Some number for ya

[Guest Sparktacular]

Hey guys gals, I was just pondering some stuff sitting in orgo chem about admission numbers. Now Western you need a 3.65 in your best year, that alone with the MCAT requirement takes 1800 applicants and shrinks it to ~400, now the 1400 left behind will have no hope in hell of getting an interview with UofT because if they cant even hit a measley 3.65 in only one year there is no way their overall average is going to be 3.75+ for UofT. Moving along, Queens needs a 3.57 again 1600 applicants and they interview what? ~400 so again those who couldn't hit the MCAT requirements for Western or UofT wont hit them for Queens and wont be able to muster the meager 3.57 cutoff gpa. So as you see we have the same 400 applicants interviewing at UofT, Western, Queens....factor in Ottawa and Mac and pretty much everyone who hits the cutoffs will get placed I think the process seems scary because we have something like 1400 applicants who are basically the bottom feeders without a hope in hell, its just rare to have so many bottom feeders in any application process. So bottom line if you are putting in a reasonable effort and hitting the pretty easy cutoffs, you have an 80+% chance of getting

 

So dont get discouraged and get those good marks get with the creme of the crop and you will succeed!

[Guest Liana]

I'm not totally sure what it is you're trying to argue here. Are you trying to use stats to show that anyone who gets an interview has a more than likely probability of getting in? Not to sour your probability calculation, but there are a few things you have overlooked.

 

The 400 interviewed at Queen's aren't necessarily the same 400 at Western. More realistically, you probably have about a 60-70% overlap, but it's not as close as you think. Don't forget, of the 1600 who applied to Queen's, 400 of those met the 3.57 GPA cutoff, but just didn't have the MCAT scores; Western has lower MCAT requirements, and therefore you could have potentially another 200 or so students who didn't receive an interview at Queen's but perhaps made that 3.65 for Western.

 

While it is common practice to apply to 3 or 4 medical schools, some applicants DON'T apply to that many schools, whether that is because they're cocky, picky, or perhaps have researched their stats. If Queen's cutoffs have been 3.55+ for the past many years, then I don't know why some 400 students (of which at least 300 must have been significantly below this mark) bothered applying. Aside from lowering the median cutoff mark for the rest of us, had they done their research, they might not have wasted the $75 in applying.

 

In addition to this, you have many applicants who feel that they only need apply to one or two schools to succeed, and often, in Ontario, these two schools are UT and Mac. On the other hand, you might have someone who absolutely has to live in one particular city, and therefore only applies to that school.

 

I do agree that there are a fairly constant pool of applicants to the Ontario school; between Ottawa, UT, Queen's and Western, you probably have a pool of 800 different students. You do bring to mind an interest thought, though; it would be interesting if OUAC could compile the stats of the total number of students who are receiving interviews.

[Guest SheD]

~4000 students applied to Mac and Ottawa this year and ~3500 to the rest. MCATs are for all of America...so perhaps all of us Canadians are smarter than Americans and get 8+ scores (not that they do...but i could happen). That was fault #1. #2) I think Ottawa is interviewing ~400-500 students so 1 in 10 GET AN INTERVIEW at Ottawa. If they take 100 students that means OUT OF THOSE INTERVIEWED only 1 in 4 get in. You do the math. So, all in all, your thesis makes no sense.

[Guest JD]

I seriously doubt there were 4000 applicants to Mac or 4000 applicants to Ottawa this year. Last year the two schools had about 3000 and 2000 apps respectively. Not a small number at all, but still not close to 4000. In fact, last year there were only 3850 applicants in total to Ontario med schools! 10,000 applications in total, so that means about 2.6 apps per person on average. I don't see why that would change significantly this year.

 

I assume that most people who apply to Queen's would apply to Western as well (and vice versa) because their requirements are similar. So there should be quite a bit of overlap in terms of the interviewees at these two places. Same with the Ottawa and U of T intervieewes, since these schools have very high GPA requirements but lower (or no) MCAT requirements, and they also consider graduate applicants separately.

[Guest SheD]

A friend of mine has a friend who goes to Mac and said that they recieved ~4000 (maybe 3000 and something) this year for Mac. Apparently there was a huge protest there because Mac had to change their policies on who got an interview this year. Although not stated, they cut applicants who had taken 1st year courses in their senior years just so that they could somehow deal with the large numbers. I do beleive the numbers are lower for the universities requiring MCAT scores but even then, the scores required to get an interview have increased this year...suggesting either a lot of people are doing better, or they needed tighter standards to deal with increasing number of applicants. They do state on some of the responses the number of applicants...although they did not offer me these numbers they did tell my friend who got an interview at mac these numbers. I do beleive I am not mistaken in this but again, I did not get this information directly, so dont quote my numbers. My point was the original message was incorrect to assume such low numbers in applicants and little competition.

