holiday1001 Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 ohhh I get it. I assure you our class is very diverse in that regard selection bias- the volunteer population is just a small sampling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savac Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 I really liked the curriculum and I'm looking forward to this!!! Good job MAC! (I'm very biased lol). Hehe, I knew you would love what you saw! I also agree that I wish we knew more about the regional campuses, but I suppose that's my own fault for not asking them after the presentation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applemanv3 Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 ohhh I get it. I assure you our class is very diverse in that regard selection bias- the volunteer population is just a small sampling. I completely agree with holiday1001, there is a TON of diversity in the class. The sampling today was a tiny one. I was there helping and hope you all had a blast. Good luck ahead! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojjanhorse Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 ohhh I get it. I assure you our class is very diverse in that regard selection bias- the volunteer population is just a small sampling. yeah, it was clear to me after I saw the video that the Class of 2015 made. I suppose I could have felt more welcomed if I saw a greater diversity from the very beginning. Even in my interview group (group of 10 interviewees), and the 2 group leaders, were either caucasian or oriental. I stopped by my friend's place who is currently studying for his licensing exams at Mac (3rd year), he assured me that it was (like you said) selection bias. I don't usually let such scenarios bother me, but I don't know... it left a bad taste in my mouth. I just expected A LOT from McMaster, that's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holiday1001 Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 unequal volunteerism rates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkourParkour Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 caucasian or oriental. Just letting you know that the labelling of individuals of east Asian descent as "oriental" is pejorative. To borrow a quote from The Big Lebowski, "Asian is the preferred nomenclature." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehumanmacbook Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 I completely agree with holiday1001, there is a TON of diversity in the class. The sampling today was a tiny one. I was there helping and hope you all had a blast. Good luck ahead! WUTTTT I MISSED YOU APPLEMAN???? yeah, it was clear to me after I saw the video that the Class of 2015 made. I suppose I could have felt more welcomed if I saw a greater diversity from the very beginning. Even in my interview group (group of 10 interviewees), and the 2 group leaders, were either caucasian or oriental. I stopped by my friend's place who is currently studying for his licensing exams at Mac (3rd year), he assured me that it was (like you said) selection bias. I don't usually let such scenarios bother me, but I don't know... it left a bad taste in my mouth. I just expected A LOT from McMaster, that's all. Now that you mention it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralk Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 yeah, it was clear to me after I saw the video that the Class of 2015 made. I suppose I could have felt more welcomed if I saw a greater diversity from the very beginning. Even in my interview group (group of 10 interviewees), and the 2 group leaders, were either caucasian or oriental. I stopped by my friend's place who is currently studying for his licensing exams at Mac (3rd year), he assured me that it was (like you said) selection bias. I don't usually let such scenarios bother me, but I don't know... it left a bad taste in my mouth. I just expected A LOT from McMaster, that's all. People of European or Southeast Asian ancestry make up a huge proportion of Canada's population - it's entirely natural that they would be the dominant ethnicities at med school interviews. Honestly, past those groups, South Asian and First Nations are really the only ethnic groups that make up a significant chunk of the population. We like to think of Canada as being very ethnically diverse, and while we are, some ethinicities have far greater representation than others in our country. Remember that there's a bit of a numbers game involved in who you meet at your interviews - you're looking at a small sample, so even on chance you might only see the more common ethnicities before account for selection bias. And please keep in mind that the individuals you see can't change their ethnicity to make you feel more welcome; I certainly hope the way they treated you was welcoming though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froston Posted March 24, 2013 Report Share Posted March 24, 2013 LOL @ someone glancing at the tiny sample size of volunteers and remarking that the lack of diversity was disappointing. Like, what? How does someone even think that in the first place - let alone assume it is representative of the class as a whole, and turn it into a concern? Thinking too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojjanhorse Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Just letting you know that the labelling of individuals of east Asian descent as "oriental" is pejorative. To borrow a quote from The Big Lebowski, "Asian is the preferred nomenclature." Nothing wrong with using the term oriental. It's a metonym. How else was I suppose to refer to only to the oriental without including the rest of bloody Asia? Remember that there's a bit of a numbers game involved in who you meet at your interviews - you're looking at a small sample, so even on chance you might only see the more common ethnicities before account for selection bias. And please keep in mind that the individuals you see can't change their ethnicity to make you feel more welcome; I certainly hope the way they treated you was welcoming though! really? I thought that they could There is an element to being surrounded with a diverse group. That in itself is an inherit welcoming vibe. Thanks for the condescending comment. At no point did I say that the students who did volunteer did a poor job. LOL @ someone glancing at the tiny sample size of volunteers and remarking that the lack of diversity was disappointing. Like, what? How does someone even think that in the first place - let alone assume it is representative of the class as a whole, and turn it into a concern? Thinking too much. forum: (noun) a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged. So now we are made fun of and LOL'ed at for expressing our feelings and views ? You're entitled to your opinion and I am to mine. I'm simply expressing how I felt. First impressions are long lasting. I consider myself an open minded person and if I were to feel like this today, I'm sure there are others who have felt like this as well and are too reserved in expressing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froston Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 forum: (noun) a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged. So now we are made fun of and LOL'ed at for expressing our feelings and views ? You're entitled to your opinion and I am to mine. I'm simply expressing how I felt. First impressions are long lasting. I consider myself an open minded person and if I were to feel like this today, I'm sure there are others who have felt like this as well and are too reserved in expressing it. Well, you expressed a silly opinion. Silly things make me laugh, as they do for most people. If you want to overlook the illogical nature of your opinion and use it to formulate a (likely) fallacious view of the school, then that's fine. It's