Guest Blackbird15 Posted April 5, 2003 Report Share Posted April 5, 2003 Hi there, It seems as though we have similar interests. I'm also interested in doing public health along with medicine. The program that you've been admitted to, does it lead to an MPH or an MSc? I was under the impression that very few schools in Canada offered an MPH, and definitely not U of T. In any case, I was hoping to do my MPH after med school. However, if I don't get in to meds this year, I may have to rearrange my priorities. I'm already a year out of school (took the year off to do some international health work) and I'm not getting any younger! I'd like to hear a bit about your interests in terms of how you want to balance medicine and public health... Blackbird flying into the light of a dark, black night... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cheech10 Posted April 6, 2003 Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 The Department of Public Health Sciences offers 2 degree programs, a research-based MSc, and a course-based MHSc (probably similar to the MPH elsewhere). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kirsteen Posted April 6, 2003 Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 Hi there, Yikes, I've been majorly out of the loop on the board, here, due to school demands of late so I'm spending a wee bit of today trying to catch up . I apologize for not being able to get back to you guys with some responses a little more rapidly. Dmac: you mentioned that you're interested in public/population health, but do you have an idea of which aspects of these broad areas intrigue you? You mentioned your pharmacology background--have you thought of looking into the field of pharmacoepidemiology? Unfortunately, UofT does not offer any courses in this hot and budding field, but McGill has an excellent program. (In case it may be an option for you, they are offering a few of their Pharmacoepi courses this summer (they are ~1 week long), although at this point they cannot be taken for credit, but for interest only). I don't see why you wouldn't have a shot at the UofT Epi program from what you've mentioned. One of the prime selection factors at UofT, aside from the requisite marks, letters of reference, etc., is knowing in advance the area in which you would like to pursue your M.Sc. research. This can be demonstrated by finding a field, project and supervisor with whom you can conduct your research prior to applying. Blackbird15: that's one of my favourite songs! Cheers. As to MPH, you're absolutely correct; I don't believe there are any MPH programs up here. Essentially it is the U.S. schools that offer the MPH degree and I believe they consider it to be a terminal degree of sorts, i.e., it's directed at folks who will not be continuing on to pursue PhDs (although some U.S. schools do offer DPH degrees). The above post is bang on: UofT does offer a MHSc. degree which is similar to the M.Sc., but different: 1) no thesis is required; instead you complete a practicum; 2) current MHSc. students have a larger courseload than us M.Sc. students (and ours is already pretty beefy at 8 half-courses, a couple of which are true beezers); 3) I believe that MHSc. students generally do not have the option of continuing on to complete a PhD; 4) generally the MHSc. students have few, if any, funding opportunities available to them compared to us hard-core research folks. If you have any other questions, please do ask away. Aside from sniffing around up here, I'm beginning to investigate the School of Public Health offerings south of the border and there are a lot of amazing options out there for folks with interests that lie in public/population health and epidemiology. ...and besides, we seem to be a hot bunch now that we're dealing with the naughty SARS epidemic. Cheers, Kirsteen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sar Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 I noticed everyone talking about masters programs in public health....its a great idea! I actually have a masters in Health Promotion and Public Health and I really enjoyed it. Try looking at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine (where i went). It is in england and they offer scholarships for international sutdents...great school with amazing international reputation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Blackbird15 Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hey Kristeen, blackbird is (obviously) one of my favorite songs too... John is often thought of as the better songwriter, but I always had a soft spot for Paul... I was curious as to how you and Tappety tap wanted to combine medicine and public health. The combination of the two really appeals to me, but I have yet to meet a physician that practices both clinical medicine and public health. You're right about MPH versus MHSc; MPH is much less research-based and 'academic' than an MHSc or MSc. My understanding is that it's more geared toward policy development and implementation than research. Sar, thanks for the tip about the London School of Hygiene! I know of them and have heard that there one of the top in the world. How did you manage the cost, though? Blackbird taking these broken wings and learning to fly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bj Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hi sar, I have always been curious about the London school of hygiene and tropical medicine. To