Subjective Assessment of Academics

[Guest BluePin]

I am doing some course planning for next school year, to improve my application should I not be successful this cycle. I am IP Alberta, but was not able to apply to either UofC or UofA this year due to bad marks from my first degree.

 

With another full time school year, I would be able to utilize Calgary's new "10-year rule" and eliminate my first degree from the GPA calculations.

 

My second degree has a 4.0 GPA over 21 courses in a variety of subject areas, during both part-time and full-time studies (including all of the standard "pre-req" courses as required by UofA or UBC). I don't expect that would change much next school year. After completing another 10 courses next school year, I would have two recent full-time, Sept-April, school years for UofC's assessment.

 

My MCAT is also decent with a 13 in verbal and 11 in both physical & biological sciences, but a lowly O in the writing sample. I have only written it once.

 

So my "numbers" should look ok for both the numerical GPA & MCAT screens. For the subjective academic assessment, I may be penalized for completing the second degree via distance ed (BSc Human Science via Athabasca University) or for having a poor (2.6) GPA from my first science degree. However, I can't do much about that, but I can try to ensure that I am not penalized on the basis of my upcoming course selection.

 

With the course selection, I'm trying to find a balance between personal interest, possible application to future medical career, the possibility to complete the courses quickly, and enough academic rigor so as to not be negatively assessed in the subjective academic category.

 

As I already have a career, the sole purpose of this second degree is to improve my academic standing for med school applications. The course work isn't applicable to my current field and doesn't really benefit me professionally.

 

If you are a current or hopeful future UofC med student, what would you look for if you were asked to "subjectively assess" an applicant's academic capabilities?

[astrogirl]

Hi BluePin,

 

This may not be what you want to hear, but I really think you shouldn't base your decision about what classes to take on what anyone on this forum or elsewhere has to say. The only people that can answer your question with any kind of credibility are the actual assessors, and they're probably not allowed to talk about it. I am a current UofC student (or at least you think I am - I could be some random creep living in my mother's basement , although I'm not very anonymous on here so you can be pretty sure I'm legit!), but that doesn't mean my opinion is anything more than an opinion. With that being said, let me give you some hopefully helpful advice!

 

First, with a 4.0 in your second degree and a decent MCAT score, you have a decent chance of eventually getting in somewhere in Canada. It sounds from your post like you got interviews this time, and that's a good sign. You might not get in this time because as much as some people who did get in on their 1st or 2nd try don't like to admit it, there is a bit of luck involved. There has to be because so many people are qualified. The cut off score out of 100 for our class last year was something in the high 60s/low 70s, which means that the 170 or however many of us got in all had scores between about 70 and 100. That's a lot of scores that are really close to each other, and if someone missed getting off the wait list by a fraction of a point or even a couple of points, that doesn't mean they weren't good enough or that they need to drastically change their application for next time. They just need to keep trying. There are people in our class that applied 5+ times before they got in. My point here is that it sounds like you are probably a good applicant, and if you don't get in, the most important thing you can do is keep trying. Not every good applicant will eventually get in, unfortunately, but all you can really do is keep trying until you decide you don't want to try anymore.

 

Now I just want to address your concerns about Athabasca and your low 1st undergrad GPA for a minute. First of all, I don't think it looks bad (although this is just my opinion) to have done a degree through distance ed. I think it looks like you are independent and have intrinsic motivation. And Athabasca is a legitimate university with a very good reputation. It's not like your getting some random online degree. Now your 2.6 GPA. I had a 2.9 GPA in undergrad. Something I did, probably my grad work but I don't really know for sure, obviously made up for that. So it's not impossible to overcome that.

