globy321 Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Hey guys.Does anyone know do family doctors in Ontario get paid by the hour or do they get paid monthly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I hope it's not monthly... I've heard of salaried, hourly, per capita, and fee-for-service models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I hope it's not monthly... I've heard of salaried, hourly, per capita, and fee-for-service models. That's the family doctor teams have been saying as well in all their presenations. The newer fee for service models seem particularly popular lately, and there has been a number of advances in family doctor pay lately as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sticky1 Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 How much does a newly graduate family doctor take home in Ontario? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moo Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I've answered this question many times before. There are different pay structures in Ontario and the rest of Canada. The most popular still is fee for service. You see a patient, you get paid a set amount. You perform a procedure, you get paid a certain amount. I'm unsure of the system in Ontario but I know there are different ways of reimbursement. Capitation, block funding, etc. I think FFS is still the most popular way of reimbursement though. Here in BC, the harder you work, the more you make. I know family docs who bill 500-700K a year, take home after expenses about 400K+. I personally billed about 350K last year (first year out of residency), take home after expenses but before taxes about 280K. Even as a resident again, I am pulling in over 20K a month (including my residency salary) after expenses, before taxes while moonlighting. Some of my lazier colleagues bill a lot less. I know someone who works just as much as I do but only billed about 130K last year (all this info is available online, google BC MSP blue book). Remember, however, that what's online is only MSP billings. This doesn't include other private billings, ICBC (in BC), WCB, lawyer letters, form fees, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostintime Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 How were your hours moo when you billed 350k? Did you take vacation or any days off? What would be the main reason someone who works similar hours but bills less? They like to spend more time with a patient or slower doing paper work or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 We need to sticky your posts, moo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moo Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 How were your hours moo when you billed 350k? Did you take vacation or any days off? What would be the main reason someone who works similar hours but bills less? They like to spend more time with a patient or slower doing paper work or something? I took the standard 4 weeks vacation and had one day off a week. Right now, I don't take any days off (well I have half days off here and there when I'm not in class but I'm usually doing homework; that is if you count going to class to be work, but I generally think going to class is a lot less stressful than working). People can bill less but still work the same amount if they're slower, or they see less people but spend longer time with them, etc. Thats not to say that being slow/spending more time with patients makes you a better doctor. My patients keep telling me they like me because I listen to them and explain things to them. How do I do it so fast? It's called being efficient. I chart on my computer while the patient is in the room (other docs spend an extra hour charting after the day, or spend an extra 5 minutes charting after the patient has left the room). You take the extra time to spend with those who need it (I spent 40 minutes with the last patient today, because she needed it. Other patients who come in for refills or something simple, you do your quick check of labs, BP, physical exam, whatever and you can get them out in 2-3 minutes). You always end a visit with "is there anything else I can do for you or do you have any further questions?" Patients get satisfied, they come back (and you end up getting o know them and their history) and you get more efficient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviathan Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Kinda a random question, moo, but as a new grad who probably isn't quite so technophobic as the older docs, do you prefer EMR, or is paper charting still something you'd rather have? Not that I'd have any idea how efficient either one is, but after hanging out with an FP in a clinic with EMR, I at least thought that setup was really organized and fun to use. It was awesome how she was able to pull up patient records, lab results and history in an organized file right while we were all in the exam room together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
future_doc Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 b u m p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moo Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Kinda a random question, moo, but as a new grad who probably isn't quite so technophobic as the older docs, do you prefer EMR, or is paper charting still something you'd rather have? Not that I'd have any idea how efficient either one is, but after hanging out with an FP in a clinic with EMR, I at least thought that setup was really organized and fun to use. It was awesome how she was able to pull up patient records, lab results and history in an organized file right while we were all in the exam room together. When I trained in the US, everything was EMR. From rounding on the wards (the senior resident would have her laptop and just type out orders as we rounded), to charting on the wards, in the clinic, pretty much every rotation except emerg was EMR-based (this was 04-06). In the clinic, we would just simply fax prescriptions to the patient's pharmacy--avoids mistakes/alterations by the patient. So when I came back to Canada it was quite a shock to see everything still be paper based. I remember in clinic, I was fumbling through, trying to find the right lab result/xray report. Refilling prescriptions was a pain. Reading consult notes in the hospital was the worst. Everything was so inefficient here. So when I started I knew I needed to work in an EMR based clinic. I understand why physicians don't want to change. After all, old habits die hard. But I can tell you that any pain in the short term will be balanced by long-term gain with an EMR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviathan Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Haha good to know. I heard the government is paying incentive $$$ to help setup EMR in clinics now, so hopefully that will be all in place by the time I get there! Nobody wants to try and read my awful handwriting, anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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