Ireland thread

[Guest Jimbo]

Want to start a discussion thread for those who are hopeful of going to Ireland for 2002.

Does anyone know of a site on the web that has detailed information on the curriculum there? Also want to know how optimistic people are of coming back to Canada in 5 years, or if you are thinking of the US for residency.

[Guest yaz]

Why do you want to encourage going to Ireland with all the terrorist troubles constantly interfering with local life?

Do you want to become a (legless) doctor or a limb counter?

Do you know about med schools somewhere nearby like Scotland or Wales?

[Guest Ian Wong]

? It's not like the entirety of Ireland is in turmoil. I think it'd be cool to study in Ireland, Canadian practice rights and tuition issues notwithstanding.

 

Ian

UBC, Med 3

[Guest Jimbo]

whoa yaz, you aren't a geography star, are you? I expect you are thinking of Northern Ireland, a different country altogether. Ireland does not have terrorist issues. Even Northern Ireland is quite safe, unless you are an angry catholic or protestant parading around the wrong side of town looking for trouble.

By the way, Wales and Scotland aren't so open to international students, esp ones with med schools in our country.

[Guest Ross]

Has anyone heard back from their Ireland applications yet?

[Guest ricorod]

A friend of mine got accepted to University College Dublin a few weeks ago. They wanted a $4000 deposit by March 1st to hold a spot, though, which sucks since she won't know her Canadian med school status until much later.

[Guest 6ajb3]

Hi Jimbo,

I'm not sure if you're still out there but I am also waiting for responses from Ireland meds. I hear it can take till August but am not as anxious as I am to hear about Canadian meds. I'm prepared to go overseas but... you know the story. Anyway, here's a website that might be helpful for you. It's a fairly "cut-to-the-chase-hold-the-sugar" type site so be prepared for some disappointment but not to worry, there's still hope for those who are determined:

www.csa-notes.com/

 

Speaking of determined...Are there any other "older" applicants going overseas for meds? Please share your stories! No need to reply Annie, I already know about you

[Guest bernard]

hi there, i was accepted to university college of dublin in february. the letter was dated feb 8, 2002. i had to send approx. $4500 canadian to them by march 1, 2001 or they were going to offer my spot to someone else. pressure tactics. i swallowed the pill, and payed it. i'm from nova scotia and i'm still waiting to hear from dal, but i'm totally stoked about ireland.

 

is anyone else in the same boat as me?

 

also, i'm not worried about being able to practice in canada, i checked out all the caRMS requirements and stuff and i'm pretty confident that they'll let me back in. if anyone has thoughts different then mine, please respond.

[Guest bernard]

i found all my information about the irish med schools at this address:

 

http://www.atlanticbridge.com

[Guest Ian Wong]

Hi Bernard,

 

I'd just check out this link first, and then follow it to the CaRMS website:

 

pub44.ezboard.com/fpremed101frm21.showMessage?topicID=6.topic

www.carms.ca/policies/policy_index.htm#Eligibility

 

The relevant part of the CaRMS URL is the following: "A single match in two iterations will take place. The first iteration will include only graduates of Canadian medical schools who have had no previous post-M.D. clinical training."

 

There have been reports on the internet where people are reporting that Canadians who went to the US for med school were still able to apply for the first round of the CaRMS match, but I haven't seen anything definite, nor in paper for that statement, while the above CaRMS document seems pretty explicit. I think you should definitely try to investigate this point further; if you intend to do a residency in Canada, and the above CaRMS statement holds true, then you will be UNABLE to apply for a Canadian residency until the second round, after all the Canadian med school graduates have had a chance at each residency spot. That would apply if you graduated from an Irish med school.

 

This would basically mean that you get the left-overs of the match, which are the less competitive specialties, usually in the less competitive living areas. There seems to be a lawsuit brewing in Manitoba right now with international medical graduates fighting for the right to apply in the first round of CaRMS, but nothing has come of that yet. If you aren't interested in a residency spot in Canada, then the above isn't of much interest to you.

 

Nonetheless, congratulations on your acceptance! It's a really great feeling to open that envelope.

