Grades

[Guest Bourne]

Are the first two pre-clinical years at U of M graded solely on P/F? What about honours? Do they provide class rank of any sort? Otherwise, it seems to me that maybe we only have to pass the first two years and what it really counts for residency matching is when we get to the clinical years...

[Guest ManitobaMed]

Hey Bourne,

 

From what I understand, the U of M has no honours, just pass/fail; therefore, although we'll be aware of our percentage marks on tests, etc., they will not appear on transcripts. It seems unlikely that a class rank would be provided as it would negate the value of the P/F system. Also, while technically it seems we "only have to pass" years 1 and 2, I'm pretty sure marginal performance on multiple occasions will not go unnoticed. . . and I'd really rather not find out the hard way.

 

I'm pretty sure residency matching is based largely on clerkship evaluation (letters of reference, etc) regardless of which Canadian med school one attends, but maybe one of the current med students -- from the U of M or otherwise -- could shed more light on this.

[Guest Bourne]

Hey ManitobaMed,

 

Yeah sure one should in no way be aiming at "marginal performances"... but what I was saying was although somebody might have scored the highest mark on an exam and would have totally aced the class, his or her performance would definitely go unnoticed given the lack of a quantitative measurement. So it doesn't really matter. I believe this system greatly favours non science major, although it does promote self-directed learning and cooperative effort among students.

 

have you gotten your books yet? I'm thinking of getting mine in the states so that I can avoid paying exorbitant sale taxes.

[Guest ManitobaMed]

Hey Bourne,

 

I've purchased one book so far -- "Doing Right", the ethics book. It's a very interesting read. I'm working in Ontario right up until the Friday before o-week, so I'll probably wait until I arrive home to purchase the rest. The last thing I need to be doing is hauling even more stuff Manitoba-ward with me -- I'm still trying to figure out what to do with the now useless math and chemistry textbooks that are currently occupying my bookshelf. Selling them isn't a possibility because they're out-of-date. Has the world of multivariable calculus really changed that much in the past 4 years??? :rolleyes

 

Aren't items purchased Stateside taxed as they come through the border? I've never ordered anything from the US, so I have no clue...

 

And now back to the P/F system...

 

I'm not sure how the P/F system favours non-science majors. Within any group of people (i.e. science majors, arts majors, business majors, etc.), one expects to find a wide variety of personalities, communications skills, and other intangibles that could affect performance in clerkship evaluations. The P/F system in years 1 and 2 makes these years what they *should* be -- the years to develop the knowledge and skills necessary for work on the wards. Whether this development has occurred will, in all likelihood, rapidly become apparent during clerkship. To be perfectly honest, having had *extensive* experience as a patient, I'd rather have the resident who consistently scored in the 70s and 80s in years 1 and 2 but has demonstrated that he understands his limitations and has the ability to relate to his patients than the one who scored consistently in the high 90s on written examinations but has shown signs of being, to use a horribly vague descriptor, a bad doctor. ("Bad doctor", in my experience, encompasses a wide variety of problems, from insensitivity, to obvious lack of confidence, to carelessness, to extremely poor communication skills, to incompetence in making diagnoses.) Between the two who show equal, solid performance on the wards but who had unequal year 1 and 2 results, I'd feel comfortable choosing either one.

 

As to the assertion that excellent performance in years 1 and 2 would go unnoticed, I'm inclined to disagree. Although only P/F appears on official transcipts, students and profs/preceptors *are* aware of actual performance in numerical terms; therefore, these years are still the earliest opportunity to impress.

 

Are you an in-province applicant? If so, where are you from? If not, where are you from?