Question About Finding A Supervisor

[dreamformed]

Hi everyone,

 

I have decided to do a masters and I am in the process of doing some research on the programs of interest to locate a supervisor.

 

I have searched this forum and have found some useful tips and things to keep in mind when looking for a supervisor but I have another question that I could not find an answer to through my search. I hope that the grad students on this forum can help me out.

 

Many current and former grad students state that it is a good idea to look into the publication track record of the potential supervisor and also check if the grad students in their lab have publications. I am finding a bunch of profs that I would want to work with (in terms of the research interest) and I have also done a search on pubmed to see their publication track record. However, most of them have no website of their lab and I can't find any information on how big their lab is (is terms of number of grad students), who their grad students are (so I can't find out whether the grad students are able to publish anything) etc.

 

I know that I could possibly just contact the profs now to ask if they are taking in grad students and if they are, I could talk to the grad students when I go to meet the prof or something. But I am looking into applying to schools are are not in my city/are far away....so I might not be able to go in person to check out the lab unless I am really sure about it.

 

Did anyone else come across something like this when locating a supervisor? Any suggestions on what I should do in this situation? Any other suggestions or comments about finding a supervisor would also be appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[dreamer]

I'm not a grad student, but I worked in a research environment for quite some time in undergrad. But I do understand your frustration in trying to find some information about a lab. Why don't you try emailing the professor and ask if you could have the contact information for some of his or her graduate students? My prof always gave out our contact info for future students.

 

The student is probably your best contact, since they know realistically what gets done in the lab and generally has more time to talk about their own experiences. And you can generally tell if they're overly bitter or really excited about their position...

[PhD_Candidate_2011]

Finding a supervisor can be a daunting task! Many (undergrad) students are firmly set on the general area they'd like to commence grad work in, but even then there a so many PIs to choose from. The best way about this is in fact what you mentioned already - get in touch with the prof in person and tour their lab and meet and talk to current students/postdocs in the lab. There really is no substitute for this. If you're looking to do research outside of your current school/city, then your best bet is to pick someone who is well established in the field (publication record is the best track of this, but not always). Such PIs are more likely to also have an up-to-date website with lots of information.

 

Many smaller labs and new PIs don't have webpages or have webpages that aren't very informative. Some established PIs will even take care of your travel/visiting expenses to interview and tour their lab, if you contact them and articulate your interest in joining their labs (in such cases, they'll want to make sure in advance you have strong marks, have research experience and committed to your interest to join the lab; they might even ask for reference letters in advance).

 

Ultimately, the most important advice I can give you is to pick a lab that works on something that truly interests you (or else research can get frustrating very quickly). The tenure and productivity of the PI is also important as it ultimately reflects on your future success. Afterall, grad school is a steppingstone to other careers (posdoc, industry, PI, or even med school), and thus you want to do well in grad school. Doing well in research-based grad school is not about getting high GPAs, but by publishing papers and where you publish them.

 

Best of luck!

[leap87]

I agree with the other 2 posts above mine. I just wanted to add: make sure to check how much funding your potential supervisor has received in the past. Not to sound like a gold digger or anything, but you want to make sure that your supervisor is going to be able to provide you with some funding. What do I mean by this?

 

Well, thus far, I've had the experience of working in 2 different labs at 2 different universities. Both supervisors are great. However, one of them is just becoming big in the field; the other is well established. While I worked with the one that is becoming big in the field (and I'm still working with him), I learned quite a bit from him, but in terms of funding, even though he had grants, it wasn't enough to cover conference expenses, poster printing, new programs that I'd need to use (such as SPSS, Matlab, etc.) When I started working with the well established prof, he ended up paying for all of the software I would need to use or even try out; he covered all of the expenses in terms of conferences for his both grad and undergrad students; he also covered poster printing (which btw costs $100 if you go to Staples - ton of money for a grad student). He never seemed uptight about the money and he put in money into the projects. That's not to say that my other supervisor didn't put in money into projects - hell, we've got a brand new lab with brand new equipment based on his grants... However, he never had enough for his students and I ended up spending more money than I was earning.

 

So, something to think about. Obviously, you want to choose a supervisor based on your research interest (VERY important - if you're not interested in the research, grad school will be hell for you), but grants are also important.

[dreamformed]

Thanks Dreamer, PhD_Candidate_2011 and leap87!!

 

PhD_Candidate_2011 - I am exactly in the situation that you described...I feel so overwhelmed at this point because I feel like there are so many PI's to choose from. Although, I don't really have my mind set on a concrete thing that I would like to study. I do have a general idea of the areas that I would like to consider but I don't have a firm mindset on it because I feel that what I will end up doing is dependent upon so many factors like funding, availability of a supervisor, acceptance into the grad program etc.

