Medicine in Canada now biased towards females?

[Guest Sunmoonandstar]

Not to beat a dead horse, but your question "If there is no bias in Canada, then why are there more females than males in medical school when males beat females on the MCAT? (I don't know the GPA breakdown)" can be answered with documents that have appeared on this forum before. First of all, FAR more females than males apply to Canadian medical schools. Over the past five years, men have averaged 3590 applications to medicine in Canada, while women averaged 4484. The success rates of application are more similar, with men at 24.8% and women at 26.3% (Admission Requirements of Canadian Faculties of Medicine, ACMC 2004). Considering that women are less likely to drop out of school and more likely to complete a university education, this difference in application numbers and success rate isn't too surprising (Candian Gender Trends in Education and Work, Gov of Canada 1999), regardless of MCAT scores (which many schools don't even look at).

[Guest 007]

And with over one million Ontarians without a family physician, why schools continue to accept more females than males is beyond me.

 

Just to clarify, are you suggesting that women applying to medicine should be placed at a disadvantage in the admissions process because they are women?

[Guest peachy]

Here at Sherbrooke, the proportion this year is 60F/40M, but last year it was 75/25. Is it a problem? Hell no!

Except for practicing clinical skills, where it's nice to have more guys willing to let us practice on them!

[Guest Jochi1543]

I happened to be reading gender stats on American med schools just last night. Practically every school had a percentage of females in high 40s or low 50s. 48% male, 52% female, or 50% male, 50% female - all numbers are very close and don't make much of a difference.

 

 

 

You have to connect this also to the fact that at least in the US, more women than men are going to college. I think right now, the situation is that 60% of college freshmen are female. More college students = more med applicants = higher share of female med students.

[Guest UWOmalestudent]

To 007:

 

In a physician shortage crisis, yes I feel that females should be placed at a disadvantage, because statistics show that they work less, take time off to have children and retire earlier.

 

No one except a feminist/socialist can argue with that statement, in which they will beat around the bush and preach 'equality'

[Guest Jochi1543]

Also, I just finished reading a book criticizing gender feminism, and one of the big arguments against the fact that women are "oppressed" (which gender feminists like to say) is that statistics shows that in the US, girls fare better in school than boys do - their GPAs are higher. So, maybe men outdo women on the MCAT by 1 point, but women are likelier to have a higher GPA simply because they appear to be more successful at attaining the goals the educational system sets before them.

[Guest Jochi1543]

For some reason I seriously doubt you're going into meds to crucify yourself selflessly by working 120 hours a week until you're 95. So this argument is pretty pointless. People should not be criticized for having a life outside of work.

[Guest strider2004]

In a physician shortage crisis, yes I feel that females should be placed at a disadvantage, because statistics show that they work less, take time off to have children and retire earlier.

 

No one except a feminist/socialist can argue with that statement, in which they will beat around the bush and preach 'equality'

 

What you will also find is that females tend to choose family medicine more than males (1) with 2 thirds of new family medicine residents being female. From that and our shortage of family physicians, you could conclude that we should ENCOURAGE females in medicine because they are more likely to be the ones to fill the holes in our system?

[Guest FrancophoneRN]

Oh UWOmalestudent, you make me laugh so much.

 

You will make a good post-interview story for a lot of interviewers. They will file it under: Can you believe this guy ?

 

No, seriously, keep going. You brighten up my day.

[Guest UWOmalestudent]

^ Do you honestly think I'm that stupid enough to say what I truly feel to an interview comitee?

 

The main reason I am going into medical school is for the money. I have no regrets saying this here on an anonymous message board. That is my true reason.

 

At the interview, I am going to be very feminstic/socialistic just like everyone else who gets in. I enjoy working with people and helping them with their illnesses blah blah blah. I have a passion for medicine blah blah blah.

 

Not only do I have a 3.98GPA which I was told was excellent, but I can also 'play the game' like everyone else who gets into medical school does.

[Guest Ollie]

Ohhhhh.......

 

Please please go and leave us all alone. Your trolling is not welcome here.

[Guest Jochi1543]

But it really doesn't matter that your GPA is 3.98, because you're a man, and men don't get in.:smokin

[Guest ezaholic]

Hmm...I don't know why this would affect your decision for which medical school to attend, but I find the whole bias issue in medical school..and society in general interesting.

 

If the situation in the Mac med program occurred in the opposite way, (more males than females), I am sure something would be done to make it more 'fair'. They wouldn't just say, I guess our admission process gives an advantage to men.

 

I just dislike the desire for 'equality but only in certain areas'. I hear outrage when a report that the average female income is lower than the average male income, but I have yet to hear a female outraged that she pays less car insurance.

