when they share concerns with leaders in the program.  So although most faculty are great and pleasant to work with, some are quite passive-aggressive. If you decide to complain, you will probably get worse outcomes or evaluations.  I agree with the sentiments described above. 

- Pts at home programs have lots of psyco-social issues, you may be learning minimal medicine at times and instead doing lots of care co-ordination for pts.

- Sometimes, during your blocks you are supposed to go to various clinics in the city. However, sometimes you show up and the doctor you are supposed to work with is away ( due to admin errors). So, sometimes you may end up doing readings at home instead ( unfortunate given that clinical experience is so much better than doing readings).

- During some of the blocks, you may be just shadowing allied healthcare professionals, which is great if you only do in for few hours, instead of doing it for several days. 

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17 hours ago, familymedkeen said:

- Pts at home programs have lots of psyco-social issues, you may be learning minimal medicine at times and instead doing lots of care co-ordination for pts.


If you did not think that family medicine includes "lots of psychosocial issues" then you're in for a big surprise...

btw, welcome to calgary!

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
18 minutes ago, carmsregrets said:

I'd not honestly recommend the U of C FM program.  I am doing most of my FM rotations at the Central teaching Clinic ( which is supposed to be the site with best preceptors), and I am certainly not impressed by the program. They do not have an open door to concerns, concerns are usually met with defensive statements.  Several residents have had their residency prolonged due to performance issues near the end of the 2 years, even after they have passed CFPC.  (Prolonged without pay, with the expectation to meet individualized learning objectives). Anyone who submits anonymous complaints about the learning environment has had subsequent negative evaluations, from the personal stories my colleagues have shared with me.  My interview day was all smiles and rainbows, and they did a great job of hiding the hellhole this program really is.

Damn that sounds bad. I would really make sure to document everything. At least it is temporary then you can get out.

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22 hours ago, carmsregrets said:

I'd not honestly recommend the U of C FM program.  I am doing most of my FM rotations at the Central teaching Clinic ( which is supposed to be the site with best preceptors), and I am certainly not impressed by the program. They do not have an open door to concerns, concerns are usually met with defensive statements.  Several residents have had their residency prolonged due to performance issues near the end of the 2 years, even after they have passed CFPC.  (Prolonged without pay, with the expectation to meet individualized learning objectives). Anyone who submits anonymous complaints about the learning environment has had subsequent negative evaluations, from the personal stories my colleagues have shared with me.  My interview day was all smiles and rainbows, and they did a great job of hiding the hellhole this program really is.

That certainly does sound terrible. Do you know if there is at least opportunity to prepare for enhanced skills / +1 training? Or is this not a program to match to if you are interested in that?

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2 hours ago, Redpill said:

That certainly does sound terrible. Do you know if there is at least opportunity to prepare for enhanced skills / +1 training? Or is this not a program to match to if you are interested in that?

Most ppl choose FM because of the flexibility, however, in Calgary Urban FM program, you ONLY have 3 month elective in the entire program. 1 elective in first year and 2 electives in 2 nd year ( with 50% of the residents having their electives after the CaRMS deadline - making that elective useless for CaRMS application purpose). Nonetheless, there were 3-4 people matching to EM last year, so I guess it is possible to match to EM from Calgary FM.

Calgary FM is not a great option if you are interested in emerg +1, however, the rural FM program may be a better option.

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