My situation

[dnao2]

Hi Guys,

This is my first post ever so I hope somebody can help me out. I have come to realize what I really want to do in life. I hope I can get some input. Here is my current status:

 

I started my first year at UT doing sciences and had a first year GPA of 3.63. I ended up switching out of sciences to pursue an interest I had in engineering knowing that I could challenge myself in a program other than science and still apply to med from engineering. Long story short, I watched my GPA fall in engineering as follows:

 

Year 1: 3.74

Year 2: 3.20

Year 3: 3.23

Year 4: 3.24

CGPA = 3.35

 

I've looked at the general cut-offs for schools in Canada/U.S. and normally they are at 3.7-3.9. From my first year of sciences, I only need a couple of more pre-reqs to so that I could apply. The more I looked the more depressing it become that there was no way my GPA could be boosted. An idea then struck me and I figured if I went back to complete 2nd-4th year of my science degree and worked hard to get my GPA up, med schools would only look at my latest degree which would be the science one.

 

Do you guys think this is a possible route, or if there is another route? I'm determined and would love to hear your input.

 

Thanks!

[Alastriss]

you could try writing your mcats, and mind you the gpa for US schools is a little different, and could infact give you a boost.

If you write your mcats and score in the mid thirties (NOT an easy task, but not a shot in a million either) and apply EARLY then you can be a decent applicant for some schools in the US. My disclaimer is that a good mcat score does not negate a poor gpa, as some of my friends seem to think, it can however compensate for it granted your score is really good.

[Dante]

well, i've got good news and bad news for you. Your ROSI gpa is actually only counting the marks from your engineering degree, you need to manually compute your cgpa and include your first year of sciences, which (assuming you took 5 credits each year) now boosts your cgpa to a 3.41! still not stellar, but this is ignoring the calculation that UofT uses for your gpa: (again assuming you took 5 credits per year) you can cross out 5 of your worst credits which could significantly boost your gpa even further! as great as this sounds, you still need to write the mcat to even be considered at UofT (and here all you need is a score of 27 with 9's in each section... UofT uses the mcat as a flag, so provided you've got this, you're on par with a person who has a 45T).

From your post, it sounds like you intend to go back to at least pick up a few more prerequisite courses. Take a full courseload and get another 3.7 or above and you can start thinking about applying to western (here you'll need a 10 10 10 Q mcat, and doing better here WILL help your overall chances).

 

You can currently apply to mcmaster since their minimum gpa is a 3.0, and no mcat is needed, but mac applications are quite quirky and the average entring gpa is around a 3.8... but the essay questions they ask you to complete are given very high weight (almost on par with your gpa) in determining interviews, and once interviews are granted, your gpa is a minimal determining factor.

 

Ottawa's formula weighs your last 3 years with increasing importance (and ignores anything more than 3 years away) so completing your science undergrad degree (and having a killer gpa ~3.85+) will get you interviews there. NO MCAT REQUIRED!!

 

Queens is the other school with high demands for both mcat and gpa. You'll need a 10,10,10 P mcat, and either a cgpa of 3.68 (all courses counted) or a cgpa of 3.78 (last two years only counted). the second option is your saving grace.

 

I would ignore NOMS (well I have actually personally ignored noms, so I suggest everyone else that isn't from northern ontario do the same )

 

I hope that helps! You seem determined, and I'm sure that if you work hard you can get in eventually... I'm almost the total opposite of you: started in engineering and switched to life science, and I understand how brutal engineering can be... congrats on the iron ring!

 

The other option is to do a masters/phd... but i don't have much information on how you are judged through that stream of application.

[a41]

well, i've got good news and bad news for you. Your ROSI gpa is actually only counting the marks from your engineering degree, you need to manually compute your cgpa and include your first year of sciences, which (assuming you took 5 credits each year) now boosts your cgpa to a 3.41!

 

Actually, that cGPA includes his first year marks. (There's no way you can get a cGPA of 3.35 with 3.2, 3.23, and 3.24 only). In engineering you take more than 5 credits each year.

[Dante]

Actually, that cGPA includes his first year marks. (There's no way you can get a cGPA of 3.35 with 3.2, 3.23, and 3.24 only). In engineering you take more than 5 credits each year.

 

yeah, the years 1-4 that he's listed are engineering years... his life sci 1st year gpa is written above that as a 3.63

[dnao2]

Question, for UT's calculation it says you can take out 1FCE for each additional year you took - does that imply 1FCE in EACH respective year, or could I have choosen to keep all my first year courses and say, take more than 1 FCE from my other years?

 

Following the above assumption, then my UT OSMAS converted score would be 3.57 which is shy of their 3.6 Cutoff.

 

Looking at Dante's post, the schools that I can apply to as of "today" are McMaster and possibly UT (unless UT's 3.6 stated cutoff is strict).

 

I've taken the MCAT once two years ago. After being away from science for so long I scored PS9 VR7 BS7 WS0 = 23O. That is definitely NOT competitive, but I'm aiming for a much higher score when I decide to write it again.

