Extracurricular Activities - Advice and Suggestions Needed!

[Guest hopefulmedstudent]

Hi everyone, I am new here and I have been reading the message board for the last few days. All I have to say is that this place owns!

 

I was hoping if everyone could help me out. I plan to apply to med school in several years. My marks are not my main concern, but volunteering and extracurricular activities are. I just don't know if the amount and type of extracurriculars are good enough to make me a competitive applicant. Currently, I am working in a research lab during this summer. I volunteer at a local hospital (only my second month, but I will continue in the long run) and a community centre helping youth. I tutor elementary students with their school work and I am a frosh leader for first year students. Finally, I participate in 2 intramural sports. I know this doesn't sound too spectacular.

 

Anyway, I would definitely appreciate any advice, comments, and suggestions. Thanks for your time!

[Guest coastal79]

Sounds like a great start!

 

I found that participating in competitive bocce was the best way for me to exercise my killer instinct, earn brownie points for med school, and meet some sexy older women!

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

Do you have any hobbies or interests that you'd like to develop a little more? If so, a start would be to take one of those and delve more deeply into it. You could join a related club, or a team if it's a physical activity.

 

Some admissions committees seem to like to see evidence that you've had some exposure to the life of doctors, and thus, have a good idea of what the career is about. You can gain this type of experience from certain types of extracurricular activities, such as volunteering in a hospital, or sometimes, research. However, in terms of general types of extracurricular activities, I don't think the admissions committees have specific favourites. It seems that they simply like to see that you have interests outside of the field, i.e., that you are a decently-rounded individual. Mind you, if you can come away from those experiences with additional life lessons learned, e.g., teamwork, leadership, working harmoniously with others, etc., then all the better.

 

Cheers,

Kirsteen

[Guest codloghorn]

i think what you are doing now sounds fine. i believe u of t and ottawa are more concerned with marks than anything else. so extracurricular activities would not make a difference, unless your gpa is low - and even then, i don't think extracurricular activities would make a difference. mcmaster is one of the only medical schools in ontario that gives an extreme importance to extracurricular activities, life experience, etc. i am not sure about western and queens.

[Guest coastal79]

Queens places a strong emphasis on ECs. If you make the GPA and MCAT cuts, 50% of whether you get in is your interview (ie the more you've done, the more you have to talk about) and 50% is their evaluation of your extracurrics and the short essays you write (opportunities to show off your ECs). I've spent the last year trying to make up for the fact that I didn't do a whole lot of organized, quantifiable EC activities during my undergrad. It's worth it to get it right the first time around.

 

Oh, and bocce isn't really too fun. Just do what you love. Being active in sports is good, higher level sports are better. Have you thought of martial arts? (my new love, have to promote it!) It is very quantifiable and earning a "black belt" or something equivalent in 3 or 4 years is certainly doable. Shows a high level of sporting achievment, and even bad athletes, if they dedicate themselves, can eventually achieve their goals in MAs. Kirsteen is right about getting exposure to the medical community. I was asked about that in two of my interviews this year. Hospital volunteering is good, keep at it, and maybe look into shadowing a doc once a month or something. My family doc offered to let me do that and, stupid me, I passed up the opportunity. If I did undergrad again, I would volunteer at the hospital throughout, so that I had one volunteer opportunity that showed long term committment, and change other volunteer jobs every year or so, just to get exposure to different areas.

[Guest Steve U of T]

I think Ottawa eliminates a lot of candidates based on their detailed autobiographical sketch pre-interview, so the emphasis on ECs is not insignificant there.

[Guest Koppertone]

I think the important thing to have is variety. I did the volunteering in a hospital like just about everybody else here. But I also did a number of interesting jobs, research, and did things that I just found entertaining (ie. mountain biking and hiking). Try getting some full time jobs in the summer through either a coop or with research grants (ie. NSERC). If your average is over 80% like just about everybody else on this board, an undergraduate NSERC grant is a shoe in (which is about $6500 - tax for the summer). If I had to improve on one aspect of my application though, I would have had more patient interaction. I have a young friend who is just entering university, and his main concern is he thinks that "people are too young to begin volunteering in 1st year", to which I respond, "that's when you take the entry level volunteer jobs". I knew competition for med was high when I lived in Kamloops, but when I moved to Vancouver I suddenly saw that I was at a real lack for experience. If I had started volunteering in the basic parts of the hospital (ie gift shop) when I started, I would have been able to have had way more rewarding positions by 4th year university. Instead I was really cutting it close. Not to say that I volunteered JUST to apply to med, but let's face it, hospital volunteering or something related is pretty much the status quo for applicants now.