add to blackbird's question about cost: How did you get in? I was under the impression that it was almost unattainable in terms of gpa, etc. requirements. I would love to hear otherwise though! BJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sar Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Bj and blackbird15, It was a bit expensive living and studying in london at the london school of hygiene and tropical medicine....but there are a few things that make it a bargin for the quality of masters degree you get. 1. the program is only 1 year and you only need to be in london for 8 months of the year (I came home to toronto to write my thesis) 2. you can find great residences for students wich are not that expensive (relative for London) and be living in the centre of the city ( a once in a lifetime opportunity!) 3. There are a number of scholarships through the school and other organisations....i think OSAP will give you money to study abroad! Also, it is competitive to get into the school....but not imposible.....always worth a try! Hope this helps....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tappety tap Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hey Blackbird! Well to be honest, I'm not sure yet exactly how all this will pan out but there are definitely posts at Health Canada for MD's specializing in public health. I don't see why I can't have a practice going and be a consultant for the gov't or work in research with a university. I have a psychology background and am very interested in behavioural medicine (how our beh affects our health and vice versa) I would love to get involved in public education about the health risks associated with different behaviours and ways to change those behaviours. I am particularly interested in smoking since I am currently watching my grandfather (who is a severe chain smoker) suffer with pretty much every smoking-related respiratory ailment, most recently lung cancer, albeit a slow growing variety. I might get involved with a project in TO targeting teens via the web. If you think about it, nobody really starts smoking past the age of say 25 so young adults is really the target age to try to reduce smoking in our society. Anyways, what are your thoughts/interests? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tirisa Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hi Tappety tap, Indeed, behavioural medicine is incredibly interesting, and the study that you're hoping to get involved in certainly could have important implications for the future. From what I understand, there has been very little research done on the effectiveness of using the internet for health education. However, one of my colleagues (who is super knowledgable about the stages of change theory) is doing an RCT on the internet and diet for her PhD dissertation, to determine if internet-based nutritional and health education resources have any effect on weight loss (based on waist circumference, primarily). If you're interested in picking her brain about internet-based health education, or stages of change theory, let me know and I can put you into contact with her. This has been a great discussion, by the way, on Msc's and Mph's... great to see so many people interested in epi and public health. I think an epi or public health degree is the perfect complement to an MD (or vice versa), since you would have a comprehensive understanding of dx and tx of illness in the individual in order to achieve their health as well as an understanding of the determinants of illness in the population, in order to achieve health in the population. (yikes, not sure if that made sense... ). :b Anyway, Epi and Mph degrees are incredibly broad, but that what makes us graduates sooo in demand. Cheers, Tirisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Blackbird15 Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hey Tirisa, tappety tap and Kristeen, I thought I was part of a very small minority of people interested in both medicine and public health. It's so interesting to hear from others with the same plans! My area of interest is working with disadvantaged populations. I've done some work with immigrants and refugees and in the area of international health. My (very brief) work in these areas have shown me how little of health and illness has to do with biology and pathology, and how much of it is the result of the social, economic, and even political context of the individual and population. I would like to fuse all of these interests with a practice in Family Medicine. Not entirely sure how to do that yet! So far, my plan is to work in a community health centre or a CLSC (it's a Quebec thing). Community health centres make an effort to run social and health promotion programs targetted toward disadvantaged populations (or they try to; budgetary issues (that I can't say I completely understand) have lead to a stagnation in the expansion of community health centres in Canada, and a reprioritization away from community-based health and health promotion in CLSCs, which are becoming more and more like walk-in clinics.) In any case, working in a community health centre would allow me to both practice and run community-based programs targeting specific populations. As for my interest in international health, I would like to fit it in somewhere, but it may be limited to more academic stuff (attending conferences, being a part of IH physician groups) at the