 

leap87 - Thanks for the response! I know that its important to make sure that the supervisor has enough funding but how do I find that out if they have no website of their lab? There are a few professors I found and the only thing I could find about them was a small blurb about their research in the faculty list. I then did a search on pubmed to look up their publications. I also tried to search for them on the web but had no luck in finding any specific information about their lab.....is it better to keep looking and find someone else who has a website and one that I can find more information about? How do you find out is a supervisor is established in the field or not?

 

Also, when looking at the publication record, what are some things to keep in mind - should I focus on the number of publications they have? the journals they have published in? etc....what kinds of things should I be looking for when I go through the list of publications?

 

Thanks so much!!

 

dreamformed

[PhD_Candidate_2011]

Thanks Dreamer, PhD_Candidate_2011 and leap87!!

 

PhD_Candidate_2011 - I am exactly in the situation that you described...I feel so overwhelmed at this point because I feel like there are so many PI's to choose from. Although, I don't really have my mind set on a concrete thing that I would like to study. I do have a general idea of the areas that I would like to consider but I don't have a firm mindset on it because I feel that what I will end up doing is dependent upon so many factors like funding, availability of a supervisor, acceptance into the grad program etc.

 

leap87 - Thanks for the response! I know that its important to make sure that the supervisor has enough funding but how do I find that out if they have no website of their lab? There are a few professors I found and the only thing I could find about them was a small blurb about their research in the faculty list. I then did a search on pubmed to look up their publications. I also tried to search for them on the web but had no luck in finding any specific information about their lab.....is it better to keep looking and find someone else who has a website and one that I can find more information about? How do you find out is a supervisor is established in the field or not?

 

Also, when looking at the publication record, what are some things to keep in mind - should I focus on the number of publications they have? the journals they have published in? etc....what kinds of things should I be looking for when I go through the list of publications?

 

Thanks so much!!

 

dreamformed

 

I'd definitely weigh the quality of journals published in more than the shear number of publications. In research, it's one thing to be a prolific publisher, but another to be an impact scientist. The latter is all about where you publish. In the life sciences, the journals that everyone aims to publish in are Nature/Science/Cell and the variants thereof (e.g. Nature Medicine). There are literally 1000s of journals to publish in, but only about 1% of these journals are actually substantial and considered "prestigious".

 

One way to find out if a PI is established is by looking at just how many "prestigious" publications they've had in the last 5-10 years or so (put a search filter in pubmed to only bring up certain big journals). Another way, is to ask current profs at your school about other profs they could recommend in the city you'd like to do grad work in (as scientists, we go to conferences and meetings all the time and are familiar with who's who and so asking like this is a good way). As in all things, networking is the key!

 

Also, if you're looking into a city/school like Toronto, worrying about funding is something you do not need to be concerned with. In all the medical science grad departments at UofT, all students are guaranteed funding (~$24,000/year) and 99% of the PIs are loaded with cash/grants. Of course, this is only at UofT and certainly not the case at smaller universities as alluded to by the poster above.

[leap87]

I'd definitely weigh the quality of journals published in more than the shear number of publications. In research, it's one thing to be a prolific publisher, but another to be an impact scientist. The latter is all about where you publish. In the life sciences, the journals that everyone aims to publish in are Nature/Science/Cell and the variants thereof (e.g. Nature Medicine). There are literally 1000s of journals to publish in, but only about 1% of these journals are actually substantial and considered "prestigious".

 

One way to find out if a PI is established is by looking at just how many "prestigious" publications they've had in the last 5-10 years or so (put a search filter in pubmed to only bring up certain big journals). Another way, is to ask current profs at your school about other profs they could recommend in the city you'd like to do grad work in (as scientists, we go to conferences and meetings all the time and are familiar with who's who and so asking like this is a good way). As in all things, networking is the key!

 

Also, if you're looking into a city/school like Toronto, worrying about funding is something you do not need to be concerned with. In all the medical science grad departments at UofT, all students are guaranteed funding (~$24,000/year) and 99% of the PIs are loaded with cash/grants. Of course, this is only at UofT and certainly not the case at smaller universities as alluded to by the poster above.

 

Really, eh? You get 24,000$ per year? Is this for Master's or Ph.D.? Because as far as I know, they've cut the funding down, unless they didn't do that at UofT?!

 

I would disagree with "smaller universities" comment though. To give a couple examples: I interviewed at McMaster university and the only thing the PI was interested during this interview is how much funding I'm going to get - ie did I apply for CIHR, NSERC? Actually, that's what kind of turned me off that supervisor because it alerted me that they don't have enough funding. They even said that the funding has been cut, so even more cause for concern.

