US applicants sweating May 13?

[rmitch8]

So has anybody still not made a decision between US and Canada? I’m waiting for U of T and Queens on May 13 before I make a final call. I know this has been discussed to death on this forum, but I’m having a hard time making up my mind (assuming I find myself in this fortunate position). To me it comes down to a few key things: 1) having a fantastic, “hands-dirty” clinical experience on a diverse patient population, 2) having a solid opportunity to do research and possibly get a dual degree, 3) keeping my options open for residencies (US and Canada) 4) live in a city if possible 5) low tuition over 4 yrs.

 

I’m absolutely convinced that the US school I’ve picked (declined all acceptances except one) nails #1, #2, #4, #5(kinda) and I know I can cover the cost with a LOC. Additionally, I got accepted into a program at that school which comes with a substantial fellowship and will give me a tuition-free dual degree (MD/M.Sc) and a stipend.

 

I’m still unsure about #3 though, and this could sway me towards staying in Canada at U of T or Queens if I get in. I tried calling the people at healthforceontario.com to ask specific questions about coming back to Canada for residency, but haven’t gotten a response. Does anyone have stats with regard to US med school grads (CAN citizens) returning back to Canada for residency? I’m talking % accepted, specific specialties, etc. I haven’t been able to find this kind of info.

 

In my mind, I’ve essentially boiled it down to risky (going to the US – really excited about the school I’ve chosen, but have to dealing with visa BS, more $$, loan risks, tougher to come home if I choose to do so after 4 years) vs non-risky (staying in Can – not completely sold yet on the schools I saw, less $$, no loans, no visa BS, etc) Is anyone else still undecided between US and Canada and sweating the approach of May 13th? Maybe I won’t get into either Canadian school and the choice will be way easier.

[emcd]

i am feeling the exact same way. i am really excited about northwestern and chicago, but it would be so much easier to stay in canada. i secretly hope the decision is just made for me!

[rmitch8]

Which Canadian schools are you waiting on emcd?

[Typical Premed]

Hey guys. I was faced with the exact same decision last year. I had been accepted to Northwestern but chose to stay in Canada. It was a very tough decision for me but I'm satisfied with my choice. Feel free to PM if you have any more questions.

[JC5]

Well I'm obviously sweating it as I don't have any acceptances (more like the 14th though - not all of Canada is synchronized this year and most of my luck has come OOP).

 

I really do think that you should think long and hard about which country you want to be in, as being in one country and meeting the demands of the other is a real pain. I don't think any U.S. school can satisfy you as much as Canadian school for #3 if your goal is Canada, with the reverse being true as well.

[hmmmm]

Hear you JC5, I have the same problem. I hope the 13th is a good day! I can feel my heart beat in my head (I doubt that is safe).

[rmitch8]

Well I'm obviously sweating it as I don't have any acceptances (more like the 14th though - not all of Canada is synchronized this year and most of my luck has come OOP).

 

I really do think that you should think long and hard about which country you want to be in, as being in one country and meeting the demands of the other is a real pain. I don't think any U.S. school can satisfy you as much as Canadian school for #3 if your goal is Canada, with the reverse being true as well.

 

That's kinda what I'm thinking. It's nice to keep options open but I think I've gotta make the decision based on which country I actually want to be a doctor in.

It's just hard for me to pass up this opportunity based on my unsubstantiated worry that I won't be able to come back to CAN. That's why I was looking for residency stats. It's way easier to justify a choice if I see something that says like "only 30% of med students are able to match into Canadian residencies after graduating from US med school". But I haven't seen anything like that and I have no idea what the reality is for US grads matching back to Canada residencies - other than anecdotally "it's harder".

[madskillz99]

Hear you JC5, I have the same problem. I hope the 13th is a good day! I can feel my heart beat in my head (I doubt that is safe).

 

Same problem too. Waiting on Canadian schools and waitlists at US schools to open up. Hopefully something works out..if not by May 13th, then hopefully by the end of May..or back to MCAT for me

[hmmmm]

My stress just went through the roof yesterday after getting waitlisted in the US. Hoping my Canadain school works out. It would be a nighgtmare summer being on a waitlist. My poor heart could barely handle it now.

[Cyradis]

I think it mostly depends on where you ultimately want to live and work - if your goal is to live and work in Canada I'd probably stick with the Canadian schools - cheaper too. That is, ofc, unless you're looking at a top 10/20 ish US school and are very keen on being a future leader in your field - although you'd be better off staying in the US for that anyways (in terms of resources etc.)

[Illuminis]

I hear you... I'm waiting on Queens and Ottawa. Thought I did well after interviews, forgot about it for a couple of months, and now the pressure's starting to build. I would like to stay in Canada simply because everything I know is here, though I'm sure opportunities are even greater in the States, and the reform is exciting but may potentially be more demanding on doctors.

 

I have heard there is some difficulty between studying in States and coming back to Canada, and vice versa (again, no concrete stats/proof). However, it is apparently much simpler compared to if you go beyond North America for your studies. I'll pray for an acceptance in Canada, but if not, I'll go ahead with the US school. Still get an MD in the end, and I'm sure all roads will be open to us in the future as long as we aim for it.

