Anyone doing a PhD/MD combined program?

[Guest rebel spirit]

Is anyone doing a PhD/MD combined program at a Canadian university, or have you ever considered it? How is such a program generally viewed? What are the advantages and disadvantages of such a program?

 

I will be applying for medical school this summer - I've been totally excited about it since I made the decision! I'm currently working on a research project, and I've been given the opportunity to turn it into a PhD. It seems silly to pass this up since I'm doing the work anyway.....

 

I enjoy research work, and I enjoy writing papers. However, a huge part of me remains unfulfilled sitting in front of a computer all day. The humanistic nature of medicine appeals to me. So, in many ways, doing BOTH the PhD and MD sounds like a good way to go.

 

However, I've got questions:

1. Does applying to a joint program help or hinder your chances of getting into medical school?

2. How does this affect tuition? Does PhD funding apply to med school as well?

3. Is the workload manageable?

4. If, for example, one alternates grad school years with med school years, and therefore must join a new med school cohort each year, how stressful is that?

 

Any advice at all would be mucho appreciated!

 

Cheers!

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

For quite a while I considered going through with an MD/PhD program (and applied to a few of them), so I can answer some of your questions. Although there are a few Canadian medical schools that offer a custom-tailored option for tackling the MD/PhD most take the following approach to deliver the curriculum: 1) complete the first 2 (non-clinical) years of medical school; 2) begin and complete the PhD during which clinical skills courses are often offered; 3) return to medical school to complete the final clerkship year(s). Therefore, most schools will not require that you re-join numerous medical school classes during the MD/PhD program--generally, you only need to do this once.

 

Advantages and disadvantages: there are a few of each for completing an MD/PhD versus an MD only versus an MD followed by a PhD during residency. One disadvantage to the MD/PhD program might be the relevancy of the subject matter to your future clinical work. That is, if you haven't yet decided on the clinical field in which you'd like to work then when you complete the PhD it might be in an area which will be different from the clinical path that you ultimately take which might be less ideal than the following option. That is, if you complete the PhD during residency then there is a higher chance of correlating your clinical and research activities, which might strengthen your application to fellowship programs if you desire to enter one. There are many other advantages and disadvantages to each approach though, and the programs will probably ask you about these when you interview, so you should gather more information on this.

 

Generally, applying to a joint program will not affect your chances of getting into medical school unless you are an out of province applicant applying to a school such as UBC (where, in the past, you were automatically considered within the in-province applicant pool). Generally, the MD admissions process at most schools is separate from that of the PhD admission process and you need to be acceptable to both bodies in order to be accepted to an MD/PhD program.

 

Yes, some schools will offer PhD funding during the years of medical school.

 

Cheers,

Kirsteen

[Guest peachy]

My answers below refer to U of T only; I don't know how things work at other schools!

 

1. Does applying to a joint program help or hinder your chances of getting into medical school?

Neither. You need to be accepted to medical school independently of the MD/PhD process to be admitted to the MD/PhD program.

 

2. How does this affect tuition? Does PhD funding apply to med school as well?

Tuition for all years of the MD/PhD program is a blended tuition that is the average of grad school + med school tuition. So if you take four years to do your PhD, the total cost is exactly the same as having paid for four years of medical school and four years of grad school. Funding applies to all years of the program, starting from January of 1st year (although funding is less during that first year).

 

3. Is the workload manageable?

The degrees are basically done separately (by the vast majority of students in the program, anyways). You leave after December of 2nd year to be a full-time grad student, and then continue grad school until you finish your PhD. Since there (pretty much) isn't any work done concurrently, there's no extra workload beyond what other med students or grad students do.

 

4. If, for example, one alternates grad school years with med school years, and therefore must join a new med school cohort each year, how stressful is that?

Not too many people here do that ... but I really don't think it's terribly "stressful" even then. After all, was taking lots of courses with different people very "stressful" during undergrad? And there's your MD/PhD cohort that doesn't change too much.

[Guest ploughboy]

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Hey there,

 

Another thing to think about is applying into MD/PhD after you've been accepted by a med school. At least this year at UWO (the school I'm most familiar with), first year students were invited to apply to the programme by Dec 1. I know some people were kicking the idea around, but I haven't heard whether they were successful or not.

 

There's one MD/PhD guy in my class who did most of his PhD in the three years before starting med school this fall. There's another guy who started med school but will take three years or so between pre-clinical and clinical years to do his doctorate. Then in autumn 2010 he'll join the class of 2012. Those of us who will be graduating in 2009 are already looking forward to bossing him around on the wards when he's a clerk and we're residents!

 

As well, there is precedent at UWO for students going off to another university to complete a PhD in the middle of med school. One of the class of 2006 went to Oxford for 3 years between 2nd and 3rd year and did a PhD. I have only met him briefly, so I have no idea how much arm-twisting and politicking that involved, nor what sources of support he had. Point is that it can happen if you really want it to. I imagine other schools are similar.

 

And of course, doing an MSc or PhD in residency is not uncommon and as Kirsteen mentioned, will mean that your area of research and your clinical practice will be closely related.

 

pb

 

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