serious counselling needed!

[des_0]

Sorry if the title is exaggerated.. I've lurked around the forum from now and then, and though I feel like I should be able to make a decision on my own, I think I'm missing some crucial pieces that the members here might know... I've read many similar posts to this one before, so hopefully you will bear with me.

 

So right now I don't know what to do ( =p this sounds familiar.)

I'm graduating in April this year. as April is approaching, I’m just getting more and more anxious and depressed. anxious because i don't know what I should choose and depressed because i feel like im going to fail either way.

 

I've always wanted to get into the field of medicine. though throughout the last semester of second year and first semester of third year, i lost the drive. I ended up with lots of Bs and Cs on my transcript, and finished 2010 an overall term GPA of 3.00 for winter 2010, and a 2.8 for fall 2010. Then I started catching up, and finally brought up my GPA to an overall 3.43 till now. (still 5 more courses to complete for this semester). I’m aiming for an overall cGPA of 3.5 at the end of this semester. But it really seems to me that there’s nothing more I can do now to make up for those two disastrous semesters.

My best two years: 3.5 + 3.8(first and last lol)

 

Here’s some of the extracurriculum I’ve completed:

I spent my entire third year volunteering in an oncology lab. Did very basic projects since I kept on failing and repeating the same enzyme digestions (guess many on this forum could relate) This kind of killed my passion for research, or actually I doubt I had much passion to begin with.

Last October I started volunteering at a support group for mentally challenged last semester- once a week as a helper and transporter.

This month I started working in a neurological lab. Doing basic molecular biology experiments like sub cloning and genotyping. My PI promised some of the lab members to have them publish papers given that they’re determined to do masters under his supervision. I don’t know how much I could count on his words- is it common for master students to publish papers?

 

Tests I’ve taken:

GRE

Applied for MPH (epidemiology) in the US and europe, got accepted into Emory, BU, Warwick. still waiting for a final response from Columbia. -- I personally think this degree is going to be “money down the drain” as my ultimate goal is to go into a real profession like med/dent/pharmacy… Also, going to one of the international schools means imposing more on my parents. :S

 

So, here I am, completely out of my wits. It seems like now there are several ways in front of me…

1. Do another year/semester of undergraduate, and in the meantime, prep for MCAT. (is it possible? Would I be over-credits?) I will be taking some pre-reqs for pharmacy, as well as trying to boost up my GPA. But how much can my GPA really go up?

2. Agree to do master’s at the PI’s lab. This is going to be a two year investment. I read that schools look at publications. So doing master’s would probably offer the mere benefits of a possible publication? (as you can probably tell, I’m really not that crazy about research)

3. Accept one the MPH offers. Then after I graduate, I will work and apply for med/dental schools then. The only advantage of this option, as I see it (correct me if I’m wrong), would be the master’s degree and work experience.

4. Apply jobs as soon as I graduate. I’m looking at positions that involve primary care taking. This will help me pay off loans and gain experiences which can be used for later application to PA programs or med/dent schools.

 

Phew… I’ve finally finished writing everything. I wouldn’t want to see myself giving up the goal of going into med/dental. But I’m beginning to let go the hope.. As I see that most schools want at least a 3.8 cGPA.

 

(on a side note, I’m both Ontario and Quebec resident if this is relevant….)

 

So please please please, give me some advice here and shine some light on this dark tunnel….. Thanks so muchhh!

[des_0]

Oh quick question: some schools look at the best two years of my GPA. so is it just a rule set to let more people apply, or does the admission team only consider those two years and will disregard the other years when making a decision?

[IamIDP]

1. Do another year/semester of undergraduate, and in the meantime, prep for MCAT. (is it possible? Would I be over-credits?) I will be taking some pre-reqs for pharmacy, as well as trying to boost up my GPA. But how much can my GPA really go up?

You can do extra years to pull your GPA up which will help you at some places. If you do extra years and get high GPA, you can apply to western, queens, ottawa and mac.