[keith_015]

Congrats to Rach! I'm sure her decision is pretty much set on McGill.

[a41]

It's way easier to justify a choice if I see something that says like "only 30% of med students are able to match into Canadian residencies after graduating from US med school". But I haven't seen anything like that and I have no idea what the reality is for US grads matching back to Canada residencies - other than anecdotally "it's harder".

 

I'm pretty sure CaRMS has this data somewhere. Hardly anyone even applies back to Canada (probably because the number of residency PROGRAMS in the US for most specialties is like double the number of SPOTS in Canada.)

 

Anyways this is a decision you need to make - I didn't have that choice, but I am really glad that I am in the US and plan on staying. I know that being in an urban city with a lot of problems is giving me a way better clinical experience than I would have gotten in small town, Canada.

 

Here's some anecdotal stats: only 3 Canadians from our school matched back to Canada (2 in Family, 1 in Neurosurgery) this year. One other applied but didn't get in (matched in Radiology in the US though). The 10 or so others applied US only. Most people only apply back if they want to do family medicine.

 

I don't think it's exceptionally hard to do an American residency and go back to Canada (on a J-1 they pretty much force you to), but if you know for sure you want to stay in Canada then you might as well go to a Canadian school given the choice.

[Rach]

Congrats to Rach! I'm sure her decision is pretty much set on McGill.

 

Thanks Keith. I am pretty much set on McGill at this point, but I am disappointed we won't be classmates!

[rmitch8]

Congrats Rach! What a sweet way to end the application year

[Rach]

Congrats Rach! What a sweet way to end the application year

 

Definitely unexpected, but so sweet! I'll keep my fingers crossed for the rest of our gang that more acceptances to US and Canadian schools come our way!

[MSB]

Hi everyone,

I am feeling the same way about US vs Canada. I didn't get much love from Canada due to mistakes I made in undergrad and therefore only had a shot at UofT (Queens too but the R cut off was ridiculous). I interviewed there and think I did well but if I do get in I'm in the same boat. After attending the second look weekend in the US I was blown away by the facilities, the technology and everything... Toronto did not do a great job selling themselves at all.

It's going to be a tough call... but I am really hoping to have the option (after May13)

[rmitch8]

Does anyone know if AMCAS and OMSAS share info regarding acceptances? I'm wondering if I could hold a Canadian acceptance and my remaining US acceptance past May 15 without any trouble. I still haven't made a decision....

[keith_015]

The schools across both sides of the border will know. As long as the school is an LCME accredited school, the school will have knowledge of other acceptances. As the rules go, you can't hold more than one acceptance to LCME schools. I am assuming that the pre-May 15th period in the US is for provisional acceptances, but the May 15th day is for firm acceptances.

 

I imagine the communication is similar between CaRMS and NRMP when you match in one country before the other (cross border situation), or, when you match in one program period (in country situation).

 

Edit: Looking over the U of Manitoba's application bulletin

Information about the identity and academic qualifications of applicant to medical schools is sent to the Association of Canadian

Medical Colleges for statistical analysis and research purposes. Faculties of Medicine in Canada and the United States share the names

of all candidates offered a position in their class as well as the identity of any fraudulent applicants. No student may hold more than

one position at an LCME accredited medical school.

[trickybox]

The schools across both sides of the border will know. As long as the school is an LCME accredited school, the school will have knowledge of other acceptances. As the rules go, you can't hold more than one acceptance to LCME schools. I am assuming that the pre-May 15th period in the US is for provisional acceptances, but the May 15th day is for firm acceptances.

 

I imagine the communication is similar between CaRMS and NRMP when you match in one country before the other (cross border situation), or, when you match in one program period (in country situation).

 

Okay so say you get into a Canadian school by May 13. After May 15, is there a specific time period you need to inform the American school that you'll be declining the offer if you end up doing so? Or do they just assume that you'll be declining after a certain time period? (similar to the AMCAS one school post May 15 rule)

[keith_015]

Okay so say you get into a Canadian school by May 13. After May 15, is there a specific time period you need to inform the American school that you'll be declining the offer if you end up doing so? Or do they just assume that you'll be declining after a certain time period? (similar to the AMCAS one school post May 15 rule)

 

I just did a little reading, and it is up to each school's policy likely. I think many CDN schools offer you a number of weeks to firmly accept the offer. At that point when you decide to accept, it would likely be on you to tell the US school that you won't attend. If you don't, likely both schools will be in touch with you to tell you to decide promptly.

[trickybox]

Thanks for that Keith.

[rmitch8]

Ah really good to know. Thanks Keith. Good luck to everyone waiting for tomorrow.

[trickybox]

Ah really good to know. Thanks Keith. Good luck to everyone waiting for tomorrow.

 

+1. Good luck everyone.

[mystery_chick]

BAH, I am jumping on the undecided over which side of the border group!

 

GL everyone! likely less than 8 hours to go before we start finding out.