 

Ian

UBC, Med 3

[Guest Ross]

I was accepted to UCD too. I've got to fork over the deposit by April 12, ouch. I'm also waiting for a Canadian school (UBC), but won't know by April 12.

I'm pretty stoked about Ireland also. If I don't make UBC then I'll be there, for sure.

[Guest Steve]

Hey there

I was just wondering how are you paying for it and what kind of tuition payments are you looking at? Finally I was wondering what kind of loans are available to Canadians.

 

Thanks alot Ross, in any case I wish you the best for the future.

 

Take Care

Steve

[Guest Canbozo]

I got accepted to UCD too! The deadline is also this Friday (April 12) to pay 3000+ Euro (4500 Canadian).

 

This is a hefty amount. But I guess I got no choice as I have to sit and wait for Calgary and U of Alberta.

 

Ian, I got a question for you. What are the requirements to obtain medical licensure in BC? (and also Alberta if you know by any chance) If I graduated from UCD in Ireland and later on embarked on a year of residency, say, in Ireland, England, or even my native India, and completed all the tests like the MCCQE, would that be enough?

 

Thanks.

[Guest Ross]

Steve: actually, I am fortunate enough to have dual US-Canadian citizenship and so I'm going for Stafford loans. These are federal loans open only to US citizens. However, Atlantic Bridge sent me the CanHelp brochure which looked to be similar. I'd be going with that if I wasn't a US citizen.

[Guest Ian Wong]

Canbozo,

 

I don't know. You would under the current rules be at a heavy disadvantage for getting a Canadian residency for specialty training (although there is that Manitoba lawsuit which could reverse all that by the time you're done med school). If you were already trained in a specialty, I don't know what hoops you'd need to pass to practice in Canada. Certainly they wouldn't just be your MCCQE exams, as you also need certification by the Royal College in whatever specialty you are at; you may need certain requirements to be satisfied in order to write those exams, and I don't know whether a foreign residency suffices. I know of many doctors from China who are specialists there, but who are unable to practise medicine in Canada without re-doing a residency here.

 

I would investigate all of that further, hopefully by contacting some doctors more in the know. I don't think you should rely on my advice, which is pretty second-hand at best since I never significantly investigated the idea of going to a non-Canadian med school. Best of luck!

 

Ian

UBC, Med 3

[Guest Canbozo]

Thanks Ian, you are the man!

 

I guess I will ask directly the medical licensure bodies in BC and Alberta about my situation.

 

I forgot where I saw this info but I know many docs in Vancouver were trained in South Africa and emigrated to BC in the 80s. They were allowed to practice in BC with their South Africa medical degrees and trainings. (I presume they did their residencies in South Africa, not Canada). I guess regulations might be more lax back then.

 

Ian if you know any docs who are from SA, may you please ask them if this is true? Have the laws been changing since then?

[Guest Ian Wong]

I believe South Africa is and was targeted because their licensing meets the Royal College requirements. Like you mentioned, I think checking directly with those authorities is your best move. If you can then report back here, you could be helping out a lot of your peers in the process!

 

Ian

UBC, Med 3

[Guest 6ajb3]

hi Steve,

 

I just was accepted at Trinity College Dublin (TCD-which is actually just a few blocks away from UCD!) and am totally stoked as I know a bunch of people from Queen's who are in meds at UCD and love it. (Although I'm still waiting on U of T !)Had to send a heap of cash pretty darn quick as well.

 

I looked into the Educaid loans for Canadians (through first Union Bank, US) and though I will end up paying through the nose (worth it mind you) it is my only recourse. ok so here's the short version:

 

It's an unsecured loan meaning as long as you have good credit, you can get up to 25K US$ (yes US!!) as a Canadian and on your own signature-no assets needed. If you need more, you can get the full cost of living/tuition (i think up to 40K US$with a cosigner (Canadian or American). The catch is since it is unsecured, you'll be charged a 7-8.5% guarantee fee (which I've been told is applied b/c it is unsecured and this insures it).