 

I also interviewed at Waterloo, where I am right now. It's a smaller program, smaller university but all of the leaders in my field are here. Simply put. Not only that, the supervisor I'm with gets tons of grants (like I've mentioned previously). He's not the only one though. Actually, most of the profs at Waterloo get a substantial amount through grants. But they also publish a lot.

 

Anyway, I agree with the rest of the above post. Profs at your university should know names as soon as you start tossing them. That's what I did - I asked my 2 supervisors about potential supervisors I was looking into and searched for a) them saying "why would you go work for them?" or they're awesome! If you ever get a chance to work with them, go for it. Also, some grad students at your uni should know names as well.

 

However, it's also important to find someone who is a good fit for you. Just because they get tons of grants doesn't mean they're friendly and want to teach you something during those 2 years. So, I'd interview with everyone that seems interesting and then make my choice. Some people may seem amazing and they are, but no matter how you turn it, you just don't click. Thus, you won't be able to work together and there will be clashes = the last thing you'd want as a grad student.

[PhD_Candidate_2011]

Really, eh? You get 24,000$ per year? Is this for Master's or Ph.D.? Because as far as I know, they've cut the funding down, unless they didn't do that at UofT?!

 

I would disagree with "smaller universities" comment though. To give a couple examples: I interviewed at McMaster university and the only thing the PI was interested during this interview is how much funding I'm going to get - ie did I apply for CIHR, NSERC? Actually, that's what kind of turned me off that supervisor because it alerted me that they don't have enough funding. They even said that the funding has been cut, so even more cause for concern.

 

I also interviewed at Waterloo, where I am right now. It's a smaller program, smaller university but all of the leaders in my field are here. Simply put. Not only that, the supervisor I'm with gets tons of grants (like I've mentioned previously). He's not the only one though. Actually, most of the profs at Waterloo get a substantial amount through grants. But they also publish a lot.

 

Anyway, I agree with the rest of the above post. Profs at your university should know names as soon as you start tossing them. That's what I did - I asked my 2 supervisors about potential supervisors I was looking into and searched for a) them saying "why would you go work for them?" or they're awesome! If you ever get a chance to work with them, go for it. Also, some grad students at your uni should know names as well.

 

However, it's also important to find someone who is a good fit for you. Just because they get tons of grants doesn't mean they're friendly and want to teach you something during those 2 years. So, I'd interview with everyone that seems interesting and then make my choice. Some people may seem amazing and they are, but no matter how you turn it, you just don't click. Thus, you won't be able to work together and there will be clashes = the last thing you'd want as a grad student.

 

Indeed, Master's students get $24,000 and PhDs get $25,000 guaranteed. When it comes to research, every other university in Canada (excluding UBC, U of Montreal and McGill), is a tiny spec (no offense, it's just how it is). McMaster has about 5% of the research capacity UofT does, so you really cannot compare UofT with anyone else in Canada (when you're talking research quality and research funding, UofT is in the league with US giants like Yale, but not Harvard or UCSF).

 

I can tell you that 99% of PIs at UofT (medical sci departments anyway) are fully funded and spare no expenses. If you look at the funding stats of agencies like CIHR and CCSRI, you'll see that UofT ranks up there far ahead of its peers. It really is the place to be in Canada for research. The same reason why their medical school also factors research experience into consideration, unlike any other school in Canada (except UBC again).

[neuronix]

i can confirm the 24,500 minimum stipend.

Mind you, you still need to pay tuition...so subtract about 7000 from that number and that is your net (non-taxed!!) income.

 

I know that other schools definitely don't give as much (personally know people at Western, Queens in my fields).

[BRD]

Dreamformed: You may want to start contacting the potential supervisors just to see if they are indeed taking students. When I was looking for a supervisor I had a long list of people I was interested in working with. After contacting them, my list was cut down to 2 - the others either didn't respond, were clearly not people I was going to get along with, weren't accepting new students, or didn't have funding (you wouldn't believe how many times I heard 'I'd love to have you, but...').

 

Another important thing if you are interested in medical school (which I assume you are...) is to discuss your desire to go into medicine with your potential supervisors. Some PIs will not take students who want to go into medicine because they think they'll ditch out of their grad degree. Others might have rules as to when they'll write you a reference letter (for example, one of the PIs I contacted said she would only write reference letters for med school after I had submitted my thesis).

 

It is completely acceptable for you to request the contact information of current students from potential supervisors if it is not offered. If a PI does not want you to contact his/her current students you should probably take that as a warning sign.