 

Now for what courses you should take. I really don't think you should take too much advice from anyone on this. I'm making such a big deal about this because I got a lot of well-intentioned but very bad advice from people when I decide I was going to try to apply to med school. People know what worked for them or what worked for someone they know, so they decide that that's what everyone needs to do and that's what they tell you. But that's only what worked for them. I really think that there are a million ways to get it right and only a handful of ways to get it wrong (all of which should be fairly obvious). My PhD in astrophysics probably helped make up for my low undergrad GPA and probably helped me get in, but that doesn't mean everyone should go out and get a PhD in astrophysics. That would be crazy. What people don't realize is that telling people to do really specific things or take certain courses (other than prereqs for various schools) is equally crazy, even if it doesn't sound like it is. Seriously, people were coming out of the woodwork telling me that I wouldn't ever get in because I hadn't done X, Y, and Z. And they were all wrong.

 

I think that what matters is having things on your application that are obviously important to you. You're taking extra classes to help your GPA, so take classes that are interesting and useful because that way you'll be able to do well in them. It sounds like you have come up with a really good framework for picking your classes. You'll probably get some replies telling you that you HAVE to take certain classes, but don't do that unless they sound legitimately interesting to you. Good luck to you, and I hope that was a bit helpful even though it wasn't exactly what you were looking for!

 

tl;dr - Keep trying if you don't get in and don't listen to people who insist that you have to do things a certain way.

[kylamonkey]

BluePin- regarding Athabasca, in Dr Walker's podcast from last fall he actually specifically states that they regard correspondence courses to be a mark of a self-motivator. So it contributes positively to your subjective review.

 

Second- too bad you aren't at TRU- you're looking at many of the same courses I am for next year. LOL!

[Guest BluePin]

I really think you shouldn't base your decision about what classes to take on what anyone on this forum or elsewhere has to say. The only people that can answer your question with any kind of credibility are the actual assessors

 

My own words coming back to haunt me?! I agree. My thinking was that some (many?) of the biased opinions I would receive would end up being the same biased opinions looking at my application as student reviewers in two years. So hearing some external perceptions might be useful?

 

This may not be what you want to hear... You might not get in this time because as much as some people who did get in on their 1st or 2nd try don't like to admit it, there is a bit of luck involved.

 

It's only not what I wanted to hear, because I'm trying to ignore the luck aspect! I realize that luck is a (significant?) factor in this process, if only in how different reviewers will relate to, and therefore rank, the non-numerical aspects of an application. I'm just trying to trick myself into some level of confidence that another year of full-time undergraduate work will actually result in a positive outcome!

 

I need some motivation for the effort and expense involved!

 

Thanks for the comments and reality check.

 

regarding Athabasca, in Dr Walker's podcast from last fall he actually specifically states that they regard correspondence courses to be a mark of a self-motivator. So it contributes positively to your subjective review.

 

Thanks, I didn't know that.

[kylamonkey]

I should probably just reply that I don't know for SURE that it would be a positive, it's just what I gleaned from the podcast in the fall. I would highly recommend you listen to it, as it gives a lot of info.

http://podcast.med.ucalgary.ca/groups/facultyofmedicine/weblog/41682/Admissions_for_Applicants.html

[OttawaURookie]

Yeah but there might be a difference if you did some courses through correspondence or if you did your whole degree online. I'm not sure but does he make it clear in the video?

[kylamonkey]

Yeah but there might be a difference if you did some courses through correspondence or if you did your whole degree online. I'm not sure but does he make it clear in the video?

 

No, he doesn't, but do you know what it takes to do a whole degree online, never meeting a professor, not having any strict deadlines, and waking at 6am to go to the library to read textbooks all day every day? There is far less guidance than there is in a regular in-class program. It's no walk in the park.

[OttawaURookie]

No, he doesn't, but do you know what it takes to do a whole degree online, never meeting a professor, not having any strict deadlines, and waking at 6am to go to the library to read textbooks all day every day? There is far less guidance than there is in a regular in-class program. It's no walk in the park.

 

oh. I don't disagree with you at all, I was just curious if anyone knew the answer.

[eternalkeener]

I actually find online courses easier because I can make my own schedule. I think it depends how well you work on your own and how motivated you are. And yes, it is definitely a challenge if you can't meet your professor in person or regularly (i.e. you have to make a specific appointment which may not be right away). I would try taking more than one online course at the same time and see how it feels for you.