"Preclinical electives" at UWO

[itimebomb2]

Does anyone know what the difference is b/t the clinical and "preclinical" clerkship electives at UWO that they offer students who haven't done their core yet?

[ellorie]

I've not started at UWO yet, but based on talking to 2014s and reading the website, I believe they call the preclinical ones "observerships," they are optional, and they don't have to be long term - i.e. you could just follow a doctor in a speciality for one day and call it good.

 

Also, I think that in a 3 year program like McMaster, the pre-clerkship electives involve more responsibility and patient care than an observership at UWO.

 

Interesting question. Hopefully if I am wrong, someone can correct me and I will learn something.

[Darla]

I've not started at UWO yet, but based on talking to 2014s and reading the website, I believe they call the preclinical ones "observerships," they are optional, and they don't have to be long term - i.e. you could just follow a doctor in a speciality for one day and call it good.

 

Also, I think that in a 3 year program like McMaster, the pre-clerkship electives involve more responsibility and patient care than an observership at UWO.

 

Interesting question. Hopefully if I am wrong, someone can correct me and I will learn something.

 

You've got it! The pre-clinical elective students will not have as many responsibilities as clinical elective students. This is the designation for students from other schools who have not completed their core rotation at their home school (i.e. if you do a psych elective in Sept. 2011 but don't do your core at UofT until Jan 2011, you'll be a preclinical student; if the opposite, you'll be a clinical student).

 

This was a system agreed on by the heads of the clerkship programs to ensure that students were getting the appropriate level of supervision and to make it easier for residents and consultants to know what to expect from the learner. (I was a member of this meeting, first hand information)

[itimebomb2]

Hm... that kinda sucks. Why would anyone come to Western to be a preclerk when just about every other school will let them be a clerk?

 

It makes sense to some extent if you have 0 clinical experience... but say you've done your peds/obgyn/surgery cores and a few electives in IM but not your IM core, shouldn't you be competent in doing a regular clinical elective?

[ellorie]

What do first and second year students generally do in observerships anyway? Do you literally just follow a doctor around, or is there any opportunity to help in any way? Either way, it's more clinical exposure than I managed to scrape together as an undergrad, so I'm just interested.

[Darla]

It makes sense to some extent if you have 0 clinical experience... but say you've done your peds/obgyn/surgery cores and a few electives in IM but not your IM core, shouldn't you be competent in doing a regular clinical elective?

 

Not necessarily - as an example, the history you take in Obs is quite different than IM, so are the meds, most of the orders you write, the expectations for discharge etc.

 

This doesn't mean that you won't get to do more than the average pre-clinical student if you display a steep learning curve. Some clinical clerks have fewer responsibilities for the opposite reasons.

[Darla]

What do first and second year students generally do in observerships anyway? Do you literally just follow a doctor around, or is there any opportunity to help in any way?

 

It depends on the doc you're working with. I've been on both ends of the spectrum. One experience had me doing all the follow up histories, analysing lab data and planning next clinical steps. Another had me so far from the operating table I couldn't see the patient.

 

I learned lots in both situations because I went into them with an open mind and was just happy to not be in the class room.

[holiday1001]

diggin up an old thread here but I'm seeking a little on this pre-clinical elective business:

 

will this affect what team/activities we're assigned to? ie clinics instead of in-patient stuff

 

if we show that we are comfortable performing at a level close to 'clinical' students, will we be allowed to function at that level, or are we resricted due to the pre-clinical label?

 

Not necessarily - as an example, the history you take in Obs is quite different than IM, so are the meds, most of the orders you write, the expectations for discharge etc.

 

This doesn't mean that you won't get to do more than the average pre-clinical student if you display a steep learning curve. Some clinical clerks have fewer responsibilities for the opposite reasons.