 

2. Agree to do master’s at the PI’s lab. This is going to be a two year investment. I read that schools look at publications. So doing master’s would probably offer the mere benefits of a possible publication? (as you can probably tell, I’m really not that crazy about research)

If you look at stats of master students, there have been cases where people with 3.4x have gotten in with steller EC's. if I were you, I would do more research about schools that prefer students with masters. I know Macmaster med will raise your total score preinterview by 4% if you have completed your masters, please correct me if i'm wrong

 

 

So realistically only places choices you have are:

1. Do a new degree

2. Continue with Masters

3. Do extra years and apply to a few schools (only school you have a chance is Mac or Northern)

4. Apply to the states (if your loaded you can go there)

5. Choose another career (Keep in mind, pharmacy also requires 3.7+)

[atesme]

I'm sorry... a real profession? I don't understand what you mean by that.

[Nasket]

I'm sorry... a real profession? I don't understand what you mean by that.

 

Yeah, I felt the same thing...uhmmm OP, I think you need to understand the field of health care a little better before you apply to med. Can you elaborate on what, "real profession" means?

[Kasiunut]

To be honest, you don't sound that passionate about medicine/dentistry/pharma etc....are you sure that healthcare is what you want? Have you considered other things like nursing, physio etc? Have you considered using your science degree to pursue something like consulting (in the health care industry) or pharma sales?

 

But the one piece of advice I have for you is to speak to a professional career counselor. Someone who can help you decide what is right for you and not just something you "should" do.

 

However don't pursue something you already know you won't like (like research!).

 

Good luck. Life is hard and the choices we make should be to make our lives better, more enjoyable not harder and more miserable.

[preppy038]

First,

 

MPH is not money down the drain. It is actually an essential part of medicine (public health is a huge part of medicine). I don't see how you got the idea that MPH is money down the drain. It also is a professional degree allowing you to do research/practice public health regionally etc.

 

With an MPH you could work overseas with an organization assisting in building public health policies in 3rd world countries. The kinds of work you do has very little difference with someone who has an MD and is working abroad (except that the MD can do clinical/medical work).

Look through the faculties in most Public health schools and you'll find a heck a lot of people with MDs.

 

Second,

 

Doing a MSc is good because it allows you to be involved in long-term research projects that most likely end up with publications. You need to be productive as a MSc student if you want to publish a lot. You should have a goal of publishing a minimum of at least 1 paper or your master's degree won't really help you for MD applications.

If you're thinking about MSc, it might be a good idea to apply to schools or find labs where research + clinical medicine is considered cooperative and not separate. You will find less hurdles to transfer from research -> clinical medicine

e.g. at a lab I worked in at McGill, most of the students thought people went to medicine after "Dropping out" of research, and people continuing to do a PhD after a MSc, choose to pursue PhD over MD.

While I was in Toronto, the atmosphere was a lot different and actually encouraging students pursuing MSc to consider medical school (e.g. IMS).

 

Doing an extra year may also be helpful in raising your GPA and while you do that you can continue doing research at the lab you're working in, getting more involved and if application to medicine ends up unsuccessful you can pursue a MSc with an adequate undergrad GPA that you've managed to pull up through an extra year (e.g. 3.7~3.8)

[des_0]

Yeah, I felt the same thing...uhmmm OP, I think you need to understand the field of health care a little better before you apply to med. Can you elaborate on what, "real profession" means?

 

In my head, (and this probably came as a result of my lack of interest), that being a lab assistant isn't really a profession. I want to do things that are more.. hands-on. like helping out others in a direct way. Sorry if this is different from most of the opinions here.

[des_0]

To be honest, you don't sound that passionate about medicine/dentistry/pharma etc....are you sure that healthcare is what you want? Have you considered other things like nursing, physio etc? Have you considered using your science degree to pursue something like consulting (in the health care industry) or pharma sales?

 

But the one piece of advice I have for you is to speak to a professional career counselor. Someone who can help you decide what is right for you and not just something you "should" do.

 

However don't pursue something you already know you won't like (like research!).

