Lactic Folly Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Since this forum is such a good source of info, I thought I'd pick the brains of those more involved in research than I. My supervisor says that one can submit a project to more than one international conference - in which circumstances is this true? I assume this is ok if there has been significant progress in the work, but certainly concurrent submission to more than one journal is a no-no. Abstract submission guidelines for many conferences are rather vague - I have found info on the web that seems to support multiple submissions, but these are for arts/social sciences, and I'd be looking at more science/medicine. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osteon Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Since this forum is such a good source of info, I thought I'd pick the brains of those more involved in research than I. My supervisor says that one can submit a project to more than one international conference - in which circumstances is this true? I assume this is ok if there has been significant progress in the work, but certainly concurrent submission to more than one journal is a no-no. Abstract submission guidelines for many conferences are rather vague - I have found info on the web that seems to support multiple submissions, but these are for arts/social sciences, and I'd be looking at more science/medicine. Thanks! Double dipping is frowned upon regardless of whether it's a journal or conference. Actually, for a journal it's not even legal if you sign over ownership to the journal. Presumably, since you are going to more than one conference, so are many other academics. Now why would they want to go to a new conference to see the same old research? Thats not the point of an academic community. I know of a few novice researchers who do not think (know?) much of double submissions, but among those purely involved in research (medicine/science PhD's) it is generally not looked upon favorably. The exception is student conferences, where it's not so much about academic advancement as it is about student experience. I've known a few profs who have commented that they can easily tell on applications that someone has reused old research for multiple conferences. Titles are similar, authors are similar, and it doesn't take much to look up the content of each online. Like you said though, if there's significant progress (like new interpretations significant) in the project, then it might be ok. Usually, one will present their research in its early stage at a conference, and then add more in depth analysis and interpretation to put out a paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quackster Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 Since this forum is such a good source of info, I thought I'd pick the brains of those more involved in research than I. My supervisor says that one can submit a project to more than one international conference - in which circumstances is this true? I assume this is ok if there has been significant progress in the work, but certainly concurrent submission to more than one journal is a no-no. Abstract submission guidelines for many conferences are rather vague - I have found info on the web that seems to support multiple submissions, but these are for arts/social sciences, and I'd be looking at more science/medicine. Thanks! Most conferences don't allow you to have submitted your work to another conference, nor that the journal article for the research be published before the conference presentation. I wouldn't risk it, lest it get caught and you have to retract your abstract. There are some exceptions that I know of, but these are clearly stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted August 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 Thanks guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osteon Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 I gave a talk...actually the only undergrad invited in a professional setting... at an international hematology conference in the States during my second year. Also first author published that work a year later. So from my experience, The experience you describe here does not align with the conclusions you give next at all. You presented, and then published, which is typical. If you are only presenting a poster, no one would really care how many you submit to. Two reasons: 1) There are usually couple hundred posters at these conferences. 2) These works generally are of smaller scope/impact anyways. Wrong. At big conferences, like the international one you went to, because there are so many people, even strong research is given a poster just so everyone can be accomodated. Often nowadays, where more than 5000 attendees is typical at a big medical conference, only keynotes get oral presentations. I've seen many posters go on to be published in BMJ and Nature, so your statement that only smaller scope things get a poster is totally false. Yes there are many posters, but researchers will almost always look at the program ahead of time to make sure they can go see the ones that are of most interest to them, which is usually easy because posters are organized by discipline. So, yeah people do recognize if you're presenting the same thing twice... However, if you are giving a formal talk, then I would really stick to the safe side and submit to only 1 conference. For papers however, you must only submit to them one at a time. Good luck! My response in bold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quackster Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 ++ to osteon above. medhopefuls2016, you gave some frighteningly false