 

But most of all, make sure you have fun with the new experiences that you have, because there is nothing worse than working with a volunteer who doesn't care about what they're doing and only want a reference.

[Guest hopefulmedstudent]

Thanks everyone for their responses! I have learned a great deal from them.

 

Kirsteen and coastal79, I am actually involved in a sports club - the fencing club (it you can consider fencing to be martial arts?!).

 

The only dilemma that bothers me still is that I have an image of a perfect student who is able to get great marks, do many ECs, travel to third world countries to volunteer, is part of some student body council at the university, etc. This might be an obvious question to ask, but are many med students like that?

[Guest codloghorn]

i doubt it - well, at least not the third world part.

[Guest sweetstuff25]

whoaa, that's crazy extra curriculars. good job! i've wasted my life :\

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

The only dilemma that bothers me still is that I have an image of a perfect student who is able to get great marks, do many ECs, travel to third world countries to volunteer, is part of some student body council at the university, etc. This might be an obvious question to ask, but are many med students like that?

Most of the people that I met in this year's interview gathering spots were often quite exemplary with formidable achievements and life experience. Since classes of medical students are taken from these groups of people then yes, I'd say that it may be de rigeur for many medical students to be outstanding individuals. Another indication of the quality of the folks who get in: ask a current medical student what their classmates are like. They often seem to extol the virtues of their colleagues.

 

So where is your dilemma if you have many extracurricular activities, etc.? I don't see that you'd have one unless you are participating in all of these things without passion or motive other than to look better on a medical school application. :rolleyes

 

Cheers,

Kirsteen

[Guest hopefulmedstudent]

So where is your dilemma if you have many extracurricular activities, etc.? I don't see that you'd have one unless you are participating in all of these things without passion or motive other than to look better on a medical school application.

 

Kirsteen,

 

Please don't be mistaken, I am certainly not doing these EC's for the sake of med school. I definitely enjoy what I do, but it's just that I know there are people out there that are doing alot more than me, and that causes uncertainty. But I guess no matter who an applicant is, he or she will feel uncertainty as well, so I guess that I should just deal with it.

[Guest Koppertone]

I think it's natural to feel that you're not doing enough, but don't be too hard on yourself. I've always felt that I've been way behind other students in EC's and experience, and in a lot of ways I have been. However as long as you can tell stories about the things that you HAVE done and look confident in your desires, you should be able to get an acceptance at some point.

[Guest codloghorn]

let's take a person who went to a third world country prior to going to medical school. it is most probable that this person went to volunteer in this third world country because he/she wanted to have a better chance at getting into medical school. when coming back from this third world country, he/she will claim that the time spent there was "wonderful," or "fantastic." now you have to think, would you like sleeping in a tent, lacking water/food? of course not. in most situtations, this person did not have a good time, and went to a third world country just to have an extra item to put on his/her CV.

 

my point is: there are not a lot of people willing to go to a third world country. however, there are a lot of people in leadership positions with a lot of research experience. even so, i have heard of people who got into medical school without volunteering anywhere. i have heard of even more who got in with no research experience. so, in my opinion, you should concentrate on having a good GPA and MCAT score, and then worry about extracurricular activities. as they aren't as important as people claim. one can spend 30 minutes alone in a medical school interview talking about volunteering in a hospital. quantity is not as important as quality.

[Guest marbledust]

codloghorn your post is just a tad bit too cynical for me

 

let's take a person who went to a third world country prior to going to medical school. it is most probable that this person went to volunteer in this third world country because he/she wanted to have a better chance at getting into medical school.

 

That's a pretty big generalization. Speaking to my classmates who have volunteered in developing countries it's fairly obvious which ones went because they truly wanted to make a difference and those who went only to pad their CVs. I've come across extremely few people in the second category. People often go into medicine out of a sincere desire to help people - the same reason people go on such volunteer trips.

 

in most situtations, this person did not have a good time, and went to a third world country just to have an extra item to put on his/her CV.

 

Some do, but most don't. See above.

 

even so, i have heard of people who got into medical school without volunteering anywhere. i have heard of even more who got in with no research experience.

 

I don't think having zero volunteer experience at all will help your application. Most schools want to see at least some minimal exposure to health care volunteering. If two applicants are fairly equal in everything else (grades, mcat), that volunteer experience may give you the edge for an interview or spot in the class.

 

so, in my opinion, you should concentrate on having a good GPA and MCAT score, and then worry about extracurricular activities. as they aren't as important as people claim.