 

I am a male nurse. I make the same as my fellow female nurses. I am happy to help when needed, but going by the equality idea, why am I called to help lift or transfer all the heavy patients. I guess they don't want to equally share a broken back. I guess them just the brakes...

 

ez

[Guest kahone]

although I'd love to have a ringside ticket to his clerk rotations when he brings this attitude and "plays the game"...

[Guest UWOmalestudent]

To ezaholic:

 

I agree 100% that is BS.

 

What your are experiencing is feminsm. Feminism is about women receiving the benefits of being a man, while retaining the benefits of being a woman.

 

If I were you, I would file a lawsuit against the hopital for discrimination and unequitable treatment. That is unacceptable.

 

Female nurses should have to help life heavy patients just as much as you do, or you should be paid for more for your extra services.

 

To kahone: I'll be nice and respectful until I have my MD and am certified. At that point, like most doctors, I will begin to treat most people like @#%$.

[Guest ttryit]

If we had no affirmative action in Canada, then we wouldn't have special scholarships for females in science. We wouldn't have awards geared towards minorities. We wouldn't have spots reserved for aboriginals. Finally, we wouldn't have such a mismatch between application and admission gender statistics as such institutions as Mac.

 

tt

[Guest UWOmalestudent]

^ Thank you tt.

 

You are the first non-socialist / non-feministic poster on this board.

 

Affirmative action does exist in Canada, and it causing the downfall of the medical profession, as more and more females are entering it.

 

Oh well, I can always go to America and get paid twice as much. However, I think I'll stay here for the cheaper schooling lol

[Guest Jochi1543]

I feel that the debate as a whole is entirely pointless until we see the actual figures on percentage of male vs female applicants and their admissions rates.

 

Here are the complete statistics from UBC: www.admissions.med.ubc.ca...202004.xls

 

(Excel file)

 

You can see that 53% of applicants are women and 51% of admitted students are women. If anything, this shows that the percentage of females passing the admissions selection is lower than that of males.

 

Indeed, below you can see that admissions rate for women is 13% and for men is 14%.

 

 

 

 

I personally find the little differences in %ages not worthy of noting, but one who wants to look into them, will find that if anybody's discriminated against, it would have to be women rather than men in this case.

[Guest UWOmalestudent]

^

 

Look at schools like McMaster....

[Guest ttryit]

In the states, a group of rich white boys sponsored a scholarship at a prestigous university to be given to a white male. There was outrage when this occured and these students were likened to the KKK.

 

My question is, why is it that a scholarship for a black woman or a chinese woman is not viewed with equal distaste?

 

I often hear students preach that they want equality. Students who are equal don't have special scholarships set aside for them.

 

tt

[Guest Jochi1543]

Give me a link, I don't have time to search now, UBC site is the only one where I know the location of the stats.

[Guest wattyjl]

but I have yet to hear a female outraged that she pays less car insurance.

 

probably a bad example, since the reason men pay more is because on average more men get in accidents, drive drunk, etc., and require insurance to cover their asses.

 

i'm willing to bet that on average women do not do inferior work to men, and thus statistically need not be penalized.

 

as for heavy lifting - yea, i guess that's way it goes.

 

 

as for UWOmalestudent/troll - if you and your situation actually exist, you are the reason why we need more female doctors. i'm going to go with the tried and (in my general opinion) true stereotype, that women tend to actually 'care' more. no, i'm not labelling all women as "mom's" but in comparison to guys, i cannot remember the last girl i met who was going into medicine for money or ego massaging. in fact i've never met one. not saying they don't exist, because they surely do, but the frequency has got to be way less than it is for guys applying to meds.

[Guest wattyjl]

this has already been discussed in other threads (issues of affirmitive action, etc.) and by much more knowledgeable people than are talking about it here (including myself), but consider this: white men have dominated our (and many others') society for quite some time ('forever' comes to mind). i suppose the reason why we need to give 'special' scholarships/positions/etc. is to try and get groups of under-represented individuals (= non-white males) participating at all levels of society. it is important that all groups be fairly represented so that they have a voice, etc.

 

can things swing too far in the other direction (i.e. reverse discrimination) - yea, they *might*, but at least in medicine, it doesn't seem like that's happening yet.

 

UWOmaletroll - nicely done, 40+ posts in one day, that must be approaching a record!

[Guest FrancophoneRN]

Oh, UWOmalestudent, you're so cute !

 

*pinches the cheek*

 

And such talent to rile people up. I like you.

 

You're funny.

[Guest ttryit]

w, I absolutely agree with you, however how do we right the wrongs of the past? I don't think it is through the use of affirmative action or "reverse discrimination".

 

If we strive for fairness now, we will achieve equality later!

 

tt