UK IMG advice - Rad/Path Alberta/Quebec

[AlienMG]

Good morning all,

As a UK IMG, I have decided to move to Canada because I believe it is a better place to raise my future children. My husband has already secured a tech job, and we have the flexibility to choose a province to settle in (Alberta looks nice). I will be obtaining PR as a dependent.

I find CARMS confusing with its different streams, and despite searching the forum, I couldn't find a clear answer to my questions. I have two main questions:

1.     It appears that there are only 4 Rad residencies available for IMGs in 2023 across the country, all of which are in Ontario. Is this accurate, or am I missing something?
2.     Are there any English-speaking residencies available for the Regular stream in Quebec, where I could potentially apply? I understand that I would have to pass the OQLF, which I believe I can achieve by studying for one year to go from A2 to B2 level. However, I would prefer to avoid doing interviews in French and writing reports in French for the next five years.

To provide some background, I graduated in 2017 and have been working as a house officer locum in various specialties such as cardiology, ortho, vascular, GIM and emergency. After realizing my strengths in visual pattern recognition and problem-solving, I decided to pursue radiology. I also enjoy the interspecialty communication and leading role radiologists have at MDTs.
I only have two publications, and I understand that radiology is more competitive in Canada than in the UK. Additionally, I am aware that Canadian residencies involve more demanding work with brutal on-calls.

To improve my chances of matching into a program, I have two questions:

1.     Would it be beneficial to get a research assistant job and pursue a PhD in Canada before applying for a residency program in the future?
2.     Should I consider General Pathology as a backup option, since it is similar to Radiology in many aspects?

I am not in a rush to apply and can comfortably live on my husband's salary while I prepare and study for exams.

Thank you for your time and advice.

[Edict]

45 minutes ago, AlienMG said:

Good morning all,

As a UK IMG, I have decided to move to Canada because I believe it is a better place to raise my future children. My husband has already secured a tech job, and we have the flexibility to choose a province to settle in (Alberta looks nice). I will be obtaining PR as a dependent.

I find CARMS confusing with its different streams, and despite searching the forum, I couldn't find a clear answer to my questions. I have two main questions:

1.     It appears that there are only 4 Rad residencies available for IMGs in 2023 across the country, all of which are in Ontario. Is this accurate, or am I missing something?
2.     Are there any English-speaking residencies available for the Regular stream in Quebec, where I could potentially apply? I understand that I would have to pass the OQLF, which I believe I can achieve by studying for one year to go from A2 to B2 level. However, I would prefer to avoid doing interviews in French and writing reports in French for the next five years.

To provide some background, I graduated in 2017 and have been working as a house officer locum in various specialties such as cardiology, ortho, vascular, GIM and emergency. After realizing my strengths in visual pattern recognition and problem-solving, I decided to pursue radiology. I also enjoy the interspecialty communication and leading role radiologists have at MDTs.
I only have two publications, and I understand that radiology is more competitive in Canada than in the UK. Additionally, I am aware that Canadian residencies involve more demanding work with brutal on-calls.

To improve my chances of matching into a program, I have two questions:

1.     Would it be beneficial to get a research assistant job and pursue a PhD in Canada before applying for a residency program in the future?
2.     Should I consider General Pathology as a backup option, since it is similar to Radiology in many aspects?

I am not in a rush to apply and can comfortably live on my husband's salary while I prepare and study for exams.

Thank you for your time and advice.

Are you on a specialty training program in radiology in the UK currently? Or have you finished your FYs and are locuming? 

If you aren't currently in radiology or haven't had much radiology experience, my advice is to pursue a masters or preferably PhD working under a radiologist in clinical research, at a center that has IMG spots. If you do a good job as a masters or PhD student, this will really give you the inside track on getting into radiology. 

If you are in radiology in the UK right now, you might be able to match to an IMG spot without doing as much research, so in that case you could consider just applying, but considering you need to study for exams, you might consider doing research anyways. A lot of people do research degree and exams concurrently. 

Make sure you don't take it too easy though, programs generally prefer recent grads, so if you are planning on doing a PhD you really want to make sure you are working with a radiologist and working hard so that they will just get you into a training program. 

I don't know much about general path but I've always thought it differs from rads, but if you like it, then go for it. 

 

[1D7]

I am not exactly familiar with your exact situation but I can answer a few questions.

Quote

It appears that there are only 4 Rad residencies available for IMGs in 2023 across the country, all of which are in Ontario. Is this accurate, or am I missing something?

That is correct. There are only a few (somewhere like 4-5) radiology IMG positions a year. Currently they are all located in Ontario. They are very competitive, around 15-25% match rate.

Quote

Would it be beneficial to get a research assistant job and pursue a PhD in Canada before applying for a residency program in the future?

I would advise against any very lengthy process to attempt to boost your CV.

Honestly the best way to improve your chances is if you networked in a department with a position. From there if you had an opportunity to do research with some of the main research & residency people that would help immensely.

Quote

Should I consider General Pathology as a backup option, since it is similar to Radiology in many aspects?