 

Good luck. Life is hard and the choices we make should be to make our lives better, more enjoyable not harder and more miserable.

 

Probably because I composed that post within half an hour before the library closed! lol...didn't want to go into details why I want to pursue med. I see passion in myself at least- I have a strong interest in psychopharmacology and before "dreamed" of becoming a psychiatrist who doesn't just write prescriptions since I have close friends around me suffering from unhelpful counselling/appointments with psychiatrists.

 

thanks for your advice. I definitely need a direction in life before I commit to further education... just wondering, what are some of the jobs in the health care consulting field?

[des_0]

First,

 

MPH is not money down the drain. It is actually an essential part of medicine (public health is a huge part of medicine). I don't see how you got the idea that MPH is money down the drain. It also is a professional degree allowing you to do research/practice public health regionally etc.

 

With an MPH you could work overseas with an organization assisting in building public health policies in 3rd world countries. The kinds of work you do has very little difference with someone who has an MD and is working abroad (except that the MD can do clinical/medical work).

Look through the faculties in most Public health schools and you'll find a heck a lot of people with MDs.

 

Second,

 

Doing a MSc is good because it allows you to be involved in long-term research projects that most likely end up with publications. You need to be productive as a MSc student if you want to publish a lot. You should have a goal of publishing a minimum of at least 1 paper or your master's degree won't really help you for MD applications.

If you're thinking about MSc, it might be a good idea to apply to schools or find labs where research + clinical medicine is considered cooperative and not separate. You will find less hurdles to transfer from research -> clinical medicine

e.g. at a lab I worked in at McGill, most of the students thought people went to medicine after "Dropping out" of research, and people continuing to do a PhD after a MSc, choose to pursue PhD over MD.

While I was in Toronto, the atmosphere was a lot different and actually encouraging students pursuing MSc to consider medical school (e.g. IMS).

 

Doing an extra year may also be helpful in raising your GPA and while you do that you can continue doing research at the lab you're working in, getting more involved and if application to medicine ends up unsuccessful you can pursue a MSc with an adequate undergrad GPA that you've managed to pull up through an extra year (e.g. 3.7~3.8)

 

Thanks a lot for your advice!

I said it felt like "money down the drain" mainly because the schools i've applied for got high tuition fees for international students. :S. I'm just so scared that after 2 years of MPH, I will end up in a lab running PCR everyday again... (did I sound ignorant?.. my apology! I saw some of the career prospects listed online after mph in epi, and I flinched when I saw the word researcher)

[Robin Hood]

For Quebec schools: McGill will forgive your bad marks if you start another undergrad degree and get 45 credits by the deadline (Nov 1). As for French school, they aren't forgivers. I don't know how the Quebec schools deal with Masters.

 

Sorry if the title is exaggerated.. I've lurked around the forum from now and then, and though I feel like I should be able to make a decision on my own, I think I'm missing some crucial pieces that the members here might know... I've read many similar posts to this one before, so hopefully you will bear with me.

 

So right now I don't know what to do ( =p this sounds familiar.)

I'm graduating in April this year. as April is approaching, I’m just getting more and more anxious and depressed. anxious because i don't know what I should choose and depressed because i feel like im going to fail either way.

 

I've always wanted to get into the field of medicine. though throughout the last semester of second year and first semester of third year, i lost the drive. I ended up with lots of Bs and Cs on my transcript, and finished 2010 an overall term GPA of 3.00 for winter 2010, and a 2.8 for fall 2010. Then I started catching up, and finally brought up my GPA to an overall 3.43 till now. (still 5 more courses to complete for this semester). I’m aiming for an overall cGPA of 3.5 at the end of this semester. But it really seems to me that there’s nothing more I can do now to make up for those two disastrous semesters.

My best two years: 3.5 + 3.8(first and last lol)

 

Here’s some of the extracurriculum I’ve completed:

I spent my entire third year volunteering in an oncology lab. Did very basic projects since I kept on failing and repeating the same enzyme digestions (guess many on this forum could relate) This kind of killed my passion for research, or actually I doubt I had much passion to begin with.