 

You need to concentrate on being a well-rounded applicant, which is what the schools want. Most applicants are going to have good grades and mcat scores. It's the extracirrcular activities and reference letters which help you stand out and get noticed. Every school uses a different formula to grant interviews. Some stress extracirriculars, including volunteering, more than others. But they all take them into consideration at some point in the application process.

 

one can spend 30 minutes alone in a medical school interview talking about volunteering in a hospital. quantity is not as important as quality.

 

This is very true. Quality is far more important than quantity for extracirriculars and volunteeer experience. But again - the admissions committees want well rounded applicants. They like to see applicants that can balance life inside and outside the classroom, and they want to see interests outside of "getting into medical school."

 

I do think it is better to find a few activities to involve yorself in than a whole pile of things. It's true you can spend 30 minutes talking about volunteering in a hospital, but it will probably be a problem when the interviewers ask about any other interests you have/activities you are involved in.

[Guest codloghorn]

i believe medical school are looking for well-rounded people. but it is not absolutely necessary.

 

and to address your comments about going to third world countries:

i cannot believe that a person going to a third world country could have a good time. it is not possible. although it depends on the developing country - sleeping in a tent for months at a time is not enjoyable. lacking food and water alone would make a person miserable. the loss of sleep because of these terrible conditions would also make a person miserable. psychologically, it is IMPOSSIBLE for someone to enjoy his/her trip to a third world country. by taking someone away from the luxuries of the western world, it would be very difficult to adapt to a different situation.

now, saying a trip to a third world country is fantastic, what is that supposed to mean? that one enjoyed watching people live in poverty? no, to me, that is not fantastic. a person could not possibly say that such a trip was fantastic, let alone good. visiting the third world country is NOT ENJOYABLE. even the experience of such conditions is not favorable.

it is possible that people go there to help people, but these people DID NOT have an enjoyable time.

to conclude, visiting the third world is not enjoyable. but it is nice padding for a CV.

and if that is cynical, so be it. :b

[Guest Teemster]

Wow,

 

Codloghorn, you've obviously never been to a "third world" country. It would be quite extreme to "sleep in a tent for months at a time", or to lack food and water. And, loss of sleep is much more endemic to the developed world.

 

I do not feel that it is "IMPOSSIBLE" for anyone to enjoy a trip to a "third world" country. It may be impossible for a person such as yourself...a person so inextricably attached to Western "luxuries". For those of us whose psychological wellbeing is not attached to material wealth to such an extent, a month spent in a developing country being of use and making a concrete difference, is much more rewarding, satisfying, and dare I say "enjoyable" than a whole lifetime of wallowing in luxury.

 

Really, buddy you have GOT to take a trip to India, Kenya, Bolivia, etc. before you make such extreme generalizations.

 

Teemster

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

it is possible that people go there to help people, but these people DID NOT have an enjoyable time.

I'm not sure if you meant to sound so absolute, perhaps as a result of your experience solely with individuals who have traveled to developing countries, that have not had enjoyable experiences. However, there are often exceptions to seemingly absolute statements. I respect your opinion, however, I hope you don't mind if I strongly disagree with you and present a couple such exceptions.

 

My boss (a burn surgeon) annually takes ~10 weeks from his clinical schedule in Toronto to travel to Southeast Asia and East Africa to perform surgery in remote communities that are definitely among those considered to be "developing". He is not a man who seeks luxury; instead, he leads a fairly simple, unfrilled life, and seems to revel in the personalities whom he meets. As such, upon returning from his trips he shares story upon story of the locals whom he encounters and often befriends. My overall impression is that he garners great benefit from these experiences abroad: not only can he make a small contribution to the communities starved of surgeons, but he takes great pleasure from the new people he has encountered. I would say that he very much enjoys his trips to developing countries.

 

On a more personal note, last November I had the opportunity to stay and do some work in Kampala, Uganda. Uganda is considered to be a developing nation. Even though Kampala is Uganda's capital and considered to be a fairly sizeable city, many of the townspeople seemed to live in homes that were far from what I'd see here in Toronto.

 

There were definitely hardships there before I arrived and some which I experienced myself. However, a "time" is what you make of it and wholly how you perceive it. Truthfully, I was a little unsure of what I'd find once in Kampala, or what the level of crime would be, for example. However, one of the strongest perceptions that I left Uganda with were of its people. Aside from when I biked and hiked through Northern India, rarely have I met a population of people who were, in general, so warm and gentle. Truly, I loved that about Uganda. In short, I enjoyed my experience there from the point of view that I learned much and met some wonderful individuals.

