sprinkles Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 Hello all, So I am pretty new to the whole research thing and have been reading up on a bunch of stuff through the research discussion forum. I have a general idea (of most things) now (I just love pm101! lol). I have been thinking about doing research but since I come from a non-science background I am finding it to be a bit difficult. From what I have read in the forums research is not at all required for med school but is nice for 'bonus marks'. I've also been able to conclude that it is rare for undergrads to get published, and that publishing in general comes down to luck? (could someone verify/explain this?) So here is my situation...I was talking to the daughter of a family friend we have and we started talking about school and such. I asked her what she was majoring in etc and she said she is getting a MSc. SO, seeing this as an opportunity I asked her if she needed any help? a volunteer? At first she seemed to think it wasn't a good idea (from her reaction) but then she was like wait...yah...I think you would be good! Your background might actually come in handy...(she isnt the best at writing reports and such). SO she said yah sure! So I got pretty happy, we briefly discussed what she is working on (health products related) etc etc. However, now I am starting to wonder if I should be getting paid? From the way she was explaining it they need a LOT of help...and I know you can get research positions and get paid for them in the summer too. However, I dont want to give up this opportunity either. She emailed me asking my availability and for my cv etc, so I emailed her and said I would be available 'full time' for the summer if I could get paid somehow, and part-time as a volunteer (because I'll need to work part time somewhere else and make some money during the summer... life of a student ) She replied that her prof has no budget even for his grad students! (apparently she isnt getting paid either.... she said she applied to a scholarship and if she gets it she would pay me a bit?) She said she would mention it to the prof anyways and asked how much I want to get paid?(My past jobs have been in the $18-21 range but I guess she wont be able to pay that) Or if I work full time but volunteer 4 hrs/day work 4hrs/day etc etc.....she seems to reallyyy want to get me on board (apparently its a lotttt of work) so I'm not sure what to do. Do you guys think it would be worth it? I'm not sure I would want to spend my entire summer on this (was planning on doing volunteering and MCAT stuff etc too) however I think it would look good on an application? And I'm not sure how many research opportunities one could get with a LEGAL background Also she had mentioned earlier (very briefly) that she might give me credit when the paper is published? Is this any good? Grad students papers *always* get published right? gahhh....I sooo don't know what to do. Any incite would be much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tooty Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 No, grad students, espeically MSc, don't always publish. In fact, it is considered a grand achievement to publish one paper during the MSc. If you're putting in your time for free, you should demand that your name be on the paper. Otherwise, it's a complete waste of your time. They don't _have_ to include your name, but nor do you have to volunteer for them. Is she even close to wrapping up her experiments and writing a paper? You should keep your options open at this point and look for other opportunities. If all else fails, go help her out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axialpac Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I personally would take it, as long as it is not a permanent position. Do it for the summer, gain some research experience (that you could put on your CV + you'll gain references) and then apply to paid research positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cass Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 Hello all, So I am pretty new to the whole research thing and have been reading up on a bunch of stuff through the research discussion forum. I have a general idea (of most things) now (I just love pm101! lol). I have been thinking about doing research but since I come from a non-science background I am finding it to be a bit difficult. From what I have read in the forums research is not at all required for med school but is nice for 'bonus marks'. I've also been able to conclude that it is rare for undergrads to get published, and that publishing in general comes down to luck? (could someone verify/explain this?) By luck, this just means that it depends on what your project is, who the supervisor/graduate student you are working with is and do they publish frequently ec? For instance, you happen to get an opportunity to do research in a lab where the PI publishes a lot and frequently = you might have a better shot in getting your name on a paper than a lab that's not very "active". Also, starting up a project rather than jumping into a current one can also dictate if you will have a chance to get your name on a paper. I've been told that it's better to be a part of an ongoing project rather than starting a brand new one (but this also depends on the nature of the project = for example, a few of my peers and I started a new research project in evolutionary biology and we were fortunate enough to get publishable results that led us to attend conferences both provincially and internationally) So here is my situation...I was talking to the daughter of a family friend we have and we started talking about school and such. I asked her what she was majoring in etc and she said she is getting a MSc. SO, seeing this as an opportunity I asked her if she needed any help? a volunteer? At first she seemed to think it wasn't a good idea (from her reaction) but then she was like wait...yah...I think you would be good! Your background might actually come in handy...(she isnt the best at writing reports and such). SO she said yah sure! So I got pretty happy, we briefly discussed what she is working on (health products related) etc etc. However, now I am starting to wonder if I should be getting paid? From the way she was explaining it they need a LOT of help...and I know you can get research positions and get paid for them in the summer too. However, I dont want to give up this opportunity either. She emailed me asking my availability and for my cv etc, so I emailed her and said I would be available 'full time' for the summer if I could get paid somehow, and part-time as a volunteer (because I'll need to work part time somewhere else and make some money during the summer... life of a student ) She replied that her prof has no budget even for his grad students! (apparently she isnt getting paid either.... she said she applied to a scholarship and if she gets it she would pay me a bit?) She said she would mention it to the prof anyways and asked how much I want to get paid?