[Guest PeterHill0501]

There were 2039 applicants to Ottawa this year and 496 interviews granted. In 2001 there were 2100 applicants to Ottawa and 487 interviews were granted...which resulted in 111 first year students. The following table lists the number of students in first year meds (year 2001 at U of O) as a function of their grade point average:

 

Number GPA

 

70 3.7-4.0

24 3.4-3.6

8 3.1-3.3

5 0-2.6

0 0

4 non-convertible

 

The total number of first year students at U of O in 2001 was 111.

[Guest JSS02]

UWO had 1685 applicants this year, as quoted from their website. Queen's had around 1700 as well, from what I remember during their interview weekend. These are pretty close to the normal numbers of applicants...

 

I don't have concrete numbers for U of T or Mac, but perhaps some of the med students on these forums do.

[Guest SheD]

Thanks Peterhill0501 :> I was actually wondering about the exact numbers :> I was offered an interview with Ottawa and was figuring a one in 5 chance from here on in, which is close to what you have told me :> Its good to know...and to help you relax. I can deal with a 1 in 5 chance :>

[Guest bad hombre]

SheD,

 

I think you're the one that isn't making all that much sense.

 

3500 applicants that applied to western, toronto, and queen's? but there were less than 3000 in total for ALL FIVE SCHOOLS.

 

and what's this about MCAT's and americans? obviously, if there were tons of people out there with huge stats, western would be giving out a lot more interviews/ the cutoffs would be huge.

 

I'm pretty sure the original poster was right. How else do you explain the similar number of applicants at UofT, Western, and Queen's (1650+-100)?

 

From the people I've talked to they haven't applied because it's close to home or because of reputation. They apply to wherever they make the minimums. I think I only know a handful of people that KNOW you need 3.75+ to get into toronto, or that have researched the cutoffs for western and queen's. anyways, although i don't think 80% of the interviewees at these schools get in... it's over 50% for sheezy.

Everyone who's taking MCAT's applyed

[Guest cali]

Hi PeterHill0501:

 

Sorry for the dumb question

 

Where are the numbers from?

 

Is this really true: 8 got in with: 3.1-3.3 and 5 with 0-2.6?

 

Isn't that quite low? I thought there was a cut of for ottawa at 3.5 or so?

[Guest PeterHill0501]

Cali,

 

These are numbers that were given to us during an information session held on interview day. The admissions staff's presentation included some of the stats from 2001. I believe they called these ranges "converted averages". I assumed, perhaps incorrectly (?) that these numbers correspond to a grade point average. When we were filling out the OMSAS application there was a table which helped convert course grades into a weighted grade point average. I'm assuming that is what these numbers are. They also provided the following stats, in case they are of interest to the group:

 

Out of the 111 first year med students at University of Ottawa in 2001:

 

- 65 were female and 46 were male

 

- 100 were from in province and 11 were from out of province

 

- ages:

 

age range number

20-22 39

23-25 46

26-30 23

over 30 3

 

- academic background:

 

type number

 

arts & science 20

science 49

3

grad studies 21

other related arts 1

dentistry 2

physical & health

sciences 2

education 2

engineering 2

[Guest AniyaSG]

Maybe the ones who get in with low undergrad GPAs got in as grad students on the basis of their research work? Just my guess on it :/

[Guest PeterHill0501]

I think that's probably a pretty good hypothesis AniyaSG.

[Guest francois]

not to be anti-francophone, but I wonder if the average french-speaking successful applicant might have a lower GPA? I am thinking this because I heard there tends to be a higher ratio of acceptance for them.

[Guest cali]

PeterHill0501,

 

Thanks for the stats

[Guest PeterHill0501]

I wouldn't even go down this route. Why on earth would you hypothesize that francophones would have lower GPAs? I have heard from several sources, in fact, that francophone applicants have some of the highest GPAs.

[Guest from ottawa]

Francophone students do need lower GPAs to get interviewed at the University of Ottawa. I believe their cut off is 3.6 compared to 3.7 for in town applicants and even higher for oop.

BTW I applied to all 5 schools in Ontario because I did not know my MCAT results before I applied. I only got 2 interviews because I missed the MCAT cut for Queens and seriously though that people with a 3.7 average could potentially get an interview at U of T. That is my two cents on that theory.

[Guest PeterHill0501]

If you look at the numbers I posted for Ottawa (above) I think you'll see that a high GPA doesn't seem to be the sole contributor to getting in to med school. I would guess that the autobiographical sketch as well as interview scores also receive significant weights.

[Guest JD]

What were the GPA cutoffs for people living outside of Ottawa (and not in a rural area) this year? What about for out of province? I heard they were around 3.83 and 3.89 (!) respectively last year...