 

The options for Ottawa, Queens and even Western would require me to begin my completion for my science degree to improve my GPA. Please correct me if I'm wrong Dante. I really appreciate everybody's input.

 

It looks like completing my science degree (assuming I do better than the ones in engineering) would be in favour for me for schools that only look at the "latest" years. Also, for schools that do look at all degrees/years - having more credits with better grades would still be in my favour.

[Dante]

UT's calculation allows you to eliminate 1FCE from anywhere on your transcript for each full courseload year you've taken (provided you've completed at least 3 years), so your lowest 5 credits from any year are gone. (and the more years you do, the more credits you can eliminate)

 

UT's cutoff is not strict in the sense that if you don't meet it you're automatically rejected (notice that they've accepted ppl with 6's and 7's on their mcats) but they say that dropping below these cutoffs will raise an eyebrow, and you'll need to excell in other areas to compensate for low gpa/mcats.... if you can pull up your mcat above their cut, i think a 3.57 combined with a well written essay could get you an interview.

 

As for Western/Queens/Ottawa, you would need increasingly extra years: western will require just 1 year at 3.7+, Queens would require your next two years to average a 3.78, and ottawa will require that your last 3 years give a weighted gpa of 3.85+ (weighted gpa means that the most recent year's gpa is multiplied by 3, the second most recent year x2, and the third most recent year x1, then the sum divided by 6) this is technically possible to achieve with 2 years that are very close to a 4.0 combined with your 4th year of engineering... or more likely, 3 more years of classes that will give a wgpa above their cutoff.

 

also don't ignore the grad school option... medical schools are increasingly taking more and more grad applicants (UofT is edging on 1/3 of the class having a grad degree!), and considering the possibility of spending 3 more years in undergrad, why not spend them in a masters program instead? You end up with an MSc, and are treated more leniently by the med schools I think. Just something to consider, because a life science degree can be frustrating at times as well (but i personally felt a significant drop in difficulty going from 1st year engineering into 2nd year life sci)

[webshy]

As for Western/Queens/Ottawa, you would need increasingly extra years: western will require just 1 year at 3.7+, Queens would require your next two years to average a 3.78, and ottawa will require that your last 3 years give a weighted gpa of 3.85+ (weighted gpa means that the most recent year's gpa is multiplied by 3, the second most recent year x2, and the third most recent year x1, then the sum divided by 6) this is technically possible to achieve with 2 years that are very close to a 4.0 combined with your 4th year of engineering... or more likely, 3 more years of classes that will give a wgpa above their cutoff.

 

Just one clarification regarding Western - in order to count the first year of your engineering degree, you would need to register for a "Special Year" (ie: non-degree year), rather than register for a new degree. If you register for a new degree, UWO will require you to complete that degree, and also to have both years above their cut-off from your new degree. UWO requires your "Special Year" to have a full course load (5.0 courses, no repeats), or which 4.0 must be third or fourth year, while 1.0 can be second year or higher.

 

Elaine

[dnao2]

Hi Elaine,

 

I definitely do not want to register for a special year in engineering as upper year courses will just be as difficult under a full course load . So it looks like the second option (taking back a new degree) would be better.

 

Dante,

 

I have considered Masters are well. I believe UT's GPA cut off becomes 3.0 when you take Masters. I applied to biomed in my final year but switching from CompEng undergrad to BioMed Grad was a no go. If I stayed in CompEng to do a Masters, I would feel like my knowledge in science would just get worse and worse. It's still an option for me of course.

 

I'm glad I have some support from you guys. It's been pretty depressing. =) Thanks

[webshy]

I definitely do not want to register for a special year in engineering as upper year courses will just be as difficult under a full course load . So it looks like the second option (taking back a new degree) would be better.

 

Just a clarification - your "Special Year" does not need to be in the Faculty of Engineering; instead, you can take any upper level courses. You could take upper level science, arts, etc. courses. For example, my degree is a Bachelor of Health Administration in Health Services Management. My special year contains embryology, 2 physiology, computer science, sociology, health studies and french courses.

 

Elaine

[kgmed23]

U of T now requires a minimum gpa of 3.6 to apply. I assume its a hard cut-off now. Puts me out of luck as well.

[Dante]

U of T now requires a minimum gpa of 3.6 to apply. I assume its a hard cut-off now. Puts me out of luck as well.

 

wasn't this always the case? it's just that their 'cutoff' is flexible... or has something changed?

[kgmed23]

I remember reading it last year that generally 3.6 is minimum acceptable. It was not a strict requirement but this year it says you need a minimum of 3.6 to apply.

I hope it is a little flexible and they take time to read through the reason why your gpa might have suffered instead of an automatic rejection. I will call them tomorrow and comment.

[Dante]

hahaha you mean that space with 100 character limit!?

[dnao2]

I sure hope it's not a hard limit! Let us know what they say kgmed23 if you get a chance. Thanks!