Last October I started volunteering at a support group for mentally challenged last semester- once a week as a helper and transporter.

This month I started working in a neurological lab. Doing basic molecular biology experiments like sub cloning and genotyping. My PI promised some of the lab members to have them publish papers given that they’re determined to do masters under his supervision. I don’t know how much I could count on his words- is it common for master students to publish papers?

 

Tests I’ve taken:

GRE

Applied for MPH (epidemiology) in the US and europe, got accepted into Emory, BU, Warwick. still waiting for a final response from Columbia. -- I personally think this degree is going to be “money down the drain” as my ultimate goal is to go into a real profession like med/dent/pharmacy… Also, going to one of the international schools means imposing more on my parents. :S

 

So, here I am, completely out of my wits. It seems like now there are several ways in front of me…

1. Do another year/semester of undergraduate, and in the meantime, prep for MCAT. (is it possible? Would I be over-credits?) I will be taking some pre-reqs for pharmacy, as well as trying to boost up my GPA. But how much can my GPA really go up?

2. Agree to do master’s at the PI’s lab. This is going to be a two year investment. I read that schools look at publications. So doing master’s would probably offer the mere benefits of a possible publication? (as you can probably tell, I’m really not that crazy about research)

3. Accept one the MPH offers. Then after I graduate, I will work and apply for med/dental schools then. The only advantage of this option, as I see it (correct me if I’m wrong), would be the master’s degree and work experience.

4. Apply jobs as soon as I graduate. I’m looking at positions that involve primary care taking. This will help me pay off loans and gain experiences which can be used for later application to PA programs or med/dent schools.

 

Phew… I’ve finally finished writing everything. I wouldn’t want to see myself giving up the goal of going into med/dental. But I’m beginning to let go the hope.. As I see that most schools want at least a 3.8 cGPA.

 

(on a side note, I’m both Ontario and Quebec resident if this is relevant….)

 

So please please please, give me some advice here and shine some light on this dark tunnel….. Thanks so muchhh!

[Nasket]

Thanks a lot for your advice!

I said it felt like "money down the drain" mainly because the schools i've applied for got high tuition fees for international students. :S. I'm just so scared that after 2 years of MPH, I will end up in a lab running PCR everyday again... (did I sound ignorant?.. my apology! I saw some of the career prospects listed online after mph in epi, and I flinched when I saw the word researcher)

 

I think you NEED to understand that MPH is everything BUT PCR. Public health like the name states is working with the PUBLIC. I strongly suggest you do research on this before you even consider looking at med apps. Public health is an enormous part of medical practice and our health care systems.

[Der Kaiser]

1. Do another year/semester of undergraduate, and in the meantime, prep for MCAT. (is it possible? Would I be over-credits?) I will be taking some pre-reqs for pharmacy, as well as trying to boost up my GPA. But how much can my GPA really go up?

You can do extra years to pull your GPA up which will help you at some places. If you do extra years and get high GPA, you can apply to western, queens, ottawa and mac.

 

2. Agree to do master’s at the PI’s lab. This is going to be a two year investment. I read that schools look at publications. So doing master’s would probably offer the mere benefits of a possible publication? (as you can probably tell, I’m really not that crazy about research)

If you look at stats of master students, there have been cases where people with 3.4x have gotten in with steller EC's. if I were you, I would do more research about schools that prefer students with masters. I know Macmaster med will raise your total score preinterview by 4% if you have completed your masters, please correct me if i'm wrong

 

The bonus for having a Masters with McMaster is 1%. A PhD is 4% (not worth the time commitment). Calculating this in regard to my own grades it was like having one standard deviation added to my gpa. It's not great but other schools (like U of T and Queens) give you a second look if you have a graduate degree, so it could be worth it.

 

As for the extra year, I would make sure that it still counts for Western if you

officially graduate. What I mean to say is don't officially graduate this year just in case.

 

Finally, you haven't done the MCAT, which can be a game changer (especially in Ontario and Alberta). I think McGill will also consider it for some students (optional consideration I think?).