your right to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkourParkour Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Nothing wrong with using the term oriental. It's a metonym. How else was I suppose to refer to only to the oriental without including the rest of bloody Asia? were you educated in the UK or a British-derived education system? Also: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/oriental?q=oriental Also, edit: did you just describe someone as "the oriental"? wow. now that's problematic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojjanhorse Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 were you educated in the UK or a British-derived education system? Also: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/oriental?q=oriental Also, edit: did you just describe someone as "the oriental"? wow. now that's problematic. way to represent mcmaster there bud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkourParkour Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 way to represent mcmaster there bud. by pointing out racist language and giving you opportunities to learn about alternatives that aren't so problematic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savac Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 To me, the diversity of academic backgrounds is more important, especially for a program that relies on group work as extensively as Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojjanhorse Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 So you're telling me that the numerous consult letters I have read which were written/dictated by well known physicians and had the term "oriental" were also being racist? There are scientific journals that have the term oriental slapped all over. This generation is so uptight with their word choice that it inhibits them from being themselves and transparent. If I were a McMaster med student, I would keep in mind that everything I say is a reflection of the student body. When you speak, you speak for the mass. Look at Dr. Henderson, you can learn a thing or two from him. I would have loved to have had this conversation with you in person. To me, the diversity of academic backgrounds is more important, especially for a program that relies on group work as extensively as Mac. That's what I love about Canada. I place McMaster on a pedestal for it's approach to medicine and for revolutionizing the norm. I look forward to PBL groups because I will not only learn medicine, I will also encapsulate my mind about the person... their religion, culture, their experiences. This country we live in is so damn rich and never falls short of diversity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkourParkour Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 So you're telling me that the numerous consult letters I have read which were written/dictated by well known physicians and had the term "oriental" were also being racist? This generation is so uptight with their word choice that it inhibits them from being themselves and transparent. If I were a McMaster med student, I would keep in mind that everything I say is a reflection of the student body. When you speak, you speak for the mass. Look at Dr. Henderson, you can learn a thing or two from him. I would have loved to have had this conversation with you in person. Many "well-known" (see: older) physicians use racist terms for individuals compared to the modern lexicon. It's a vestige of when/where they were trained. I've corrected a couple of attending physicians on their language choices and both times, the corrections were well-received. And if by being "themselves and transparent" you mean racist and ignorant to the realities of Canadian society, then maybe they shouldn't be themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojjanhorse Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Many "well-known" (see: older) physicians use racist terms for individuals compared to the modern lexicon. It's a vestige of when/where they were trained. I've corrected a couple of attending physicians on their language choices and both times, the corrections were well-received. And if by being "themselves and transparent" you mean racist and ignorant to the realities of Canadian society, then maybe they shouldn't be themselves. Wow. Just WOW. You have a good night champ. Hope you are proud of yourself. I truly have nothing else to say to you. This generation is in doom with the likes of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkourParkour Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Wow. Just WOW. You have a good night champ. Hope you are proud of yourself. I truly have nothing else to say to you. This generation is in doom with the likes of you. I think that's a bit of an over-exaggeration... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holiday1001 Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 someone call a plumber.. even a plunger can't save this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojjanhorse Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 someone call a plumber.. even a plunger can't save this thread na, I'll stop. No need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehumanmacbook Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SupBrah Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Wow. Just WOW. You have a good night champ. Hope you are proud of yourself. I truly have nothing else to say to you. This generation is in doom with the likes of you. Yah, you probably want to reconsider your attitude... Regardless of whether Parkour was being offensive (which I believe he wasn't trying to), or whether you took offense to his statement... I really don't think you should completely disregard his opinion on the matter. Rather, you could inquire more about what learning experiences has got him to strongly disagree with you. At least that's more of the MacMed way of doing things. It's unfortunate because it seems like from other posts you enjoyed the MacMed interview experience. Wouldn't want your thoughts of Mac to be negatively influenced by what is posted in this thread. But like you said, "I would keep in mind that everything I say is a reflection of the student body". You wouldn't want others thinking that you and those you are associated with to think that everyone is unreceptive to criticism. Chances are, you will be accepted to one of the schools you interviewed at... at that becomes your new student body. fyi: East Asian is the preferred term. I've seen the term "oriental" taken negatively by patients and family in clinic. It may be that this generation is "uptight" with their word choice... or just that individuals may have had negative experiences associated with that vocabulary... maybe say in their childhood and something along the lines of bullying. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralk Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 really? I thought that they could There is an element to being surrounded with a diverse group. That in itself is an inherit welcoming vibe. Thanks for the condescending comment. At no point did I say that the students who did volunteer did a poor job I apologize if my comment came out condescending - it was not intended in that way in the slightest. I was simply trying to express the viewpoint that the manner in which you were treated while at McMaster is more important than the ethnic makeup of those you met. Obviously I did not convey the sentiments I meant to, so again, I apologize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthesticks Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 had a great time at mcmaster yesterday, wish i could have stuck around for the speeches/video but i had to catch a flight home! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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