 

The other thing is you need to re-apply every year which can be nerve wracking but I was also informed by the guys at the Atlantic Bridge Program (which by the way is of tremendous help when you need, they are sooo nice...they put up with all my questions!) that once in medicine, it is in their best interest to keep funding you as you are more inclined to pay back the loan as a medical doctor than as a Uni drop out for lack of money! Which makes sense right?

 

So you end up borrowing 25 000$US/yr for 5 years, no biggy- ok maybe a little biggy-Just be prepped to pay approx 1000$US/month for 25 years after you graduate...which in my opinion is worth it, through the nose or otherwise, and just the cost of doing business...and you end up doing something that makes you feel great. If you didn't want it this badly, Ireland would have been out of the picture long ago!

 

OK, for the longer version check out www.educaid.com/cg/cgcanhelpu.htm

(But if you've applied through the Atlantic Bridge Program, they'll be sending you a package in the mail with your acceptance letter...I don't care if it is Ireland not Canada, getting that acceptance letter is pretty darn sweet).

 

I also looked into Canadian options before hand. The Royal Bank of Canada for instance will guarantee $35 000CAN a year (if you need more, then apply for more, they'll sit down with you to figure out exactly what your needs are). This is a line of credit so use what you need and forget the rest. BUT you need a Canadian cosigner with good credit and real estate property basically to secure the loan (Since i'm on my own I had to go with educaid). I figured cost of living/tuition/small life 45K Can/yr....cough/hack/wheeze...but yes worth it !

 

And lastly, or firstly, whatever...look into your province for government student loans. You can apply for Canada Student Loans (and get about 5000-6000$Can).

www.hrdc-drhc.gc.ca/student_loans/

but if you're from Quebec you-can-forget-about-it, they won't give you anything for medicine outside Canada (I know that too, cuz i'm from Quebec).

 

ok so that was a mouth full! But there you have it.

 

good luck,

Alyson

[Guest RAK2005]

With an e-mail address like that Alyson, you must be a grad student at Queen's... Did you TA meds Anatomy?

 

PS -Congrats on TCD acceptance. I've got a old high school buddy there and he is loving every minute.

[Guest 6ajb3]

Hey RAK2005 !

 

just defended actually in January ! I didn't T.A. meds anat but took the course in 2000. I was however a suspect in the halloween prank you may have been privy to last October. I TAd the "other" undergrad medswannabecourse (They'd hate me right now, but hey, i took that one too!).... And now it's alllllllllllll coming together.

[Guest Steve]

I really appreciate your advice and input. It is really helpful. I wish you the absolute best for the future. I was wondering what your story is and how you ended up deciding on ireland. Secondly do you know anything about the Carms match with regards to irish grads from Canada. Thanks again you have been a very big help 6ajb3.

 

 

Thanks

Steve

[Guest RAK2005]

I am blanking on the Halloween prank (was it in the anatomy lab, or just in Botterell ?). Anyways congrats again, and I'm sure you'll be happy to move on past good ole Anat and Cell Bio.

[Guest Ross]

Has anyone looked into curriculum at dublin schools? I looked a bit, looks kind of the same I guess.

Anyone know if we can do rotations here in Canada? I imagine it might have to be during time off. Also wonder when we'd be able to start them. Probably summer after our 3rd year (of 5)?

[Guest MindsWill]

Greetings everyone... Hmm, for those of you who have applied to The Royal College of Surgeons of Ireland [RCSI] - Have you heard anything back from them? The status of our application, any of you have a clue as to when we should expect a reply back from them.

 

Hoping to hear from you, soon!

-Godbless-

 

PS: If you have applied to RCSI, I would appreciate if you can get intouch via email with me at: mindswill@yahoo.com Its easy to experience joy or pain if there are many in the same situation...

[Guest Ray]

Hi, I'm am a senior student in high school, and I am considering going to US for undergraduate study. In that case, can I still apply to Canadian Med schools after 4 years, and be considered as Canadian student? Or would I be considered as international students? For people in medical school, are there a lot of people who do this? Thanks so much for helping me out!