(My past jobs have been in the $18-21 range but I guess she wont be able to pay that) Or if I work full time but volunteer 4 hrs/day work 4hrs/day etc etc.....she seems to reallyyy want to get me on board (apparently its a lotttt of work) so I'm not sure what to do. Do you guys think it would be worth it? I'm not sure I would want to spend my entire summer on this (was planning on doing volunteering and MCAT stuff etc too) however I think it would look good on an application? And I'm not sure how many research opportunities one could get with a LEGAL background Also she had mentioned earlier (very briefly) that she might give me credit when the paper is published? Is this any good? Grad students papers *always* get published right? gahhh....I sooo don't know what to do. Any incite would be much appreciated From your post, I'm assuming you don't have previous research experience? I would think it'd be best to just volunteer part time rather than getting paid for several reasons: 1) it kind of gives you the opportunity to test the waters in what research is like. If you're getting paid, I'd think that this becomes more formal and serious (not that I'm saying volunteering isn't serious work) and you might have less flexibility in your other plans 2) You say you also plan on doing MCAT and volunteering and i know MCAT takes quite a bit of time so again, volunteering in a lab might be more flexible for your summer schedule. 3) I'm not sure if grad students ALWAYS get published and if they do, it also depends on how long their project is going to take etc. I started out purely volunteering in a lab doing basic things (ex; DNA preps etc) and then eventually decided to do a fourth year thesis. And yes, publishing in undergrad is not expected of you because it is hard and does depend on luck. For instance, the lab I did in my 4th year thesis in doesn't publish frequently (the last time was like 2006?) vs the lab I worked in during my 3rd year is constantly churning out papers and I got lucky to be involved in a project that enabled me to get my name on a few posters/manuscripts (currently working on it). I think for the time being, perhaps just volunteer to see if you like research or not (because it sounds as if you are unsure?) and then decide from there. Hope this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinkles Posted April 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 No, grad students, espeically MSc, don't always publish. In fact, it is considered a grand achievement to publish one paper during the MSc. If you're putting in your time for free, you should demand that your name be on the paper. Otherwise, it's a complete waste of your time. They don't _have_ to include your name, but nor do you have to volunteer for them. Is she even close to wrapping up her experiments and writing a paper? You should keep your options open at this point and look for other opportunities. If all else fails, go help her out. Really? I thought you 'had' to publish for your masters? Huh...maybe I'm just confusing 'writing a thesis' vs 'publishing'. Now that I said it out loud I think that is what I was mixing up. Also, you mentioned me demanding to have my name put in there. Is it any use for med school and such if my name is on her paper if it is not published? she is supposed to be close. Its a 2 year program and she is planning on wrapping it up by the end of August. She said WORST CASE SCENARIO (as in she would be really upset if it happens) it would be delayed for another semester but she doesn't think that will happen. She seems to have had a lot of work done? But I think its a matter of 'putting it all together'....she has like 1000 parts but needs help putting it all together? Thanks for your input tooty Oh! and you said try to look for other opportunities...is it not too late to find someone at this point? Especially considering that I don't have a science background? :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinkles Posted April 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I personally would take it, as long as it is not a permanent position. Do it for the summer, gain some research experience (that you could put on your CV + you'll gain references) and then apply to paid research positions. the problem here is I am in my 4th year right now. I should be finishing my degree this summer (I might delay it to fall if there are some good opportunities) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinkles Posted April 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 From your post, I'm assuming you don't have previous research experience? Nope. No research experience. But I do have a lot of 'work' experience....I wasn't sure about medical school until late last summer and haven't really been looking for research until this term (and its quite late...I'm in 4th year right now :/) However I have a lot of work experience...I've worked in the House of Commons, worked as a building manager, worked as a TA for 2 years, and have had 3 different government jobs over the past 3 summers (each with different departments)...so its not to say I haven't done anything...just nothing medically related All this to say I have been used to getting paid well in the jobs I work and if not well, they have had a little bit of 'prestige' to them...looked good on the resume? At this point I don't know if this research would give me any 'prestige' (because it doesn't pay) I would think it'd be best to just volunteer part time rather than getting paid for several reasons: 1) it kind of gives you the opportunity to test the waters in what research is like. If you're getting paid, I'd think that this becomes more formal and serious (not that I'm saying volunteering isn't serious work) and you might have less flexibility in your other plans you bring up a good point the thing is I would be 'interested' in doing research but I know for a fact that I will never be interested 'enough' in research to do it career wise (even if its part time) If I don't see a career within research does that mean I shouldn't do this? :/ hmmm.... 2) You say you also plan on doing MCAT and volunteering and i know MCAT takes quite a bit of time so again, volunteering in a lab might be more flexible for your summer schedule. true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I personally would take it, as long as it is not a permanent position. Do it for the summer, gain some research experience (that you could put on your CV + you'll gain references) and then apply to paid research positions. This. and don't get your hopes up for having your name on the paper if there is any (unlikely for a MSc). Getting the experience and reference