beginning of my career. Later on, I would like to become more actively involved in developing and implementing primary health care initiatives in less developed areas... I think I'll really need to find a mentor in med school who can steer me in the right path! take care and hope to hear more from all of you! Blackbird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tappety tap Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hey B-Bird!! That sounds really great. There is tons you can get involved with. At this stage, I wouldnt worry that much because I have noticed throughout my life that things tend to fall into place at the right time...not to mention your plan can change once you get into med school. Have you ever heard of medecins sans frontieres or doctors without borders? They do a lot of work in international health in developing countries. Maybe you could get in touch with a doc involved in that organization....they do amazing things! good luck!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tirisa Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hey Blackbird, I apologize that I don't really know much about your background (where you are or what you're currently doing), but whatever school you're at, find out if there is an International Health office/institute/dept there. If not, ask around in the epi or medicine departments to see if there are any profs who do work in IH. I came to Queen's in '99 for my MSc in Epi degree, and within six months, I was already working for a CIDA-funded project in Nicaragua, Honduras, and El Salvador, working with land mine survivors. I'm just finishing up my work there (just had my last trip south :( ). But when I finished my MSc, I looked specifically for IH opportunities (and there are millions around), and got involved with another CIDA-funded project, ... a Family Medicine project in Bosnia-Herzegovina. If there are opportunities for IH work in a small city like Kingston, there may also be opportunities wherever you are. What's more, if you want to go abroad, then the possibilities really are endless. For an interesting short-term project ('cause MSF and other orgs are usually longer term) check the CPHA website for info on their immunization program. Interesting stuff. Working with refugees and immigrants is a whole other aspect of IH, and you've hit the nail on the head that most of their health issues are related to socio-economic factors. Yikes... I'd love to continue this discussion, but I gotta run. Good luck and let me know if you have other IH questions. Oh, and if you are in TO (and you might have seen an earlier thread on this) definitely go to the U of T Global Health Research conference... I'm sure it would be a great intro to your career. Cheers, Tirisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kirsteen Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 Hi guys, Wow, quite the merry discussion. There are many, many opportunities to marry epidemiology/public/community health and medicine. In fact, in most of my courses are physicians from all areas: plenty of cardiologists, at least 3 obs/gyn folk, a few surgeons (2 paediatric heart, 1 general and 1 GI), at least 1 psychiatrist, 1 derm and a bunch of family docs. They all seem to there for different reasons and seem to have different research interests. There are also plenty of profs who are trained in both areas and who practice in both, e.g., we have one professor who is a family doctor (serving rural areas) but who is also a pro in demography and survival analysis. He practices medicine for a couple of weeks per month then works at one of the big research institutes at one of the TO hospitals conducting population-based research in areas such as diabetes and heart disease. There are other physicians who have decided to focus their research in areas such as health care resource utilization, decision-making, health care technology (e.g., internet-based initiatives), health care policy. You name it, it can be studied under this huge umbrella that is epidemiology. I hope that helps to provide some evidence that these two fields dovetail nicely. Tappety tap, if it's tobacco that interests you, I'd highly recommend getting in touch with the Tobacco group at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health (CAMH). Two of my classmates work in that group and are studying different aspects of tobacco-related behaviours and policy. They're both enjoying their experiences there. Cheers, Kirsteen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Blackbird15 Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 Hi all, this is all very informative! Tappety tap, I know of MSF and I am somewhat familiar with their work, though I'm not sure if that kind of high stress relief work is for me... Tirisa, you seem to have a fairly extensive background in IH. Are you at U of T? I know they have a Centre for INternatonal Health and a fairly active International Health student group. In answer to your question about my background, I have done some work overseas this year as a part of a CIDA-funded internship and found it a very powerful experience. Kristeen, where I used to work (in the Dept of family med at my university), there were also many academic physicians with background in research in many of the areas that you talked about. take care, Blackbird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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