Grades...

[Guest RXK]

hello all,

 

my sister will be applying to canadian medical schools shortly, and she has asked me to post this question for her. her overall gpa is not impressive by any means due to a lacking first year, but her last three years were 3.84, 3.92, and 3.90. she has pretty standard volunteer work and ECs: e.r. volunteer for several years at two different hospitals, volunteer at a geriatric facility for a few years, soup kitchens, tutoring, and other odd volunteer positions, she was a member of 3 student organizations (1 strong leadership position), and a few other clubs. she also has 2 summers of research (no publications or abstracts), 1 summer working at a hospital, and another summer of work at various places. as well, she has awards as being on the dean's list, etc. additionally, her mcat score from last august was 35R. lastly, she has graduated with high distinction (barely b/c of her low first year gpa) from an ontario university.

 

BUT, she is extremely worried about her first year marks (very low), especially of a particular grade which is very much below par... if you get my drift.

 

also, we are aware of the different criteria for the ontario schools such as of queens and western which may only consider her last two years' gpa for consideration. but, she still would like to know what her chances are of acceptance (which i know none of us can accurately predict), with such poor grades in first year (esp. with one very low mark) to any of the ontario schools.

 

basically, is there a possiblity that she could be forgiven for her poor start in light of her other achievements?

 

btw, she is an ontario resident.

 

Thanks, in advance, for any input!

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

Based on her MCAT performance and her last three years' grades (assuming she took 5 full courses in each of those years), she has a strong chance at Western, Queen's and Ottawa. At each of those schools, the first year will be irrelevant in the selection process. Her chances at UofT and McMaster are a little more challenging to predict since we don't know how she actually fared in first year, and both of those schools will factor that first year performance into their academic calculations.

 

Wish her some good luck from the board.

 

Kirsteen

[Guest CTU24]

Different schools have lots of systems to calculate GPAs that tend to minimize problems in first year.

 

At U of T, if you take a full courseload each year than after 4 years of school they will drop your 4 worst credits when they calculate your GPA...that will pretty much eliminate a bad first year.

 

At Ottawa, your fourth year is multiplied by 4, 3rd year by 3, etc. to calculate your GPA. So, your first year means little.

 

The other Ontario schools also likely have a way to deal with a problem GPA...whether it be a low GPA minimum of the best year system.

 

Regardless, if your sister is dedicated to medicine I wouldn't let one bad year stop here from applying. GPA is only one part of the application, and she has good MCATs, ECs, and life expereince from your description. I would DEFINITELY apply to as many schools as possible...in fact, the worst thing you could do is not apply...she should be reasonably competitive if the other parts of her application are as strong as you describe.

 

Best of luck,

 

CTU24

[Guest Gill0927]

I can speak pretty well on this subject, because in a lot of ways you may have been describing me there...

 

I was in a similar situation, with exceptional 2nd, 3rd, and 4th years in an Ontario University but a horrible 1st year. In my case, I ended up taking a break after 1st year, switching universities, and starting 2nd year after a year off, and I explained this and all my reasons why in my interview. My ECs were good, but not outstanding (in my opinion) but I was very genuine and passionate about the few that I had. My MCAT was 32S and I graduated with an honours Bachelor of Arts. Hardly the typical road to med school, huh?

 

Anyway, what ended up happening? Well, this year was my first year applying. I applied to all Ontario schools as well as Dal. I was rejected pre-interview from McMaster and Dal, but granted an interview at the other 4 Ontario schools. I was subsequently placed on the good waiting list at Ottawa, and waiting lists at all three other schools I interviewed at (U of T, Western, and Queens). I understand that 4 waitlists, at this point, is pretty good for a first time applicant.

 

So that's my situation, and what happened. I hope it helps your sister.

 

Gill

[Guest UofT Student]

The new Northern Ontario Medical School has made it a policy to only count grades from 2nd, 3rd and 4th year. They ignore 1st year marks. It might be worth a look.

[Guest aneliz]

UWO looks at best two years only...they do NOT look at any other years....meaning that they don't exist as far as UWO is concerned.

[Guest RXK]

thanks for everyone's quick reply!!

 

just a few last things to add: she is a resident of toronto, and had kept 5 full equivalent courses for every year of her undergrad....

 

i was wondering if it is the same for queen's and ottawa, regarding what aneliz has said on the behalf of western?

 

also, regarding mac, my sister (seemingly) has reconciled that fact that it is very unlikely she will be even granted an interview there. as well, as for UotT, i suppose they will drop all four credits from her first year. lastly, we will be looking into northern also.

 

thanks, once again for everyone's help around this time (im sure many of you know exactly how anxious my sister must be feeling, and myself for that matter)

 

RXK

[Guest physiology]

CTU24,

 

I think U of T drops the worst full course from each year, as opposed to the 4 worst full courses from your entire undergrad.

 

That's how I interpreted what they said on the website.

[Guest coastal79]

I think Queens just looks at your cumulative, however, the cutoff this year was 3.62. After meeting the cutoff, it doesn't come into play again.

[Guest Ollie]

Queens will take your cumulative or your last two years, which ever is better.

[Guest peachy]

Physiology, I interpreted it the other way - the worst four courses overall. There is a discussion about it here, where the conclusion is that they do drop the worst courses overall, even if they are all from the same year.

 

Oddly enough, that's a post from RXK as well

[Guest noncestvrai]

Peachy is so peachy...:b

 

noncestvrai

[Guest CTU24]

This info is from the U of T website:

 

GPA will be calculated eliminating one full course grade per full year of study. Students applying after completion of three years of study will have their lowest 3 full course equivalent grades removed from the GPA calculation, after completion of four years their lowest 4 full course equivalent grades, etc. This calculation is designed to encourage students to take demanding, advanced courses which advance their education during their undergraduate years.

 

Now, it's open to interpretation. But I still agree w/ peachy that it is your worst grades that are eliminated no matter the point in your university career.

 

Hope this clears things up.

 

CTU24

[Guest physiology]

Okay gotcha! I agree with you now. I probably read the first sentence of your quote CTU24, and probably stopped reading (Probably too disheartening for me because I was hoping they'd eliminate your worst 3/4 full courses, but then, they do!)

 

BTW, UBC has three separate calculations to get your academic score RXK.

 

1) Pre-req average (no GPAs at UBC, hooray!)

2) Overall-all average

3) Last 60 credits (ie. 20 full courses or 40 half courses)

 

From what I've seen, in that sense, UBC may partially forgive that bad first year. Moreover, when you keep the percent system of calculating your average, a 45% can be masked by a 90%. So, a percent system works to your advantage when you have one extremely low grade.

 

That said, this year, only 28 out of the 544 interviews were given to OOP.

 

Hope that helps.

Physio