information...especially so when there is currently heightened scrutiny for legitimacy of data. just to add, for the sake of information - once an abstract is accepted, the content is officially embargoed until the time of presentation, poster or oral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osteon Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 Ummm interesting...I didn't know that the rules for posters at formal conferences are also that stringent. I was always under the impression that posters are a lot more informal. For OP, talks/papers however concurrent submission is definitely NOT allowed as I said before. Osteon: It is for sure not true that only keynotes give oral free communications. Besides the general keynotes, my conference was divided into multiple topics spanning the course of three-day weekend, for each research focus there were 5-6 presenters who were chosen for oral communications. Further, people who get chosen tend to have projects which, in my opinion (which maybe wrong as Osteon point out) have broader scope or more interdisciplinary in nature (or, as my supervisor said, tells a "complete story" ). Notice that I did not say "exclusively." I said "often." For conferences that do have oral presentations, it is not necessarily better or more "interdisciplinary" or "complete" projects that get the oral. I know because I've served on abstract review boards, and have heard the same thing from profs who have also served on review boards. Here's an example: Let's say an orthopedic conference receives 10 abstracts and they plan to have 1 oral session of 6 people. Let's say 6 of the abstracts are on osteoarthritis, one is on acl surgery, one is on meniscus repair, one is on rotationplasty, and one discovers a compound that speeds fracture healing by 75%. Guess who gets the podium talks: the 6 on osteoarthritis. The other 4 could be way better studies, RCT's maybe that go on to NEJM or Nature but would end up with a poster because there aren't enough abstracts on those topics. In general, they try to organize conferences to meet the demands of those attending - in Ortho, OA is a big problem, and thus there's a lot of OA research, thus if your project is on OA, chances are you'll get a podium if the conference offers them. Find a hot research area and you might get a podium, regardless of whether the study is Nature-worthy or rejection-worthy from any bottom ranked journal. Now, those 6 who have podium talks; of course their talks will seem like more "complete" or interdisciplinary studies. That's because they have 12 minutes of your time to tell you whatever they want. A poster presenter usually gets like 2 minutes. So to say that all oral presentations are better, or more interdisciplinary or more complete or whatever is just misinformed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123456789trial Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 I understand that for journal submissions, you can't submit the same research to more than one journal, but that also applies to research conferences? I recently presented a poster at both an international level conference (13,000+ attendees) and a national level conference (~3,000 attendees) . My supervisor and the department head (who provided me with a travel grant to attend the international conference) both encouraged me to submit and present my research at both of these conferences. Is this something that should not be done then? I always thought the purpose of these large conferences was to try and get your research as much exposure as possible and network with other people who are interested/doing similar research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted August 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 Update: a conference I was considering released their call for abstracts and although they ask whether you have submitted for publication or presentation elsewhere, they also state this does not affect the selection and is used for matters of copyright. So - the bottom line is - it varies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainz Posted August 12, 2012 Report Share Posted August 12, 2012 is there more than one question involved in the project? you can come up with two different questions (the title of the posters) and then work the entire poster around two separate discussions. it does depend on the conference, however, I would equally try to stay away from putting the exact same poster together for two different conferences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123456789trial Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 is there more than one question involved in the project? you can come up with two different questions (the title of the posters) and then work the entire poster around two separate discussions. it does depend on the conference, however, I would equally try to stay away from putting the exact same poster together for two different conferences. The titles of my posters are different (slightly reworded) and I did have additional information for the later conference that I put on the poster which wasn't on the earlier one, but you wouldn't be able to tell just based on the title. And what about if I gave an oral presentation on the same project? The titles are slightly reworded, but all in all, its quite similar to the poster titles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newmedcraze Posted August 20, 2012 Report Share Posted August 20, 2012 So after reading all the posts, I am assuming that it is ok to submit my abstracts (I have 3) in more than one conference if your prof is ok with it. However I can submit the articles in only one journal. Is it ok to present the posters in more than one undergrad research symposium? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osteon Posted August 20, 2012 Report Share Posted August 20, 2012 Submitting same abstract to more than one undergrad/grad research day: - No problem. Submitting same abstract to more than one national/international conference: Not OK. Some conferences strictly prohibit it, others don't mention but it's kind of an unwritten rule in research that you don't recycle your old work when disseminating it to colleagues who are interested in ADVANCING knowledge; not recalling stuff you did 6 months ago. Will people notice that you've submitted to more than one? Maybe, and maybe not - depends on the fields of each conference. Will they care if they find out? Maybe and maybe not. Depends on the person. A lot of people get pissed if they spend money to fly to some remote conference only to see work they saw at a different conference a short while ago. Summary: just because your supervisor says so, doesn't make it right. Some don't care, some don't know the rules. Also, changing the title slightly does not count as a new abstract. If ever you apply for a scholarship or grant and the people responsible for reviewing your application are real scientists, they'll see through it immediately. Submitting same abstract to undergrad/grad research day AND one conference: This is fine. Submitting same work to more than one journal: Not allowed under any circumstance. This is an infringement of publishers agreements, and so it's in fact illegal and subject to punishment. By same work, it is meant the same research question, analysis, and conclusions. You can use the same data set for multiple questions, and thus multiple papers, but be warned: carving your data into small pieces will (a) reduce the chances of you getting published, ( reduce the impact of your work = lower quality journal, and © people aren't stupid - they know when you're trying to squeeze out papers from one experiment. So you might loose friends in the research world, and also the validity of your results may be questioned at some point (let's say, in your experiment you find really interesting results and publish 3 papers using that data. If that data is wrong, either by human error or random chance, all 3 of those papers become irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newmedcraze Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 Submitting same abstract to more than one undergrad/grad research day: - No problem. Submitting same abstract to more than one national/international conference: Not OK. Some conferences strictly prohibit it, others don't mention but it's kind of an unwritten rule in research that you don't recycle your old work when disseminating it to colleagues who are interested in ADVANCING knowledge; not recalling stuff you did 6 months ago. Will people notice that you've submitted to more than one? Maybe, and maybe not - depends on the fields of each conference. Will they care if they find out? Maybe and maybe not. Depends on the person. A lot of people get pissed if they spend money to fly to some remote conference only to see work they saw at a different conference a short while ago. Summary: just because your supervisor says so, doesn't make it right. Some don't care, some don't know the rules. Also, changing the title slightly does not count as a new abstract. If ever you apply for a scholarship or grant and the people responsible for reviewing your application are real scientists, they'll see through it immediately. Submitting same abstract to undergrad/grad research day AND one conference: This is fine. Submitting same work to more than one journal: Not allowed under any circumstance. This is an infringement of publishers agreements, and so it's in fact illegal and subject to punishment. By same work, it is meant the same research question, analysis, and conclusions. You can use the same data set for multiple questions, and thus multiple papers, but be warned: carving your data into small pieces will (a) reduce the chances of you getting published, ( reduce the impact of your work = lower quality journal, and © people aren't stupid - they know when you're trying to squeeze out papers from one experiment. So you might loose friends in the research world, and also the validity of your results may be questioned at some point (let's say, in your experiment you find really interesting results and publish 3 papers using that data. If that data is wrong, either by human error or random chance, all 3 of those papers become irrelevant. Thanks for making it clear Osteon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boourns Posted August 22, 2012 Report Share Posted August 22, 2012 Okay, let me add my input from the perspective of a PhD student - going into my 4th year overall. I have quite a bit of experience in this area and have attended more than half a dozen conferences. In a nutshell, submitting to more than one conference isn't only frowned upon, it's actually prohibited depending on the conference, especially if your abstract is published. It is just like when you submit to a journal, you basically have to sign a disclosure saying it hasn't been published in another journal. What you CAN do, is change the title and the abstract completely, this is allowed and many people do it. I personally have never done this and think it's kind of tacky, but it IS allowed. I have however, presented an extension of an old poster at another conference (that is I added a few more experiments to the previous one), I have seen multiple people do this. Essentially, the rule is only present the "same" poster if you have novel data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.