tooty Posted February 1, 2011 Report Share Posted February 1, 2011 If radiologists are busy interpreting images, what can the clerks do to learn or contribute? Do any schools give the clerks restricted pacs access and so they can look at some images? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-Stark Posted February 1, 2011 Report Share Posted February 1, 2011 We definitely have unrestricted Pax access ("unlimited team"), but I didn't do a whole lot on my radiology elective. It depended on the staff I was with, but mostly they just explained what they were looking at, if anything. I did dictate one CT head but that's about the extent of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted February 1, 2011 Report Share Posted February 1, 2011 Sweet F*** All. That's what you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tooty Posted February 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2011 We definitely have unrestricted Pax access ("unlimited team"), but I didn't do a whole lot on my radiology elective. It depended on the staff I was with, but mostly they just explained what they were looking at, if anything. I did dictate one CT head but that's about the extent of it. Would they let you download the dicom files to your laptop and try your best to point out all the findings? I think ImageJ can load dicom files. Your preceptor can then go over your notes with you and point out what you missed. I imagine that that would be a great way to learn. Sweet F*** All. That's what you do. lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 See my post here: http://www.premed101.com/forums/showthread.php?p=531908#post531908 Also, as brooksbane alludes, it varies a bit according to whether you are potentially interested in a radiology career or not. Basically, you can learn by being keen, paying attention, reading, and asking questions. Generally, there isn't much you can contribute except for looking up information in the electronic medical record or on Google. If there is a free workstation, I do give students the opportunity to log into PACS so they have a chance to go through studies on their own before reviewing them with staff. However, the availability of workstations is sometimes a limiting factor. That being said, if your goal is to learn to interpret images, there is a *ton* of online resource material, some of which is set up to simulate looking at a case on PACS. Check out http://www.radiologyeducation.com. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madz25 Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 sit. stay quiet (but interested at the same time). dont be annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satsuma Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 I guess it depends on your school Where I did mine, we had daily modules to go through. So in the morning we would pick up a pile of images and go through them, and answer a list of questions about these images on our own. Then in the afternoon we would touch base with the radiologist on and go through our answers. We could go observe whatever we wanted...biopsies, barium studies etc. But never do you have any responsibility or feel useful in anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 sit. stay quiet (but interested at the same time). dont be annoying. And for God's sake, don't slow down the billing process. Actual quote from another specialty's attending when I told him I was on radiology the next week. "The most important thing to remember is to avoid slowing down the billing. They don't like that". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-Stark Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 Radiology is the only service I've ever been on where we were told explicitly that certain staff do not take medical students (as if sitting quietly and watching was a great imposition). Half the time they were happy to explain and teach and the other half they barely acknowledged that you were there. And, really, for me it's just too removed from patient care/interaction, and I prefer diagnosis by Hx and Px and considering investigations and management going forward. Happy to rely on the incredibly knowledgeable radiologists for their expertise, but I wouldn't want their job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 And for God's sake, don't slow down the billing process. Or forget to bring back the sheet stamped with the patient's PIN when you see a consult But yes, many radiology electives could stand to be more interactive for students. I wonder how Satsuma found their experience working through modules? If there is ever a good reason for staying quiet in the reading room, it's that distractions lead to mistakes in dictations.. the same reason not to ask questions during the most difficult part of a surgery. But it shouldn't be hard to identify the inopportune moments, and I think it's important for students who are interested to have the opportunity to learn... it helps if you make your interest known, and seek out someone who likes teaching and isn't overloaded with work. However, given the amount of online resources, being in the department is more of an opportunity to see what actually happens behind the scenes when you send your patient for an imaging study. Most people here are quite willing to spend some time chatting with students. Depends where you go though. To be fair, if someone does not accept students, your time is probably better spent elsewhere anyway. (I've heard of internal medicine teams converted to non-teaching teams for similar reasons). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itimebomb2 Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 Radiology is a funny thing... clerks are a massive burden. Even residents really don't provide much of a service since attendings have to go through and approve every single thing they do. It's the one residency where residents actually slow down the attendings, rather than helping them. Kind of funny actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satsuma Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 I wonder how Satsuma found their experience working through modules? I enjoyed it. Was good learning, since our in class teaching of radiology was pretty bad. It was helpful that there was a visiting senior student on at the same time as me who knew the basics and was willing to teach me as I went through my modules. The afternoons were fairly dull...you can only observe so many barium swallows and biopsies! But thankfully the modules had let me feel like my week was worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted February 3, 2011 Report Share Posted February 3, 2011 Cool, thanks for the feedback. Yes, residents tend to slow down the staff radiologists.. night call is pretty much the main exception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfette Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Honestly, you don't do much. A really good staff will point out things as they go (slowing them down). A really, really good staff might let you look at a list of CXR's and then review them with you. There are generally teaching files/modules to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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