Guest Rome1 Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 Hey Everyone, I have been wondering for some time now, about the way in which you get your specific clerkship rotation schedule. I have heard of people selecting which specialities they wanted to start off with, so it make me wonder if you select how you want your schedule to look or does your med school lay down a few rotation schedules for you to pick from? Enjoy the rest of your holidays! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest summervirus Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 I think this varies from school to school. At the UofA, there are a few different "tracks" that are offered to students. All students complete the same rotations for the same length of time, but some in a different order depending on the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kirsteen Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 Hi there, Calgary is similar. We have over 20 different clerkship rotation schedules to choose from. Again, electives and core rotations are in different orders depending on the schedule, but everyone ends up receiving the same number of weeks in electives and core rotations. Additionally, within the big core rotations, e.g., surgery and internal medicine, we have a choice of "selectives", i.e., specialties within each realm. So, with respect to surgery, for example, if you are keen on plastics, then you'd select 2 weeks of plastics within your 8 weeks of core surgery as opposed to orthopedics, etc. The same applies for internal medicine: in addition to 4 weeks in general internal medicine you have a choice of rotations in cardiology, infectious disease, etc., within the remainder of your internal medicine rotation weeks. In terms of flexibility in selecting specialties of interest, people generally aim to select schedules that permit core rotations of interest and electives prior to CaRMS so that they can acquire letters etc., for the application process. So, for example, if you're not as keen on surgery as a career, then you might choose the schedule that has the core surgical rotation slotted during or after the CaRMS process. If surgery is your thing then you'd choose a schedule that has the surgery rotation up front. Cheers, Kirsteen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest aneliz Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 At UWO we have eight different clerkship groups. Everyone does the same rotations, in the same order and for the same length of time, but the rotation you start with is different depending on the group you are in. For example I was in group 3 and I started with Surgery, then had Paeds, Ob/Gyn, Medicine, Family and Psych. Someone in group 7 would have started with Medicine, then had family, psych, Surgery, paeds and finished with Ob/Gyn. The different groups just determined where in the established order of rotations you started. Within several of the rotations, we had some choice about what 'selective' or 'elective' time we wanted to complete. For example: during surgery, you had the chance to choose two fo the surgical subspecialties to spend two weeks each in. In paeds you could chose one subspecialty to spend two weeks in, and the same with medicine. There are many different subspecialties to choose from, so most people had unique combinations of electives/selectives. (ie it would be very unusual for two classmates to have done EXACTLY the same rotations throughout the entire year). As an added complication, there are several 'sites' where you may be placed for your rotations (including rural and Windsor). So, you may do medicine at University Hospital or Victoria Hospital. You may do Ob/Gyn at St Joe's or at Vic. You have no choice about where you are assigned to do your rotations, and the experience can vary from site to site. So, there are some different experiences between classmates due to location as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rome1 Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 Thanks summervirus, Kirsteen and aneliz for your responses! In terms of picking selectives during your elective in a certain speciality, is this the time to set up a few weeks in hospitals or regions that you would eventually like to find yourself as a resident? Aneliz, you mentioned that there are several sites for some rotations at UWO...do you get any choice in what site you get placed in? Also, is it unheard for people to check out subspecialities outside of their region (ie. OOP schools, up-north)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest aneliz Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 It depends on the school... at UWO, your clerkship 'selectives' and 'electives' are done at UWO. You do not have the opportunity to go to other centres/schools during clerkship. We have a block of 16 weeks of elective time during our 4th year where you can travel to other locations to do electives. Generally, you have little/no choice as to the site that you are assigned for a rotation within London (although Windsor and regional/rural locations you usually do have some say). Most are assigned based on what selectives you have picked (for example: if you pick neurosurg during surgery, you will be at University hospital because there is no Neuro at Vic.) Location for Medicine rotations seems a little more random... and locations for Ob/Gyn are based on what letter your last name starts with (A-M at St. Joes, N-Z at Vic). You can usually switch with a classmate if you have a really compelling reason to be at the other site though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest summervirus Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 At the UofA, there is elective time scattered throughout third and fourth year. During electives, students get to choose to spend the time in whatever discipline they want and in any accredited or approved place they want (i.e. another Canadian school, an international elective, etc.) On the other hand, selective time is restricted to within the UofA and a limited number of