would be beneficial though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy_happy Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I volunteered with a PI 5 hours a week for entire year for free. But because I met her, she sponsored me for various awards, offered summer job, reference, etc. At the end, it was worth volunteering. Hello all, So I am pretty new to the whole research thing and have been reading up on a bunch of stuff through the research discussion forum. I have a general idea (of most things) now (I just love pm101! lol). I have been thinking about doing research but since I come from a non-science background I am finding it to be a bit difficult. From what I have read in the forums research is not at all required for med school but is nice for 'bonus marks'. I've also been able to conclude that it is rare for undergrads to get published, and that publishing in general comes down to luck? (could someone verify/explain this?) So here is my situation...I was talking to the daughter of a family friend we have and we started talking about school and such. I asked her what she was majoring in etc and she said she is getting a MSc. SO, seeing this as an opportunity I asked her if she needed any help? a volunteer? At first she seemed to think it wasn't a good idea (from her reaction) but then she was like wait...yah...I think you would be good! Your background might actually come in handy...(she isnt the best at writing reports and such). SO she said yah sure! So I got pretty happy, we briefly discussed what she is working on (health products related) etc etc. However, now I am starting to wonder if I should be getting paid? From the way she was explaining it they need a LOT of help...and I know you can get research positions and get paid for them in the summer too. However, I dont want to give up this opportunity either. She emailed me asking my availability and for my cv etc, so I emailed her and said I would be available 'full time' for the summer if I could get paid somehow, and part-time as a volunteer (because I'll need to work part time somewhere else and make some money during the summer... life of a student ) She replied that her prof has no budget even for his grad students! (apparently she isnt getting paid either.... she said she applied to a scholarship and if she gets it she would pay me a bit?) She said she would mention it to the prof anyways and asked how much I want to get paid?(My past jobs have been in the $18-21 range but I guess she wont be able to pay that) Or if I work full time but volunteer 4 hrs/day work 4hrs/day etc etc.....she seems to reallyyy want to get me on board (apparently its a lotttt of work) so I'm not sure what to do. Do you guys think it would be worth it? I'm not sure I would want to spend my entire summer on this (was planning on doing volunteering and MCAT stuff etc too) however I think it would look good on an application? And I'm not sure how many research opportunities one could get with a LEGAL background Also she had mentioned earlier (very briefly) that she might give me credit when the paper is published? Is this any good? Grad students papers *always* get published right? gahhh....I sooo don't know what to do. Any incite would be much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinkles Posted April 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I volunteered with a PI 5 hours a week for entire year for free. But because I met her, she sponsored me for various awards, offered summer job, reference, etc. At the end, it was worth volunteering. excuse my ignorance but whats a PI? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuturePT216 Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 excuse my ignorance but whats a PI? Principle investigator, so the main scientist who supervises the lab. Regarding your original post, I completely agree about the volunteering part-time. It'll give you a lot more time to volunteer/do MCAT while also getting the experience. I wish I could do research part-time this summer, but I have to complete a full-time position due to co-op, so it restricts a lot of the things I wanted to do in terms of ECs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy_happy Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 Principle investigator, so the main scientist who supervises the lab. Regarding your original post, I completely agree about the volunteering part-time. It'll give you a lot more time to volunteer/do MCAT while also getting the experience. I wish I could do research part-time this summer, but I have to complete a full-time position due to co-op, so it restricts a lot of the things I wanted to do in terms of ECs! Same here. I work full time in the lab, and I have no idea how to fit in my MCAT over the summer. I heard that MCAT is a full time job itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinkles Posted April 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 thanks for all the advice everyone I ended up emailing her back that I would just do it part time. hopefully its the right decision lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1234 Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 Same here. I work full time in the lab, and I have no idea how to fit in my MCAT over the summer. I heard that MCAT is a full time job itself. Depends on what courses you've done to date. The MCAT is a joke if you did first year physics x 2, chem x 2, orgo x 2, and some general bio courses. If you haven't then its a lot of work trying to learn that stuff from scratch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy_happy Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 Yeah, I am just finishing up Ochem this year. Both Chem, Bio, and Physics are fresh in my mind from 1st year, so am I in good shape? I think I would have to do essay and some reading comp, but other than that, I think I am kinda prepared. Depends on what courses you've done to date. The MCAT is a joke if you did first year physics x 2, chem x 2, orgo x 2, and some general bio courses. If you haven't then its a lot of work trying to learn that stuff from scratch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuturePT216 Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 Depends on what courses you've done to date. The MCAT is a joke if you did first year physics x 2, chem x 2, orgo x 2, and some general bio courses. If you haven't then its a lot of work trying to learn that stuff from scratch. That's what I've heard as well. Sucks that I left it till after 3rd year and without taking physics. But hopefully it works out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
future_doc Posted April 22, 2012 Report Share Posted April 22, 2012 Depends on the person, I did not find it a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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