Socials

[Dua]

Wondering how important people think socials are? Does it look bad if you are not able to attend?

[ellorie]

Depends on the specialty.  In psychiatry I don't think they're a huge deal one way or the other.  People understand that CaRMS is crazy and sometimes travel schedules just don't allow you to go.  When I did CaRMS, U of T psychiatry didn't even put on a social at all.  The only time it would be a huge deal would be if you went and did something ridiculous like got super drunk.

For smaller specialties, it might be a bigger deal.

[Lactic Folly]

For a smaller specialty, programs will be more familiar with the next stop on the schedule, and whether travel to that next location might prevent applicants from attending the evening social.

[ralk]

Agreed with the other posters. For FM it doesn't matter at all. Other larger specialties are likely similar. Smaller specialties are probably worth the effort to attend, as both residents and faculty are often looking for people they'd feel comfortable working with closely for the 5+ years of residency.

[Dua]

Thanks everyone. I am applying for psychiatry and so it is one of those in between programs with respect to size and I wasn't sure how important it was. Are residents involved in the selection process? I assume it likely depends on the school. 

[Lactic Folly]

I would think the overwhelming majority of, if not all, programs have residents involved in the selection process.

[rmorelan]

1 hour ago, Lactic Folly said:

I would think the overwhelming majority, if not all, programs have residents involved in the selection process.

I would agree - that doesn't mean at socials there is some score card floating around, but programs will take whatever they can to help with the process. 

[oh_kno]

What's a "small" vs "big" specialty?

I know family med, internal are likely big and derm, emerg, plastics are likely small.

But what about things in the middle: anesthesia for example? 

[ellorie]

3 hours ago, Dua said:

Thanks everyone. I am applying for psychiatry and so it is one of those in between programs with respect to size and I wasn't sure how important it was. Are residents involved in the selection process? I assume it likely depends on the school. 

Residents are involved. They are not always the same residents who come to the social. Here the scoring is fairly standardized as far as I know in terms of all the different components of the application having weight so hard to imagine how the social (if we even had one) would change anything unless you got red flagged. 

[Dua]

2 hours ago, ellorie said:

Residents are involved. They are not always the same residents who come to the social. Here the scoring is fairly standardized as far as I know in terms of all the different components of the application having weight so hard to imagine how the social (if we even had one) would change anything unless you got red flagged. 

Ok thank you. I am trying to make as many as I can, but this year the interviews seem grouped very close together

[MDLaval]

17 hours ago, oh_kno said:

What's a "small" vs "big" specialty?

But what about things in the middle? 

I was wondering about the very same thing.

[ralk]

17 hours ago, oh_kno said:

What's a "small" vs "big" specialty?

I know family med, internal are likely big and derm, emerg, plastics are likely small.

But what about things in the middle: anesthesia for example? 

Almost certainly varies program-to-program. Two things I'd be considering are the overall size of the program and the competitiveness of the program. An anesthesiology program with 10 spots is not going to have as much of a chance to determine the "fit" of all the applicants they'd be considering as one with 2 spots. Likewise, socials probably matter a bit more in competitive specialties where programs have the luxury of choice and where competitive applicants all look fairly similar on paper. Taking the extra effort to go to socials and show you can fit in probably matters more in something like anesthesiology than it would in, say, Rad Onc, which despite being a much smaller specialty is also significantly less competitive.

It's rare that socials are required and they're unlikely to move any candidate, in any program, up more than a few spots in a ranking (though they might move people down a fair number with poor behaviour), so if it's a stretch to make a social with the rest of the interview schedule, it's probably ok to politely decline that one. Elective performance and official interviews will still be the main methods of evaluation.

Keep in mind though that socials are as much for the candidates as they are for the programs. For smaller programs, even ones in the middle like anesthesiology, the vibe of a program can vary dramatically school-to-school. If you're there for 5 years, fitting in with the program's overall personality is important for your learning, your clinical performance, and your well-being. I'd argue that in general, socials are far more like to change your rankings of programs than programs' rankings of you and for small-to-midsized programs are likely worth the effort to attend where possible as a result.

[shakeshake]

People's thoughts on dress attire to socials? They seem to range from resident pub nights to events with faculty present so just wasn't sure. I'm assuming business casual but not full suit 

[mavrik13]

Can't go wrong with business casual, definitely not a suit (nor a tie), but not jeans/T-shirt either. Dark jeans/collared shirt usually would be OK.

[ellorie]

Yeah I went with business casual.  

[FrenchToast]

On 12/22/2017 at 11:03 AM, ralk said:

Keep in mind though that socials are as much for the candidates as they are for the programs. For smaller programs, even ones in the middle like anesthesiology, the vibe of a program can vary dramatically school-to-school. If you're there for 5 years, fitting in with the program's overall personality is important for your learning, your clinical performance, and your well-being. I'd argue that in general, socials are far more like to change your rankings of programs than programs' rankings of you and for small-to-midsized programs are likely worth the effort to attend where possible as a result.

Very much agree. There was one program that I interviewed at last year where I found the resident behaviour at the social the night before the interview to be quite unprofessional (and very much a turn off). There was unprofessional behaviour from different residents on interview day itself, as well, and ultimately I ranked this school quite low as a result.

Also, for what it's worth, I interviewed for psychiatry last year, and I also couldn't attend very many socials because the interviews were so close together. A lot of my colleagues did the same. I don't think anyone thought worse of us as a result.

[NLengr]

1 hour ago, FrenchToast said:

Very much agree. There was one program that I interviewed at last year where I found the resident behaviour at the social the night before the interview to be quite unprofessional (and very much a turn off). There was unprofessional behaviour from different residents on interview day itself, as well, and ultimately I ranked this school quite low as a result.

Also, for what it's worth, I interviewed for psychiatry last year, and I also couldn't attend very many socials because the interviews were so close together. A lot of my colleagues did the same. I don't think anyone thought worse of us as a result.

Thank god you didn't interview for my program when I was a resident. Unprofessional was all we knew......

That's a good point though. Going to a social will also give you some idea of what the residents are like outside of work. It might help you decide if you want to spend 5 years there or not. Give you some idea of how well you "fit" into the group.