choices are offered to students. For example, a portion of our fourth-year surgery rotation includes selective time where students can choose (select) two subspecialty surgeries of their preference such as plastic surgery, neurosurgery, cardiac surgery, vascular surgery, urology, and ENT. It's intended to give students some flexibility within the curriculum to explore areas that interest (or are more relevant to) them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lactic Folly Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 When people talk about fitting electives in before CARMS, do they mean mainly before the CARMS application deadline for reference letter purposes, or before January so they will be fresh in the minds of the people in the department come interview time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kirsteen Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 Hi there, Regarding elective time and CaRMS, folks generally prefer to slot their electives in before the application or reference letter deadline, i.e., in time to have reference letters included. As I heard from one Program Director today, electives that take place after CaRMS are generally a lot less important--minimally so, in their opinion--than those which take place prior. Cheers, Kirsteen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest summervirus Posted December 28, 2005 Report Share Posted December 28, 2005 I agree with Kirsteen. The most valuable electives are generally the one that are scheduled in the late summer/early fall of your final year. Most students try to get at least one reference letter from the experience, make a good impression with the staff, and improve their chances for their CaRMS application. Most people agree that electives that take place after the deadline for reference letters are less valuable from a CaRMS application perspective. Reference letters are no longer an issue. But, I have heard some students using these electives to their advantage by deliberately scheduling electives in their choice programs around the time of interviews and shortly thereafter in order to make a good impression with the staff. After all, staff talk among themselves and a good word here or there never hurts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rome1 Posted December 30, 2005 Report Share Posted December 30, 2005 Thank you all for your responses! I think I get the general idea, but I can see that there is some variation between schools. Can anyone comment on clerkship rotations at Mac? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Blake128 Posted January 31, 2006 Report Share Posted January 31, 2006 Hi everyone, I have a few questions to ask you guys. In exactly 1 year, I'll be doing my elective rotations and I was wondering if it's unusual to have electives as our first clinical rotations (the core rotations come after the elective ones). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lactic Folly Posted January 31, 2006 Report Share Posted January 31, 2006 Well, at the U of A, 1/4 of the class will get the track with 6 weeks of electives in Sept-Nov. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kirsteen Posted January 31, 2006 Report Share Posted January 31, 2006 Hi, At UofC, we have 10 weeks of electives slotted into our clerkship schedule. Almost everyone has 6 of these weeks scheduled up-front, and some of us have all 10 weeks. Cheers, Kirsteen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest aneliz Posted January 31, 2006 Report Share Posted January 31, 2006 At UWO, things are the exact opposite. We do all of our core rotations as a year-long block and then do all of our elective rotations as a continuous 16 week block from Sept-Dec of 4th year. Any UWO elective students that you see will have completed all of their core rotations and will have completed 48 weeks of rotations prior to their electives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valani9 Posted February 1, 2006 Report Share Posted February 1, 2006 Those late summer/early fall electives may not be all that advantageous. At that point, some other students may have already passed through with your supervisor, made a good impression, and requested/received a letter of reference. I dunno - I think really any time before Carms is good - maybe the earlier the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kirsteen Posted February 2, 2006 Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 Hi there, Interesting topic. On the above note, one of my mentors (and a residency Program Director) noted some of his observations re: electives in the spring vs. the autumn. When I was asking about times of year to do electives he said that those scheduled in the spring tended to be in atmospheres that were much more relaxed. That the rotations were generally populated by students who were not so keen on the specialty and so, for those who were interested in the specialty, it was an added opportunity to shine. He noted that the contrary was true for the fall: that it tended to be a lot more of a competitive time of year to do electives, reflected in the quite different atmosphere at that time of year. Cheers, Kirsteen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cheech10 Posted February 2, 2006 Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 I don't think it matters much when you do electives. The key people (program directors, committee members, well known staff) have worked with many students over the years and will have a pretty good idea of where you stand compared to them. I do agree with Kirsteen that the atmosphere is different depending on when you do electives. For example, almost no one takes their intended specialty as their very first rotation, so if you feel confident with your clinical skills (from summer electives, etc.) choose it first and you'll have a more relaxed time of it. Similarly fall is the last chance to get letters for CaRMS, and competition is more intense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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