I do not feel pathology is similar to radiology, except that direct patient contact is generally lower and they are visually oriented specialties.

However if you do enjoy pathology, that would be good for you since there are more IMG positions and it is usually one of the less competitive specialties (often, if not always, there are some pathology spots left over after the first round of the CaRMS match).

[AlienMG]

On 4/19/2023 at 9:37 PM, Edict said:

Are you on a specialty training program in radiology in the UK currently? Or have you finished your FYs and are locuming? 

If you aren't currently in radiology or haven't had much radiology experience, my advice is to pursue a masters or preferably PhD working under a radiologist in clinical research, at a center that has IMG spots. If you do a good job as a masters or PhD student, this will really give you the inside track on getting into radiology. 

If you are in radiology in the UK right now, you might be able to match to an IMG spot without doing as much research, so in that case you could consider just applying, but considering you need to study for exams, you might consider doing research anyways. A lot of people do research degree and exams concurrently. 

Make sure you don't take it too easy though, programs generally prefer recent grads, so if you are planning on doing a PhD you really want to make sure you are working with a radiologist and working hard so that they will just get you into a training program. 

I don't know much about general path but I've always thought it differs from rads, but if you like it, then go for it. 

 

Thank you for the advice.

Yes I finished Foundation and living the locum life, training pathways are much more flexible here. PDs can't red-flag you based on year of graduation or  medical school origin/performance, ranking is based on a transparent score of CV/interview/exams.

Regarding PhD, how would I go about it in Ontario? In UK you have to competitively apply to academic residencies.

Do you not need a medical license to do clinical research?

Is it as simple as arranging an elective, getting involved in the department's research, then hoping they'll support you in applying for funding?

[AlienMG]

On 4/19/2023 at 9:41 PM, 1D7 said:

I am not exactly familiar with your exact situation but I can answer a few questions.

That is correct. There are only a few (somewhere like 4-5) radiology IMG positions a year. Currently they are all located in Ontario. They are very competitive, around 15-25% match rate.

I would advise against any very lengthy process to attempt to boost your CV.

Thank you for the warning. Do you have a source for the 15-25% match rate?

For any other IMGs, I managed to answer some of the questions:

All residency spots in McGill are in English, except for family medicine. That's another 5 spots IMGs can apply. Last year they accepted 2 IMGs, from Qatar and Saudi Arabia.

You don't need any knowledge of French or to pass the OQLF if you get a temporary permit from the CMQ.

[Edict]

3 hours ago, AlienMG said:

Thank you for the advice.

Yes I finished Foundation and living the locum life, training pathways are much more flexible here. PDs can't red-flag you based on year of graduation or  medical school origin/performance, ranking is based on a transparent score of CV/interview/exams.

Regarding PhD, how would I go about it in Ontario? In UK you have to competitively apply to academic residencies.

Do you not need a medical license to do clinical research?

Is it as simple as arranging an elective, getting involved in the department's research, then hoping they'll support you in applying for funding?

Unfortunately it isn't very simple because its not a defined path, but you need to contact radiology programs and try to do research with them, likely start off as a research assistant. Then, if you are doing well and enjoying it, after some time express your interest in doing radiology residency and see what they say. They may recommend you do a masters or PhD. The key is that you do a good job, since getting a position requires that you really demonstrate great work ethic beyond typical. 

Canada is a lot less open when it comes to its residency system and many factors play a role, nothing is really off limits. This includes year of graduation, the further you are from foundation years the less likely you are to get a position. I think your chances in ultimately landing a residency spot are related to your background and aptitudes. There are always IMGs from the UK who've done well back home and would have landed a specialty training post in the UK, i.e. an intercalated first, higher tier medical school, AFP, publications etc, who have applied and secured a residency spot in Canada. As you rightly point out, some PDs may presume (rightly or wrongly) that locuming may mean you weren't able to secure a specialty training position in the UK. Although this doesn't mean that you won't succeed, it may mean you would need to really demonstrate that ability and "work your way up" while in Canada. 

From your post, I would only come to Canada to try this if the priority is your husband's tech job and your children's education. This path could very well not lead to a residency position even after years of dedication. A lot of people's careers end this way, but with dedication there is a chance. If you want a high chance of success landing a radiology residency position, Canada generally isn't the best place to come, our immigration system is much more open than our medical training system, which is unique among many western countries. 

[1D7]

4 hours ago, AlienMG said:

Thank you for the warning. Do you have a source for the 15-25% match rate?

https://www.carms.ca/data-reports/r1-data-reports/ -> Check reports for the following below (dedicated quota offered IMG/1st choice IMG). You can check each year's competitiveness, which tends to fluctuate around 15-25%. Anecdotally as well I know there are a good number of applicants interviewed for each spot.

Not saying it's impossible, but it is very difficult. That's why I caution locking yourself into a PhD to try and improve your chances for radiology, because even then it won't be a surefire shot. Getting to know the right people certainly does help a lot, and would probably put you ahead of a good number of applicants, but after that you still need to compete against anyone else doing the same thing (and also do well on the interview). If you were applying for pathology/family medicine it would be less competitive (though still challenging).