 

Toronto is currently my home, and I enjoy many relative luxuries here. Although I do not feel at this point that I would establish a home in Kampala, I feel quite comfortable with the thought that I can travel to at least a few developing nations, find wonderful things there, and enjoy many of the opportunities and experiences that these countries offer.

 

Cheers,

Kirsteen

[Guest marbledust]

i believe medical school are looking for well-rounded people. but it is not absolutely necessary.

 

It is necessary to be well-rounded - good grades and mcat scores alone will not get you into medicial school. There are plenty of people with high gpas and mcats who didn't get into med school who attest to this.

 

i cannot believe that a person going to a third world country could have a good time.it is not possible.

 

Well most aren't going to "have a good time" as you put it. They are going to make a contribution and to help people. Some people actually do find value in offering their skills and resources to make things better, as shocking as that might sound.

 

sleeping in a tent for months at a time is not enjoyable. lacking food and water alone would make a person miserable. the loss of sleep because of these terrible conditions would also make a person miserable. psychologically, it is IMPOSSIBLE for someone to enjoy his/her trip to a third world country. by taking someone away from the luxuries of the western world, it would be very difficult to adapt to a different situation.

 

As somebody who has spent time in a developing country, I can tell you that most people don't mind putting up with these inconviences because, as mentioned above, they have come to make a contribution - that is more important than a comfortable bed or gourmet meals.

 

now, saying a trip to a third world country is fantastic, what is that supposed to mean? that one enjoyed watching people live in poverty? no, to me, that is not fantastic. a person could not possibly say that such a trip was fantastic, let alone good. visiting the third world country is NOT ENJOYABLE. even the experience of such conditions is not favorable.

 

You are missing the point - people don't undertake such activities for enjoyment, they do it in order to contribute and help others. Knowing that you have made an effort and may help make things better for people is where the satisfaction comes from. I know people who go on such trips every year - something makes them go back repeatedly. It isn't to sightsee and enjoy themselves.

 

it is possible that people go there to help people, but these people DID NOT have an enjoyable time.

to conclude, visiting the third world is not enjoyable. but it is nice padding for a CV.

and if that is cynical, so be it.

 

hmmm...nobody here suggested it was "enjoyable" - your posts are the only ones to use this word.

[Guest codloghorn]

teemster, kirsteen: obviously, there are different living conditions in various third world countires. but in general, these visits are not supposed to be pleasurable.

[Guest codloghorn]

marbledust: i have heard several people claim visting a third world country was enjoyable. it might not have been on this board, but i have heard several people make this claim - including kirsteen in the post above.

[Guest Teemster]

Codloghorn,

 

I'm not suggesting that it is "pleasurable" to watch people live in poverty. I'm suggesting that it is better to acknowledge that poverty exists, that people live under horrific conditions, and to try and relieve some of that burden from the shoulders of those who bear it, than to sit here in luxury and pretend that we bear no responsibility for suffering elsewhere. I think it's important for physicians to have a global perspective. That's all...

 

Teemster

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

i have heard several people claim visting a third world country was enjoyable.

This seems to contradict your post which elicited so much response where you stated that such visits were impossible to enjoy. Perhaps you were unconvinced that these people had an "enjoyable" time? Onwards and upwards.

 

Cheers,

Kirsteen

[Guest codloghorn]

no, it doesn't contradict any of my former posts.

Perhaps you were unconvinced that these people had an "enjoyable" time

that is my point. i'm not saying that it is wrong for people to go to third world countries and help. it is nice that people want to help. but i don't think an "enjoyable" time can be had while in poverty-stricken conditions.

[Guest marbledust]

Let me follow your logic here codloghorn - if people claim a visit to a developing country was "enjoyable" they must be lying?

 

Re-reading my own posts, I must clarify that while one may not go on such trips for the same pleasureable reasons they go to places like Hawaii, I do actually think they can be enjoyable. I don't know what you consider enjoyable codloghorn.

 

My trip to Bolivia 4 years ago was what I would consider enjoyable. I was able to help with the construction of houses and a clean water project. The sleeping and meal situations were less than "ideal", but nobody in my group of 12 complained. It wasn't important. What was important was the opportunity to offer something tangible to the people of Bolivia through our skills and labour. Working beside Bolivians, learning about their culture, experiencing the beauty of the land was a priceless experience. I saw some crushing poverty and many heartbreaking things, but I also saw and experienced a lot of joyful things.

 

When I came home I had many wonderful memories as well as a different perspective on myself and life in Canada. It was an enjoyable trip. I would go back on a similar trip in a heartbeat. Given the choice between two weeks laying on the beach doing nothing, I would rather be somewhere making a contribution.

 

You should try it codloghorm, you might be surprised...